So much talent---whatta jerk!

[Max340]

Originally posted by EMDDIESEL

Come on, lets feed the fire!! Who was better, David Lee Roth, or Sammy Hagar?

Roth for pure unpredictable mayhem, and Hagar for better lyrics.



Both were better than that guy. . Gary Sharone?



Personally, I enjoy Michael Anthony (bassist) the most as far as solo work onstage with Van Halen. Not taking away from Eddie or Alex, but anyone who breaks into Bach's "Tocccata and Fugue in D Minor" (mostly recognized as the theme from Phantom of the Opera) as the beginning of his live solo has something going for him.



As to the "great guitarist debate", my brother and I have long discussed the merits of Eric Clapton, Jimi Hendrix, Edward VanHalen, SRV, Steve Vai, Joe Satriani (Satch), Jeff Beck, Eric Johnson and even Segovia. Each has his own style, which makes them individual and talented. Some I do not care for, others I could (and do) listen to for days. The point being, anyone saying any of these gentleman is not talented clearly has never taken up the instrument and tried to produce coherant sound deserving of the general description "music". I have. I cant play a lick fer nothin'. One day when I have time and some extra $$, I want to take up bass guitar. In the mean time, I apply my talents to other things, since I cannot make a living at playing guitar.



SO Rich, What gives? Why the opening statement?

 

[EMDDIESEL]

Maybe Rich IS Eddie Van Halen???? Maybe he wants to know what people think of him and knows that anybody who has a Cummins Ram must be intelligent???

 

[tntway]

hey!! Aaron Tippin's got one and i'll bet there ain't nothin' wrong with the radio either

 

['956Wheel]

Max340 hit most of the great ones add Jerry Garcia, Billy Gibbons,BB King and others who are known as "signature guitarists", i. e. no matter what you can tell who it is.



The big band stuff or even Elvis ain't for me but that certainly does not mean they lack talent. Now as far as Brittany and Jennifer Lopez that stuff is just eye candy... ask Dole's dog!

 

[Champane Flight]

How many?

How many instruments can you play Max?



I was once told by a music prof once that a talented musician was the one who blended and added to the rest of a group. Take in example George Harrison,Mark Knoppler,Mcguin,Steve Miller,Steve Stills,and of course Jerry G.



Talented songwriters and musicians ,John Hyatt,John Lennon,Paul M. ,Sheryl Crow,Steve Winwood,Neil Young,Petty,David Lowery,Patty Larkin,and on and on and on. I could take this list to four or five full pages and no place on it would you see Sammy,David or Eddie!



You all need to take a few music appreciation classes... ... ...

 

[The patriot]

Originally posted by EMDDIESEL

Come on, lets feed the fire!! Who was better, David Lee Roth, or Sammy Hagar?

I like Sammy, but IMO VH was better with DLR, even though he was extremely pompus.

My . 02

Eric

 

[Max340]

CF, it doesn't matter how many I can play. My talent or lack thereof is not the issue, which I felt I addressed by noting I could not play guitar.



Second, while your music prof is correct, it is worth noting that great musicians such as Bach, Beethoven, Mozart and Handel played alone. So what bearing does playing alone or as part of a group have to do with possession of talent? Nothing. It may indicate where talent lies, but it certainly does not take way from talent.



Third, your list seems limited to those you LIKE, which is NOT in indicator of individual talent. Sammy, Dave, and Eddie are all talented musicians in their own style. Your taste for that particular style is not an indicator of talent. I particularly do not like Rap, bluegrass, or opera. But that does not mean Eminem, Pavarotti and (can't think of a bluegrass musician) are not talented. Whether or not you like what he has to say, Eminem has a talent for writing lyrics on controversial topics. Pavarotti is a pre-eminent Tenor, and Banjo is a difficult instrument to play as far as string instruments go.



