smarty and transmission

[HLewallen]

Aww, c'mon guys. There was actually some good info starting to come out of this before people started kicking dirt at each other (and it is not as entertaining to read as one might think).



The question was asked earlier about how a smarty equipped truck with stock (or lets say even the mild) torque management performs and how much punishment it delivers to the transmission. Has Marco addressed the differences between the TM settings in a quantifiable way? I do searches on the Smarty periodically because it is the most tempting reason for me to become a warranty station, but I might have missed something. I am still trying to figure out for myself if the lower power setting with mild torque management is both worth it and a reasonable thing to do to a stock truck and not expect damage.



There is a general consensus that more than 60-100 hp into a stock AT is the line between reasonable and unreasonable, but playing with torque management is a new twist (I am the pun master!). What does the stock TM limit the engine to, and when? How do the catcher programs change it? What about hot rodding unloaded? If you are not cooking the AT or shocking the drivetrain with a boosted launch, just using more go pedal? Now that I have asked a bunch of questions, I am going to do some searches to see which ones have already been answered . . .

 

[Luken]

nevermind you win luken seems like you know everything already.

I'm never the one making rediculous claims... I don't have the money to go for the "fastest common rail" or "most hp". I don't own a shop so I don't get parts for half price ect. BUT when I do something I post up proof. Dyno sheets and video. I don't get 800hp on my buddys dyno while his shop was closed and I not have a sheet... But I know its 800hp Right! :-laf



I never said anything to express "that I know everything already. " You simply posted up BAD advice for a newbie to read. EVERYONE should be concerned with dropped valve seats in these trucks.



p. s. I'll admit it... I don't have near the knowledge as most of the guys on here. But when people like lmills or Browns Diesel etc. says something I listen.

 

[RobertP]

i never claimed to have a 800 hp truck either. if you were up on current events you would know that i changed my screen name from RobertP to NGM Diesel. nor do i own my own diesel co. i am the lead mechanic over there. so before you go spouting at the mouth know your facts. if you look at my sig you will see my dyno numbers, and one of the guys you said you would listen to was in the dyno room when it happend. (lmills)



half price ha ha i wish. hey if you do start your own co. and get half price let me know.



bad advise where?



i said that if you are going to run one box that there is no reason to worry about valve seats. which still stands. i would not recommend some one who wants to run one box to upgrade there valve seats. it would defeat the purpose on many box builders. if he were to ask a question about a wanting 500 hp or more than yes valve seats would come into play. but not with the smarty alone. never would i tell one of my customers, well if we put a box on your truck i want to take the head off and put in new valve seats. i don't know what scams you run, but its not good business.



ill say it again go stir the pot elsewhere.



Robert

 

[Luken]

I know exactly who you are. My point is your with "NGM Diesel" and your co-buddy has claimed to have 800hp on fuel only.



I never said yank the head off if your running one box. All I meant was be ready for a dropped valve seat. It has happened on a BONE STOCK truck. What makes you think it wouldn't on a modded truck... Even if it only had one box on it?



Enough with the pot stirring crap...

 

[RobertP]

like i stated before it will not happen if you watch you egt's and make sure your cylinder pressures are in check. the only people who have dropped valve seats have had multiple boxes and have seen very high egt's. the bone stock truck you speak of obviously had a defect. or you would hear alot more about stock trucks dropping valve seats. but you don't someone on this site actually started a pole on that and i think out of all of the members on this site maybe 6 have had a valve seat drop, and post about it.



and if you want me to stop telling you to stop stirring the pot then don't follow my post and try to make the company i work for look bad. maybe you will understand this time.

 

[Luken]

Looking back in the thread I wasn't even the one who started the "dropped valve arguement" LOL It was advice from Browns. Go tell him to stop stirring the pot :-laf

 

[Reb.B]

Its not about HP guys, its about Heat! and time with Heat!. the material in the 04. 5 and above is better but not good enough. Its not about cylender pressure either. You can burn down a motor with 200 HP if you want. If your rail pressure drops then the power drops and the heat goes through the roof and that is what drops seats. Also too small turbo, or a several diffent reason why the exhaust temps raise. The reason i brought it up was not to stir the pot, but to advise the guy who started the post 130-170HP on the smarty is to hot of a setting with a stock motor and a stock trans. Take it for what its worth. OH! and saying that the only people that have dropped seats is the people that stack boxes is BS, Go fish,,lol! I've seen over 1600 degrees on Smarty at higher levels and BDDL on Crazy L on stock trucks.

 

[RobertP]

im not saying its impossible to see those temps with just one box but its highly unlikely. i have set of stage 3 injectors plus the smarty and cant see 1600. on the other hand when i had my bd crazy larry i could see 1600. but thats with the injectors. with out the injectors all i could see was 1400. ive done alot of testing with different boxes to find out which one has the lowest egt's. like i stated before all you have to do is have common sense about you egt's and you will have nothing to worry about. you could have 900hp and as long as you watch your temps you wont have any issuses. Reb. B you know that from experience.

