Safe EGT on 3th generation and seats Q .

[M Evan]

Hi to everybody. In last TDR magazine #56 in one article on page 156 they stated that safe
EGT is up to 1500 F on Third Generation compare to 1300 F on second generation. Is that correct ? And second Q, I like to change my seat from cloth premium to leather one, but leather seats have power on both side and my are powered only on driver side. Which bring my Q. is there wiring under carpet for powering passenger side seat or is a easy to add one ? I assumne Dodge prewired all truck same way, but maybe not
m

 

[1965LONEWOLF]

I Would Like To Know About The Temp Also ,

 

[JBee]

I just pulled my interior completely out to do a stereo install and the driver/passenger seats were powered by the same harness that plugs into the drivers side seat. Check the pins on connector, it may be just a matter of adding a motorized seat and switches. I run 1450-1550 in stock mode when towing up steep hills around 45-50 mph with my trailer. I'm not quite as freaked out about it since there's nothing I can really do, except for adding bigger turbo, and I was told ATS ran a 5. 9L for 14 hours straight at 1500F with no issues on a test they ran. I would like to verify this however...

 

[Ross]

This is a HUGE issue to me. I REALLY want some answers, too. I tow constantly, and have added some slight fueling enhancements. My problem is that I exceed 1300 degrees up even the smallest hills. I have the power to top most hills without ever losing speed, however, about 5 seconds after my cruise control pulls in some throttle, the EGTs shoot up to 1400-1500 degrees! So, I have to push 'cancel' on the cruise control, and limp up the hill at 50 mph, keeping my EGTs at 1300 degrees. THIS SUCKS! I'm considering spending 1500 bucks on a turbo just so I can top a medium sized hill without feeling like I'm about to melt a piston.



I would think the only way these engines can stand significantly higher temps is if the pistons are ceramic coated. To my knowledge, they are not. Until I hear different, I'm not going to exceed 1300 degrees for more than a 15 seconds or so... .



If somebody knows anything about this, please chime in.

 

[jwilliams3]

I never go over 1700*, of course 1700* is all my gauge will read up to?

 

[TFlory]

I would like to know what DC/Cummins engineers have to say about this...

 

[blacksheep4x4]

I've hit 1600* quite a few times but just for a few seconds at a time.

 

[jjdiesel]

Issue 52, page 105: Is 1300 degrees of exhaust gas temperature as high as you'd want to go? Answer: Yes. That temperature, as measured in the exhaust manifold, would be higher inside the combustion chamber, and aluminum (the material from which the pistons are made) begins to melt at 1,400 degrees.



the discussion was about an '05 truck.

 

[Ross]

Short bursts beyond the "safe" range of 1300 are ok. I would drag race my 98 24V, and would have the pyro pegged at 1600 half-way through 3rd gear and wouldn't let up. However, this would equate to about 8 seconds in this range; not long enough to do any damage. Think about when you're warming up a piece of steel with a cutting torch. It takes a while to get red before you can squeeze the oxygen lever and start to cut... Heat transfer is not immediate, so short bursts past 1300 (or even 1500) aren't the problem, and actually, they're not what we're talking about here.



Climbing a long hill (2 miles, say) will take 2 minutes to top at 60 mph. I am not comfortable keeping by EGT's in excess of 1300 for this long.

 

[cerberusiam]

Issue 52, page 105: Is 1300 degrees of exhaust gas temperature as high as you'd want to go? Answer: Yes. That temperature, as measured in the exhaust manifold, would be higher inside the combustion chamber, and aluminum (the material from which the pistons are made) begins to melt at 1,400 degrees.



the discussion was about an '05 truck.

Actually, I think the cast pistons start melting around 1350 degrees. However, they will never see that much temp due to the cooling features.



The 1300 was a good number for the 12V and early 24V's and it could be held for 3 minutes out of 5 with a relatively small chance of damage.



Besides, when does a smart writer EVER make anything other than a safe statement? :-laf:-laf



The 1500 degrees is pretty accurate with the better piston cooling and better valves and seats. Its pretty easy to hit that number with stock fueling and a good load and the engines seem to take it quite well. I wouldn't drive it all day long there but short duration spikes should not be harmful.



Ross, what setting are you running the Smarty on? Running on SW4 mild TQmanagement, I can barely break 1400 on a 5 mile 6% grade with a decent load at 70 mph. Either you are towing a huge load or something is very wrong.

 

[bighornram]

I could hit 1300 easily pulling a hill with my 11,500 fifth wheel. I just added the Cool intake mod, cool blue tube and TAG along with the ME from Geno's. I just pulled my fifth wheel to St. Louis and back. It was difficult to get EGT's to 1200 on long hills in the Ozarks. Mostly went up to 10-1100 sensor in the manifold.

