Smarty Burnouts

[Paddy McMahon]

99% of the time I drive like an old man, but once in a while when the 16 year old trapped inside my middle aged body finds an empty road with no houses, people, etc, I find the urge to leave a Dodge diesel calling card mark on the asphalt... My question is simply this-with the edge ez on 3level 3 with 10k miles my truck would smoke the tires unmercilesly for a hundred feet. I put the Edge w/ attitude on and noticed even more power initially, but over the course of time this has been reduced to simply barking the tires and hard accelleration. Now I have removed all that and gone to Smarty-on level 3 or 5 it simply will not smoke the tires, even if I try a little brake stand. Tire size and air pressure have always been pretty much the same so I can't figure what to attribute this to. Anyone with comments please post. check my signature and know that I do the routine maintenance on this truck religiously. We are not discussing outrageous vehicle abuse here-simply a burnout a couple of times a month. Truck has 68k miles.

 

[480RUGER]

Adjusted your valves lately?

 

[cerberusiam]

I have the same truck, Smarty with one difference, a good transmission.



Before trans rebuild I could not do a brake stand and spin the tires. It would hit 2100 rpm's, defuel, and could not drive thru the brakes.



Now, once the boost hits 8 psi the rears light off and there is no amount of brake pressure to keep from spinning.



You transmission is crying for help. Here is what my direct clutches and input looked like when we pulled it down.



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[Mobius1]

Strange, I have no problems doing burnouts on my truck, with or w/o smarty, tst or no tst, ez or no ez.



Wait till it hits about 2k rpm or whenever the rpms don't get any higher, let off the brakes, then re-apply them and they should smoke till you let off

 

[Paddy McMahon]

No valve adj. yet-soon, but I am unfortunately inclined to believe that the transmission is the culprit. Is there a way of confirming the transmission has issues by virtue of an inspection without a teardown? believe me that the burnout proceedure has had no influence on ability to spin tires-it just isn't happening. Thank you for the replies gentlemen.

 

[cerberusiam]

No valve adj. yet-soon, but I am unfortunately inclined to believe that the transmission is the culprit. Is there a way of confirming the transmission has issues by virtue of an inspection without a teardown? believe me that the burnout proceedure has had no influence on ability to spin tires-it just isn't happening. Thank you for the replies gentlemen.

Nope, and I was running a shift kit. Until the apply piston finally cut the seal from over extending there was no indication of the damage. The only telltale sign was more than normal clutch material in the pan when I changed fluid. Not excessive, never burned, and no metal ever, but just a fine dusting of black dust on the top of the VB.



I did notice a couple hundred degrees EGT differences in the same conditions as previous and a loss of fuel mileage that could have been weather. You can just about figure if you have been running the extra power and no shift kit or trans work the clutches are getting worn and the TC is starting to go.

 

[Regcabguy]

Where's the beef?

No valve adj. yet-soon, but I am unfortunately inclined to believe that the transmission is the culprit. Is there a way of confirming the transmission has issues by virtue of an inspection without a teardown? believe me that the burnout proceedure has had no influence on ability to spin tires-it just isn't happening. Thank you for the replies gentlemen.

Research a built transmission upgrade from an authorized or reputable installer in your area. I had a DTT on my '99 and the difference over stock will blow you away! You might contact Don Thuren and ask his advice. He's a Santa Barbara guy. My wife and I enjoy staying in Santa Barbara occassionally. It's a superb place.

 

[Paddy McMahon]

Once again thank you fr the advice and usefull comments.

 

[JBonpua]

They might be right about the transmission. Heck even when I had the Smarty on SW 9, I could never smoke the tires with my G56. It is just hard to light the turbo when not moving. I had the truck on the dyno at May Madness and it put out 396 so maybe that is not enough hp to spin a 37" tires.

 

[JJPage]

No valve adj. yet-soon, but I am unfortunately inclined to believe that the transmission is the culprit. Is there a way of confirming the transmission has issues by virtue of an inspection without a teardown? believe me that the burnout proceedure has had no influence on ability to spin tires-it just isn't happening. Thank you for the replies gentlemen.

No way to confirm without tearing it apart. I could not believe, when my truck had 8k on it, that the 48re was kaput! 2nd and OD both were identical to the pics that cerber has posted.



Bill K educated me on the workings of the mopar transmission(5 lever), for one, and he spent the whole day, working on my trans alone w/me.



I was experiencing the same symptoms as you, went from "crisp" to "mushy", in a quick manner.



Since the crew from Abbotsford(sp) have "overhauled" my 48re, tight, crisp, solid, move the shift lever from park to reverse, the truck "jumps", reverse to drive, "jumps" again, exhaust barks, cool!



And, about those long, black marks on the asphalt.....

 

[BGlidewell]

what's the tach/boost doing while your foot is on the floor and the transmission is shifting from 1-2, 2-3? It should be moving back firm then forward with each shift.

