Rotella T vs Synthetic???

[PAYCHECK]

When i reached 25000 i wen't to delo 400 synth. 5/40. I am here where it is cold and i use the synth 5/40 for that and other reasons. Before that i used the delo 400 non-synthetic till the motor was broken in. MGM, i thought your lengthly reply very amusing, some people jus't have no sense of humor!

 

[fj40charles]

You should use whatever you feel comfortable with. Personally, I use Amsoil 75-140 synthetic lube in the diffs and mobil 1 trans fluild in the transfer case. I run Rotella T in the engine for the fine aroma it puts out after the change.



Do you remember the 1,000,000 mile Dodge? I believe he said he used Rotella T and changed at 5K intervals.



I believe you can get 500,000+ miles on the motor running dino oil easily. I cannot justify the cost of Amsoil for engine oil and I don't particulary care for the 25K drain intervals.



My 2 cents...



Charles

 

[amsoilman]

Mike Ellis,

Some of the Manufacrures of Automobiles do infact recommend synthetics, Dodge included! Go look at the High performance "Viper". Also GM's Corvette.

They specificly want sunthetics in the engines. BTW, they do come factory filled with synthetic oil. I think it is Mobil 1, but not sure.



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[HC]

Originally posted by WCrawford

I have 40K miles on my 2000 2500 Automatic. I use Rotella T and chane oil and filter every 5-6K miles (I tow a TT). Is there any advantage to going to synthetic lubricant (Amsoil, Mobil 1 etc)? Can't decide if I want to switch. Considering changing synthetic @15K miles and filter @7. 5K. How about synthetic Transmission fluid and rear end lube. Any feed back, opinions? Thanks

Here's a few opinions (sprinkled with a few facts):

1) You're towing, and must care about vehicle life or you wouldn't ask these questions. If you don't have one already, get a pyro. When pulling loads, you'll know if you need to back off the throttle, and you'd be surprized how long you need to idle for turbo cooldown when you've been really working the engine. Save that turbo!

2) You mentioned Mobil 1 as a possible option. Mobil 1 is not rated for heavy duty diesels like ours; you want to look for another product called "Delvac 1", also made by Mobil. Don't be confused; Mobil makes "Delvac 1300" (non-synthetic), Delvac 1 (synthetic for HD diesels), and Mobil 1 (synthetic for gassers and some light diesels).

3) Opinion: I have come to believe that having a good bypass filter is extremely important if you are going to extend the drain intervals. So is doing oil analysis.

4) I think the owners manual recommends a synthetic in the rear end for towing, in a 75W(?)-140 weight. Check and see. For your application, I think you HAVE to use a synthetic to meet the manufacturer's recommendation.

5) With either your Rotella, or synthetic, your engine will outlast the rest of your truck. By the time you balance the costs of synthetic plus analysis, with fewer changes, the costs will be in the same general ballpark, +/- depending on what intervals you select. Your decision should hinge on side issues, like, do you want/need better cold weather starts when no plug in is available? How many miles per month do you typically drive? How easy is it for you to get the oil changed, and how often would you have to do it? Do you sometimes get impatient and shut down without cooling the turbo enough? (the list goes on... )

 

[Hammer]

Ah yes,,Gotta love the hogwash comment,,That the best you can do Don,,Doing my home work here,see you may be surprised what some of us have learned lately,,Are you SURE you are/were a product user of the product you so avidly try to destroy??,,All the man wanted here was an honest opinion and once again you take it completely off his course by playing this broken record again,,Leave it alone?fine with me,you have no argument better than "highly doubt it",,Ship is a sinking Don,too may holes from torpedo hits,you prepared to ride her out???

 

[Don M]

Hammer,



Huh? your last post was difficult to understand. Are you saying I did not use Amsoil? Are you saying that the transfer case has to be filled with synthetic? Are you saying it is filled with synthetic from the factory?



If you are still curious I did use Amsoil. I actually hace not removed it from the transfer case yet. Its long gone from the engine and guess what? The leaks are slowing down.

Aa far as the manufacturer asking anyone to use synthetic ATF in the transfer case, I can tell ya it aint in my manual.

Bottom line is you are incorrect about the transfer case ATF topic.

Second I did use Amsoil and still have it in my transfer case.

The aprt about DC filling the transfer case with synthetic from the factory, I still hardly doubt it.

You may have been behind the wheel too long this trip. Get some sleep and try again.