 

[Luken]

Just so we can get this clear.



NGM Diesel,



Are you saying it is highly unlikely to see temps as high as 1600 on a stock truck plus ONE box?



Lucas

 

[RobertP]

Just so we can get this clear.



NGM Diesel,



Are you saying it is highly unlikely to see temps as high as 1600 on a stock truck plus ONE box?



Lucas

i said its possible. but from the testing i have done with my personal truck it has not happened. the stock injectors did not fuel enough to get my temps that high. not until i put in my injectors did i see that high of egt. then again soon as i went with the smarty i cant see temps that high anymore.



not as much staking boxes but more so the high egt's but that is what happens when you stack more boxes you get higher egt's.

 

[Luken]

Your stock injectors must have sucked...



I know a few guys here locally that can peg the gauge with one box. All of them have stock turbos... I know on my dads 03 with just a tst temps get INSANE with it only on 3x3...

 

[RobertP]

Your stock injectors must have sucked...



I know a few guys here locally that can peg the gauge with one box. All of them have stock turbos... I know on my dads 03 with just a tst temps get INSANE with it only on 3x3...

i can agree my stock injectors sucked compared to my stage 3's

 

[Luken]

i can agree my stock injectors sucked compared to my stage 3's

Obviously they should be light years ahead of your stockers.



I was comparing them to other stock injectors.

 

[RobertP]

its possible, but i was not running a tst, i was running the bullydog. im sure if i ran the tst i could have pegged the gauge then.



to end the dispute on valve seats, please use common sense when running any box or boxes and make sure your egt's are in check. just make sure you stay below 1450 and all will be ok. that is on the 04. 5 and above trucks. the 03-04 trucks i would stay below 1350.

if that is done then the sky's the limit for power with a diesel.



Robert

 

[lmills]

its possible, but i was not running a tst, i was running the bullydog. im sure if i ran the tst i could have pegged the gauge then.



to end the dispute on valve seats, please use common sense when running any box or boxes and make sure your egt's are in check. just make sure you stay below 1450 and all will be ok. that is on the 04. 5 and above trucks. the 03-04 trucks i would stay below 1350.

if that is done then the sky's the limit for power with a diesel.



Robert

Man where are all these high egt's coming from? Do you guys monitor these or something?

 

[GColeman]

Reb Brown and Marco, thanks for the valuable opinions and information.



On the other hand, a couple of you guys should just go meet in a parking lot (or the octagon) and work things out.

 

[MHorne]

wow this thread kind of took off in a good and bad way. But back to my original question in regards to the transmission, Which settings will i be safe on? Right now i have it on 60 with added timing. Will i be ok there and maybe do the 90 on the weekends or just stick with 60 until i can beef up the transmission? I think i have felt the transmission slip one or twice so far but i'm not entirely sure. Stock truck except gauges and a volant air filter. Anyway if i watch my gauges what settings can i safely run on so i don't destroy my transmission. Cause i was hard on it today on the 170 and as soon as you guys said that the 170 will destroy my transmission quickly i brought it down to 90 and now i have it at 60 until i get some more safe feed back from you guys. Thanks for all the info so far and everybody have a great holiday weekend and HAPPY THANKSGIVING.

 

[MoparBob]

Let's please get back on subject... Smarty and the transmission...



I did a search and couldn't find any info on specifics with the new torque management programs with the Smarty. Can someone elaborate on those and how it will affect the life of the Transmission?

 

[Reb.B]

well, in my opinion, its not Tourque Management (or lack of) that kills transmissions, but low end fuelling. I think Marco gets these two confused sometimes. Like the BullyDOG, ... it has low end fuelling and TM options. The pass code should be needed for low end fuelling not so much TM. But I know why they did it. On the bully dog, when u get rid of TM then the engine revs higher and fuels higher top end. The reason why i think you need a pass is because its a lot easier to fry your motor. The reason i think low end fuelling is so hard is that you are adding too much power without pushing the throttle down. When you do this the trans does not get enough pressure and there goes your trans. With a bullydog and TST, i found that right about 420 HP is when the connerter started to slip on an 06. Also the new trucks (06 and above) are more intellegent and will lock up later in OD (or in 3rd in tow haul) and this saves the trans and the converter. Also, there are lots of ways to blow a trans. Heavy fuelling and a turbo will snap a flex plate. Low end fuelling will kill all clutches (well, not all but alot), too much power and standing on brakes or sled pulling will kill shafts.



Back to the Smarty, ... ..... with 60 HP u should be fine, 90 is the safest max power, and 130-170 is hard on everything! I'm sure someone else will come on here and say he has been running 170 HP on his Smarty for the last 25 years, but this is were Marco draws his line in the sand, this is also where i draw my line in the sand, and if i were selling a box to a custumer, this is what i would tell them. Hope this helps. Take it for what its worth.

 

[lmills]

Last I checked the Smarty also has different TQ managment programs. Nobody ever said you have to load the most agressive