 

[LRutigliano]

99% of the time I drive like an old man, but once in a while when the 16 year old trapped inside my middle aged body finds an empty road with no houses, people, etc, I find the urge to leave a Dodge diesel calling card mark on the asphalt... My question is simply this-with the edge ez on 3level 3 with 10k miles my truck would smoke the tires unmercilesly for a hundred feet. I put the Edge w/ attitude on and noticed even more power initially, but over the course of time this has been reduced to simply barking the tires and hard accelleration. Now I have removed all that and gone to Smarty-on level 3 or 5 it simply will not smoke the tires, even if I try a little brake stand. Tire size and air pressure have always been pretty much the same so I can't figure what to attribute this to. Anyone with comments please post. check my signature and know that I do the routine maintenance on this truck religiously. We are not discussing outrageous vehicle abuse here-simply a burnout a couple of times a month. Truck has 68k miles.

I've been researching a new trans as well and have been advised that if I plan to do ANY power braking, the rebuild should include a billet output shaft along with the other "normal" upgrades.



The guys at the trans shop told me that more than likely I will see temps increase before it go's bad... but now I'm really worried after looking at those clutch pack pics.



Has anyone dyno'd before and after a new trans upgrade? I've heard of up to +100hp and +250 ft-lbs of torque hitting the road just with the trans upgrade.



One more thing... My sister-in-laws Mazda minivan trans just went out and its going to cost approx $3200 to repair it. Now my wife finally believes me that the truck transmission rebuild really does cost $5000 plus :-laf:-laf:-laf



She thought I was not telling her the truth



Thanks,

Louis

 

[JCasper]

They might be right about the transmission. Heck even when I had the Smarty on SW 9, I could never smoke the tires with my G56. It is just hard to light the turbo when not moving. I had the truck on the dyno at May Madness and it put out 396 so maybe that is not enough hp to spin a 37" tires.

Only 396? I am thinking the new Smarty SW doesn't put out the power that the old SW did.



I did a 391/809 on level 5 last year with 35's.



I am hoping to get on a dyno in a couple weeks. If my clutch holds I will try level 9.

 

[Mobius1]

Wow I guess my transmission is holding up ok (knocks on wood) for the amt of power going through it. I would love to get an all billet transmission from goerend or dtt but i just don't have the 7k + to spend on it



I don't have any problems with shifting or anything. But it probably is on borrowed time

 

[Paddy McMahon]

what's the tach/boost doing while your foot is on the floor and the transmission is shifting from 1-2, 2-3? It should be moving back firm then forward with each shift.

Nope... under WOT he truck revs beyond it's original shift points and then shifts into subsequent (higher). gear and is met with a momentary fluctuation in rpm. I know very little about auto transmissions, but it feels like when someone partially dips the clutch while accellerating hard with a manual transmission. Overall it seems like the vehicle needs a lot more of initial throttle to get going stopped or rolling along at 30mph. Don't get me wrong... . the truck still makes routine trips back and forth to Idaho and daily driver trips amounting to 50-100 miles and the transmission issues have not kept me from cruising along in what my friends refer to a notoriously slow speed (the posted limit). Presently the money tree isn't in full bloom in my backyard so I am concerned about the cost of resolving this problem.

 

[JBonpua]

Only 396? I am thinking the new Smarty SW doesn't put out the power that the old SW did.



I did a 391/809 on level 5 last year with 35's.



I am hoping to get on a dyno in a couple weeks. If my clutch holds I will try level 9.

I have the older software before Revo. 396 was on SW 6 with 37's on stock clutch. I spoke to Peter at SBC last week at May Madness and he said he has a new Economy DD clutch for the G56... basically the same as the regular DD but not SFI certified and only than the single disc.

 

[cerberusiam]

I've been researching a new trans as well and have been advised that if I plan to do ANY power braking, the rebuild should include a billet output shaft along with the other "normal" upgrades.



Has anyone dyno'd before and after a new trans upgrade? I've heard of up to +100hp and +250 ft-lbs of torque hitting the road just with the trans upgrade.

Billet input shaft is a must, the other billet shafts if you are gonna thrash it hard racing or pulling.



Does the trans have to cost $7k? I have a total of $2500 into mine and it should hold 600-650, but, I don't use it like that day to day. If you just want a better trans and you are not gonna thrash it, the cost is not much more than a stock rebuild at one of the chain stores.



Spinning the directs has got to rob some of the power but how much is the question. A DynoJet is not going to load the trans anywhere near what a 10k 5'er will so its tought o tell what one would gain.



I am going to try to dyno tomorrow and see what the truck does. I am also trying the new Revo software so it won't be as good a test as the same software/conditions and just a trans rebuild.

 

[JCasper]

I have the older software before Revo. 396 was on SW 6 with 37's on stock clutch. I spoke to Peter at SBC last week at May Madness and he said he has a new Economy DD clutch for the G56... basically the same as the regular DD but not SFI certified and only than the single disc.

OK, that makes more sense. I don't have the Revo SW in yet either.