Seeking recommendations on suspension upgrade for back-country TT touring

[MattandLana]

Hi all,

OK, there are a million posts here about suspension upgrades, but I'm getting confused by all the choices, and it's not always clear where the author is coming from - some folk are into off-road racing, others heavy hauling. I thought if I set out our needs, some like-minded experts might make some suggestions.

We're a couple in our 50s, towing a 9000 lb travel trailer on remote back-country bitumen and dirt roads for recreation. Bitumen will have many undulations, dips and potholes. Dirt will be badly corrugated, with potholes and washaways. We'll also do some low-speed bush track work, over rocks and deep sand. Our truck, including accessories and drawbar weight, will rarely exceed 50% to 75% of its max payload. Maximum highway speed 60mph. Dirt road speed lower of course.

We find the stock suspension very harsh. On bad tracks we're getting thrown around everywhere even at very low speed - I suspect that's a suspension travel issue.

We're not after cosmetic effect - don't care what it looks like at all. A lift will be inconvenient for access, and increase centre of gravity on the highway, so we'd only do it if that was necessary for a better ride. I'm not in a rush to change tyre size unless we have to.

I see Carli and Thuren mentioned all the time here, but they each do a bewildering array of options, all of which are described (by them) as offering a fantastic blend of ride and capability!

Your advice will be very welcome. Thanks.

 

[jacknife]

i put the blue and yellow Bilstiens on my 3500 and it took a lot of the harshness out while retaining the control and minimizing body roll, Got mine at Genos about $85 EACH. I have used them on my 94 and 06 they are still on the 94.

 

[mfurrh55]

Put airbags on rear and air shocks on front, fronts are a little pricy though, can control them from the cab of my truck,need a softer ride-deflate, stiffer-inflate

 

[Regcabguy]

Hi all,

OK, there are a million posts here about suspension upgrades, but I'm getting confused by all the choices, and it's not always clear where the author is coming from - some folk are into off-road racing, others heavy hauling. I thought if I set out our needs, some like-minded experts might make some suggestions.

We're a couple in our 50s, towing a 9000 lb travel trailer on remote back-country bitumen and dirt roads for recreation. Bitumen will have many undulations, dips and potholes. Dirt will be badly corrugated, with potholes and washaways. We'll also do some low-speed bush track work, over rocks and deep sand. Our truck, including accessories and drawbar weight, will rarely exceed 50% to 75% of its max payload. Maximum highway speed 60mph. Dirt road speed lower of course.

We find the stock suspension very harsh. On bad tracks we're getting thrown around everywhere even at very low speed - I suspect that's a suspension travel issue.

We're not after cosmetic effect - don't care what it looks like at all. A lift will be inconvenient for access, and increase centre of gravity on the highway, so we'd only do it if that was necessary for a better ride. I'm not in a rush to change tyre size unless we have to.

I see Carli and Thuren mentioned all the time here, but they each do a bewildering array of options, all of which are described (by them) as offering a fantastic blend of ride and capability!

Your advice will be very welcome. Thanks.

You can't go wrong with either but Carli offers a very complete engineered system for the 14's. His offerings are generally in stock too.

 

[AEdelheit]

Thuren also has complete 2014 kits though neither have rear leafs for the 3500s If you go with Carli you have to do more of a lift and its much more money, Thuren has leveling coils to help in the front and I would go with a Fox 2.0 remote reservoir shock, the added cooling abilities allow for more rebound and valving control that will make for a much more controlled ride especially in the rear. I would not do air bags unless they are needed, they create a lot of rebound force that is hard to control and makes the back end buck, even if you lower the air pressure they still ramp up on compression. Your best option is to call both companies and talk with them directly for accurate information and pricing, if/when you call Thuren leave a message, there a small 3 person shop and will call you back shortly.

 

[Brocky]

Read where the OP is from!!! Phone calls from OZ can be VERY expensive!!!

 

[MattandLana]

... Your best option is to call both companies ....

... Phone calls from OZ can be VERY expensive!!!

Haha! No worries (as we famously say down here). A few dollars on a call will be a good investment.

 

[AEdelheit]

Read where the OP is from!!! Phone calls from OZ can be VERY expensive!!!

You should see how much Shipping to OZ costs!!!!

 

[Brocky]

NO THANKS!!! I know what it is going to cost for a 2 week vacation down there in August..

 

[AH64ID]

I do a LOT of towing my ~8-9K lb TT on rough, winding, potholed dirt roads. Lots of sharp off-camber corners, steep grades with washboards, and generally crappy road conditions.

In terms on suspension I have done a few mods to help with towing on those roads.

I have replaced the OEM shocks with Bilstien 5100's, including the steering damper.
I replaced the front sway bar end-links with Maxx Links
I added a steering box brace from DT Pro Fab
I have Firestone rear airbags
I installed a Hellwig Rear Anti-Sway bar (Biggest single improvement on crappy roads/corners while towing).

I also added the Dexter EZ-Flex suspension system to my TT, which made such a difference that my wife noticed in the passenger seat of the pickup.

Your 2014 3500 SRW has rear springs that are 7% stiffer than my 2005 3500 SRW, so with a good setup you should have very comfortable towing on back roads.

I have very few complaints about the handling and ride on back roads with my setup, and often have my LRG tires at 95 psi.

I do not feel you need a lift to get what you want.