Don~

 

[Randy J]

Don M,

Don't know you from Adam, but can tell you I wouldn't put a lot of weight behind your comments. WCrawford asked a legitimate question, and nearly everyone, except for you, responded in a friendly, "here's some pluses, here's some minuses", tone. You simply attacked a product, and without facts to back it up. If you don't like Amsoil, or any other synthetic for that manor, don't use it. It's that simple. But, like it or not, there are some benefits to synthetics, as spelled out in posts above. Otherwise manufacturer's would not recommend synthetics in some of their most expensive vehicles, i. e. Corvette, Porsche, etc. It's true the Cummins will probably outlast the rest of the truck, as pointed out in several posts, even with conventional oil. But it is also proven a good quality synthetic oil can reduce wear, improve fuel mileage, and generally be better for your engine. And there's a reason Dodge tells you to use a synthetic in the rear axle if pulling heavy loads. What is going to cause the most wear to an axle? Pulling heavy loads. WCrawford's question was about synthetics in general, and I, among others answered him in general - I never mentioned Amsoil in my post, although that's what I use. You seem to have a personal vendetta against Amsoil. If it doesn't work for you, don't use it. Share your experiences, but quit bashing the product that so many others have proven works great. It makes you seem petty and generally uninformed!

I for one have to say I'm embarrassed about the way this has gone. I hope you won't get turned off to the TDR by this thread WCrawford. Most of the guys are pretty easy going, most of the time. Hope you got your question answered.

 

[Wiredawg]

I use Rotella

WCrawford:



I use Rotella-T every 5,000 miles. I'm old-fashioned about changing fluids and have had great success with this change interval. I like using Rotella because I can get it at Wal-Mart and at truck stops. I've thought about using synthetics, but just haven't made the jump.



I may only get 400,000 miles using Rotella, but that's the breaks.





Bottom line: you'll find lots of opinions here and hopefully, it will help you decide what's best for you.



Take care and Happy Trails,



Wiredawg

 

[Don M]

Randy,



If you have time in the middle of March on the 16th to be exact. Please come to the dyno event in Dallas. Actually it is in Lewisville. Just a bit North of the Dallas area.

From San Antonio its prolly about 4. 5 hours. I would love to share with you my experiences with Amsoil and why I have a negative outlook on it.

I know the posts seem abrasive. It's not the first time someone has asked me to pipe down. I cant get anywhere by complaining sooo, I am going to calm down on the product.

I actually like synthetics over most conventional oils and have used both with varying degrees of success. I do have a good argument IMO that Amsoil is not API cetified. Will it kill your warranty? I actually have no proof that it will. I think it depends on the individual relationship each fella has with his dealer.



BTW, I do run synthetics in my trucks axle. The trans has a hydro-finished oil and the transfer case still has Amsoil.



I do not want to start stuff with anyone. MGM, Hammer, lshultz, etc and myself fight over oil all the time. Its not on a personal level on this side. I frequently PM MGM and others about oil topics.

Funny thing is... I have never learned more until I started popin off here about oils.

Just last week a guy jumped all over me about the oil filter I was using. I had no idea the filter was a warranty voiding item or that they sometimes came apart and smoked engines. It took several posts about oil to get it in the open. I have since yanked the WIX off and gone back to the old Fleetguard I used for years.



If you get out in the open with me, face to face. You may walk away with a different opinion about me.



Don~

 

[Jim Ross]

WCrawford: Welcome aboard and like they say, "fasten your seat belt!"

Since I didn't see an answer to your ATF question, I'll add my $. 02 worth. Definitely switch to synthetic ATF in your truck. I've made the switch in several trucks (and cars) over the years and the synthetic ATF runs cooler (which means good things for an automatic trans!) and improves (again, in my 'opinion') the feel of the shifting.

I now await the nay sayers' "flames"!

 

[LSMITH]

I use synthetics in both diffs on my truck. I have proof that there is less friction too, my rear diff temp was 180-190 during a week of checking it at both ends of a 45 mile commute and after Mobil 1 75W-90 went in it dropped to 155-160 with nearly identical weather for the two weeks of testing. The non-synthetic oil in my test was Castrol 75-90. I picked up about 1 MPG on my commute too after the change. I highly recommend good quality synthetics for the axles in these trucks towing or not. I am going to put Mobil 1 5w-30 in the transfer case soon as well. I know it calls for ATF, and I will assume the consequences of using motor oil in it. I know several people that have done it for over 100K miles on their CTD with no problems and consistent heavy towing. I will probably never use a synthetic in the engine though. I do believe that the synthetics are superior, but the cost versus gain doesn't weigh out for me in the engine. 400K miles will be more than plenty for me, I intend to run it to 300K if I keep it and Rotella or Delo will get me there with plenty left. Cold starts are overrated in my opinion as well. Even in the winters around the great lakes I have no trouble at all starting my truck, and the oil pressure comes up fast enough to suit me. I don't plug it in anymore and the oil pressure is up within a second of when it has been plugged in all night.

 

[Sled Puller]

Originally posted by Don M

Randy,





I know the posts seem abrasive. It's not the first time someone has asked me to pipe down. I cant get anywhere by complaining sooo, I am going to calm down on the product.

.







Don~

Don,

You DID get somewhere by complaining- I offered to buy your By-Pass, and gave you a contact to try to get your money back for the product, have you called her yet? Or are you saying it is more fun to complain than solve problems?