 

[Ross]

I have my Smarty set on SW3. I have also tried a TST power max on econ, standard, twins, and combinations of both. TST w/timing, Smarty without; Smarty 3, TST with no timing. TST only; Smarty only, etc, same result. I have even added a Snow Methanol Stage II kit to try to get the temps down, but nothing really helps. The water/meth things is a neat gadget and seems to help reduce temps some while empty, but I'm not having much success with a heavy load. I feel the "kick" of the methanol, but the temps still go beyond 1500. So, I have to cancel cruise control and slow down. That tiny turbo has got to go... Given the high cost of fuel, I'll probably just slow down and save my money for the fuel pumps...



I do have a heavy trailer. It's between 20 and 23K depending on how many horses I'm hauling. I'm sure this is a contributing factor, but I didn't have this much of a heat problem with my 2nd gen.

 

[MAshley]

IF your stock... . Drive it. . both dodge and Cummins have to dealt with these issues... . picture it your driving next to me worrying aobut the EGT up a hill, me im just floored and driving



If your moded well don't go any higher then if you were stock



have fun and just drive

 

[AMassaro]

Just because your exhaust temps are 1xxx degrees, that doesn't mean the metal surfaces are that temp (pistons, etc. ). That is the temp of the gasses and it won't heat the metals due to many physical metalugy aspects that I don't understand completely, yet have come to realize. I've read many times about this subject. It has to do with the flow of the gasses (exhaust) and intake air temps and the flow of the two. On that note, I wouldn't run past 1500-1600 for more than a few or five or six seconds, to be on the safe side on a third gen.

 

[kaprice]

Here's my theory, DC and/or Cummins doesn't put an idiot light or a gauge on it when they build them. They must not worry about it to much. I just drive it like it was made to run. My buddy put gauges on his and all he does is worry about the EGT's. I run right past him on the hills while he limps it up at 40 mph to stay down at 1400 deg. We both pull about the same 5er about 12,000 lbs.

 

[DRasmussen]

I have to agree with Mashley and Kaprice. I drove a 12 valve for 270k miles and never thought twice about EGT's... even pulling an11k trailer. Now that I have a newer 24 valve with a Banks PDA showing me constant, freakin digital readouts of my EGT's I'm going CRAZY with fear everytime I approach 1250. You guys are scaring me to death with talk about pistons turning to silly putty above 1300! C'mon, if DC were concerned about EGT's don't you think they'd be smart enough to at least give us an idiot light indicating that a nuclear meltdown was imminent? Well, maybe I'm a dummy, maybe I'll be crying on the highway while my beloved 24v is dripping its molten heart out, but I think this talk of EGT's is "much ado about nothing"! Please Mr. Cummins engineer educate us!

 

[betterthanstock]

Breaking down aluminum chunks



Melting Temperature Metals

 

[MAshley]

Don't forget they build them for employees to drive... ... they don't give a "pick you favorite 4 letter word” about anything, except that the AC works and they have enough Fuel to get back to there car. Also there built for Moms, Dads, grandparents, and oh we can't forget the just really stupid people, all of these people don't even have a clue what EGT or even care… Dodge is lucky most actually change there oil………. . so they have to build in safety ETC to cover there own back side, be it a smaller turbo, detuned engines, computers that defuel when needed ETC.

 

[amsoilman]

Here's my theory, DC and/or Cummins doesn't put an idiot light or a gauge on it when they build them. They must not worry about it to much. I just drive it like it was made to run. My buddy put gauges on his and all he does is worry about the EGT's. I run right past him on the hills while he limps it up at 40 mph to stay down at 1400 deg. We both pull about the same 5er about 12,000 lbs.

That may be true in a stock engine, but most on this site have modified engines, so therefore EGT's can become very HOT!



I drive School bus that carries 84 kids with the 5. 9 Cummins and it doesn't have gauges either, so Bluebird (the bus maker) and Cummins must not be concerned either.



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[Ross]

In their stock form, the old 12 and 24 valve motors would not exceed 1300, no matter how you drove them. They were engineered that way. With the new emissions standards, smoke (ANY smoke) is a problem, so Dodge has stuck these quick spooling tiny turbos on them to help with this. This chokes them up on the high RPM, high fueling spectrum, such as pulling a load up a long hill. Also, These motors now come with 305, 325, or 350 hp from the factory, so they have higher fueling than the old 12 and 24 valvers, again, making EGTs higher in high RPM, high fuel demand situations.



Changing to a larger exhaust housing used to be a common mod for the old 12 & 24 valve trucks. I'm not hearing much about this. I'm going to investigate some options on exhaust housings, and will report back. Changing the exhaust housing is viewed as a compromise, but it's a lot cheaper than an entirely new turbo. Most of the "Hot-Rodders" want a new fangled turbo for the dyno, track, or dirt, but most of us folks that just use a truck, don't care about that... . I just want my truck to pull the hills like my old one did... :{