 

[kthaxton]

Put airbags on rear and air shocks on front, fronts are a little pricy though, can control them from the cab of my truck,need a softer ride-deflate, stiffer-inflate

But that would only be capable of making it stiffer than it already is...unless he installed softer, less load carrying capable springs as well as the air bags. Further, air shocks to increase load carrying can be a bad idea since shock mounts are not designed to handle the weight of the vehicle.

Not a lot of options in this case (smoother ride, yet able to carry a load). Perhaps larger, wider tires (i.e. more volume) run at a lower pressure when off-road.

 

[Mawvelous]

If your issues are when towing (?) I assume you have WD hitch and anti-sway (?)There is one and only one solution. The Air Safe Hitch. http://airsafehitch.com/
Check out the videos of towing travel trailers. I had similar issues and read the shock, air bag & spring solutions on a bunch of forums like this one. I finally found one that had a thread on this hitch. Comments like saved my marriage etc. My wife was ready to follw me in her car she was so tired of the ride. The airsafe hitch makes a huge difference!
Again if you have issues with how your rig rides unloaded and or unhitched then by all means go shock spring or air bag in pursuit of goals. Don't waste money on this stuff if your harsh ride is when towing

 

[AH64ID]

If your issues are when towing (?) I assume you have WD hitch and anti-sway (?)There is one and only one solution. The Air Safe Hitch. http://airsafehitch.com/
Check out the videos of towing travel trailers. I had similar issues and read the shock, air bag & spring solutions on a bunch of forums like this one. I finally found one that had a thread on this hitch. Comments like saved my marriage etc. My wife was ready to follw me in her car she was so tired of the ride. The airsafe hitch makes a huge difference!
Again if you have issues with how your rig rides unloaded and or unhitched then by all means go shock spring or air bag in pursuit of goals. Don't waste money on this stuff if your harsh ride is when towing

If your TT towing was that bad with a standard WDH then something was setup wrong, on the truck, trailer, or WDH.

 

[MattandLana]

Thanks all for your suggestions. To clarify, although our main usage will be with TT on the back, our testing to date has been relatively unladen and without the TT. So we know that's unrealistic and that things will be better with a load. I was really just looking for guidance on what people have installed and how they've found it, for the sort of use we plan.

Update: Consistent with feedback on this forum, I got fast and very helpful responses from both Thuren and Carli. Carli have no products yet for 2014 3500s. Thuren can do front springs and various shocks but no rear springs yet.

Thanks Mawvelous, yes the AirSafe was already on order!

 

[DonFitzwater]

Upgrading the Oem shocks should be a priority as mentioned already. The bilstien are a great choice.

Does your truck have rear leaf or coil springs?

 

[MattandLana]

Does your truck have rear leaf or coil springs?

Rear leafs. Thanks Don.

 

[AH64ID]

Thanks all for your suggestions. To clarify, although our main usage will be with TT on the back, our testing to date has been relatively unladen and without the TT. So we know that's unrealistic and that things will be better with a load. I was really just looking for guidance on what people have installed and how they've found it, for the sort of use we plan.

Update: Consistent with feedback on this forum, I got fast and very helpful responses from both Thuren and Carli. Carli have no products yet for 2014 3500s. Thuren can do front springs and various shocks but no rear springs yet.

Thanks Mawvelous, yes the AirSafe was already on order!

Are you adjusting your tire air pressure accordingly?

 

[AEdelheit]

Upgrading the Oem shocks should be a priority as mentioned already. The bilstien are a great choice.

Does your truck have rear leaf or coil springs?

The front spring rates are so stiff that it will not make much improvement off road, then if he does go to a little taller and softer coil which will make a huge difference it would require buying different shocks again so then hes just spending money twice, doesn't make much sense.

AH641ADs truck is the earlier 4 link so most of what he did does not apply on the newer radius arm trucks.

I think the stock leafs may work better then you think with good shocks, when you add airbags the ride quality decreases, softer leafs and and air bags work better but you still have that air bag creating huge rebound forces even with very little pressure at ride height.

 

[MattandLana]

Are you adjusting your tire air pressure accordingly?

More or less. Currently 60 front 55 rear, lightly laden. Could afford to drop 5, maybe even 10, based on comments on this forum. Will try that too.

So it currently looks like Thuren front coils and shocks all round, an AirSafe hitch, load her up and see how we go. Would folk spend the $700 extra to get the Kings, or just go for the Fox shocks?

 

[AH64ID]

How fast are you driving the roads?

Those style suspension upgrades are more noticed at higher speeds. At slower speeds they may be overkill. Not that they won't work, but questionable if they will provide the same bang for the buck as they would at higher speeds.

Thuren doesn't have their 2013+ springs on their website yet. How much lift are they? If they are more than 1" you will either have to lift the rear or use a lot of air in airbags to maintain a level stance. A 2" level is generally about the point where the air required in the rear, to keep it level, will actually decrease the ride quality (ask me how I know.. .my 1" level rides remarkably better empty and 10x better loaded than a 2" level).

I am also not sure how the new 3 link will react to a lift in terms of geometry and ride... the 4 link gets worse from about 1.5"+. The 3 link probably won't be as bad, but the further you get your control arms from parallel to the ground the worse the ride gets for the same springs.

Bilstien shocks would be perfect for the speeds most people tow at on back roads.

Are you going for towing performance, or empty performance? Based on the title of the thread I don't think Thuren, or race style, suspension components are what you want.

Your front pressure is fine, or even a little on the low side... but dropping the rear will really help.