Don is a good example of why ordering a product through the internet is bad- no Dealer support.



And why in the world would you care about Wix not being on the "list"??

YOUR warranty ran out 100,000 miles ago!!!!!!!!!



It just makes no sense, that the Amsoil "ATTACKED" ALL of your seals, but everybody elses are fine. Go figure.

Looking at it from our view, don't you think it is a tad bit strange?

Gene

 

[DavidD]

Boys, Boys, Boys, Lets just say we have a difference of opinion! Some like it hot some dont so there. I have had great success with amsoil and mobil one in cars for 15 years. Some people havent but that deosnt mean tha amsoil is not a good product. Crawford, in my humble opinion I would switch to a syn. oil any brand over dino and your trans and dif case. Good luck, Dave

 

[Don M]

Gene,



Im working on getting the cash back.

I do appreciate the offer though. If Amsoil corporate wont hook me up. Ill be callin' Sheryl.

I said the complaining is done and over. No more b!tchin from me on Amsoil.

I actually have no warranty , but if the filters are coming apart, I dont want one on my engine.



Others that used Amsoil have reported leaks. One of the guys sold it too.



Don~

 

[jimnance]

DON MAKES AN EXCELLENT POINT ABOUT WARRANTY COVERAGE. HOWEVER, SINCE MOST TDR MEMBERS HAVE BOMBED THEIR TRUCKS ALREADY IT IS PROBABLY A MOOT ISSUE AS YOU MAY ALREADY FIND YOURSELF IN WARRANTY TROUBLE IF YOU HAVE A SERIOUS ENGINE PROBLEM AND DODGE/CUMMINS DECIDES TO LOOK CLOSELY.



I THINK THE IMPORTANT THING TO NOTE IS THAT AMS OIL IS NOT API CERTIFIED. IT MAY BE THE FINEST OIL IN THE WORLD, BUT I WON'T RUN IT IN MY TRUCK BECAUSE IT COSTS CONSIDERABLY MORE THAN STANDARD OIL AND I DON'T BELEIVE IN OIL CHANGE INTERVALS EXCEEDING THE MANUFACTURERS RECOMMENDATIONS.



I HAVE A TRUCKING COMPANY WITH OVER FIFTY TRUCKS, AND WE HAVE DONE QUITE WELL USING DELO OIL AND CHANGING IT AT 10,000 MILE INTERVALS. FOR THESE PARTICULAR ENGINES, THAT IS THE RECOMMENDED INTERVAL. FOR THE 5. 9 ENGINE I DON'T BELEIVE THAT THEY RECOMMEND THAT YOU EXCEED 7,500 MILES. ALSO, IMHO THE TIME BETWEEN OIL CHANGES IS JUST AS IMPORTANT AS THE MILEAGE FOR THE TYPICAL OWNER. WITH OUR TRUCKS THEY RUN EVERY DAY AN AVERAGE OF 400 MILES. THIS MEANS THE OIL HAS LESS CHANCE OF BECOMING CONTAMINATED WITH ACID PRODUCTS BETWEEN OIL CHANGES THAN THE TYPICAL OWNER DRIVEN DODGE RAM.

 

[Sled Puller]

Good! Glad to hear you are solving problems!





Now about those leaks.....

If Kenny Ford Boy ever gets the search fixed, try a search on leaks.

There will be HUNDREDS come up.



Most of them will be newer trucks, still under warranty, with factory lube leaking.



Now what do we blame those on?:--)

 

[Extreme1]

Originally posted by MGM

..... If Kenny Ford Boy ever gets the search fixed.....

MAN! You are askin' fer it now!!!:--)



Back to the topic:

If you add a bypass filter, use oil analysis at a reasonable interval and replace filters when recommended, IT IS CHEAPER TO RUN SYNTHETICS IN THE ENGINE!!!! And you don't have to spend the time changing and disposing of oil.



I used to run Rotella but then I saw the light one day when I returned from a witch hunt and tried synthetics. Now it's all I use.

 

[jimnance]

More power to you. I can see by the miles driven that you are well beyond warranty consideration.



Since the 5. 9 has a demonstrated service life which exceeds 300,000 miles you cannot prove nor disprove your theory that AMS oil is better for your engine.



With respect to cost, sure I could extend my oil drain interval considerably even with conventional oil. The difference does not begin to show until you reach engines miles exceeding 300,000 miles IMHO. The true test is when it is evaluated over say engine life of 400,000 miles over a series of engines with a complete engine tear down and inspection of wear. To my knowlege, AMS oil has not compiled that kind of data with our engines.



Go ahead and use your product and oil change interval. It's a free country. Have you considered whether this will be a positive or negative with respect to resale? For me it would be a negative, but again this is IMHO.

 

[jimnance]

Extreme 1

Come on extreme 1. You can't handle the heat?



Was just having fun with this. We all have our own opinions and this debate will rage forever, but it's fun anyway.



Oo.