Fourth, as to my taking "music appreciation" classes, I have in fact taken one of those. The professor was Dr. Marc Jelanik, and I got a decent grade (would have to check to see exactly what). Perhaps music appreciation is not about what I (or you)personally appreciate, but looking at the talent and effort, as well as ease or difficulty, in creating music.



As such, Eddie Van Halen is not only part of a group, but a solo musician, has a musical education, classical training, and an extreme talent in rock guitar. Like his music or not, he IS one of the notably talented musicians of the 20th century.

 

[The patriot]

Why cant we all just get along.

 

[EMDDIESEL]

There is almost as much hostility in here as in a Pre Turbo Vs. Post turbo thermocouple install thread!!!!.

Its just music, you like yours, i like mine. You dont have to like mine, i dont have to like yours. Thats why we have lots of different radio stations. To each his own, right? My personal favorite bands are:

Metallica, Social Distortion and the Ramones. They are in MY OWN opinion, the best 3 bands out there.



I also keep the following artists CD's in my truck: Tom Petty, Bryan Adams, Papa Roach, Staind, The Cult, Hole, Dido, The Offspring and No Doubt

and virtually all the 80's metal bands like Poison, Motley Crue, Judas Priest, Guns N Roses, Ozzy, Iron Maiden, Van Halen, Twisted Sister, etc. That is what i grew up listening to. I have other odds and ends but mostly what i mentioned above.



I appreciate all music, There is just alot of artists who i dont like enough to buy there CD's or not change the station when they come on.



Anybody else have any favorite bands?

 

[tntway]

the point?

i'm failing to see the point here... maybe because i've got a degree in music?

 

[Champane Flight]

Ruffled..

Exactly TNT,and yea you guys all have good points. I enjoy ALL music,I feel it is a form of expression. A awesome way to convey ones feelings,moods,and ideas. "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder". It is art,and can only be thought of as art.



I must admit one thing,I have not listened to much of Eddie,David,or Sammie. I may do that in the near future. What I have heard has not impressed me. I did not mean to ruffle feathers or destroy anyones childhood memorys. Maybe just get you to listen to some other music maybe?Maybe try out a little Zydeco,Beau Jocque,Max?Maybe get EM to listen to a little Cracker?Or we could bicker and ball about who we FEEL is a talented or untalented musician. My problem is that I have hung with the pompus music majors,musicians,and music educaters all my life and I tend to take some of their veiws instead of forming my own.



Just maybe we could turn this into a education instead of a slugfest,my guy is better than your guy thing? I tend to tear things apart a little..... A new peice of music can be like opening a door to a new world.....

 

[Shovelhead]

OK we're now on the third page of this gripe-fest and still no reply from Rich M.



HELLOOOOOOOOOOOOO Rich, why is E V H a jerk?



BTW: I listen to everything from Motley Crue, to Earl Scruggs, to classical (still don't consider RAP as music, just my tastes).

It depends on what mood I'm in.

 

[tntway]

?????

ya know, when i first started reading this string(no, it doesn't rate being called a thread), i thought that maybe eddie whacked hisself out or sumpthin' like that... now i'm convinced that rich m. just doesn't like eddie and wanted to start all this up

 

[Max340]

Its hard to say any musician is not talented when you haven't listened to them.



I have listened to many types of music, I tend towards my own eclectic selection of Classical, classic rock, blues and a bit of other stuff thrown in for good measure. Generally speaking, I'll listen to anything once, twice if I like it.



My point was exactly what you say in your last lines, how can talent be judged on style of music?

 

[Champane Flight]

Likes

You have stated Max you didn't like rap/hip hop or Bluegrass. Well some don't like A Slam style guitar player,I am one. Yes,I have heard Eddie,Sammy,and David. I do not care for the cuts I have heard!I will deal deeper into it and see if there is anything in their music worth a dam. However,from what I have heard so far their music is highly superficial with very little depth,with a tendecy to get into long drawn out solo lead rifts with no body. Their songwriting ability is limited as they have a lean,or always do a song or two from some other artist on every album. And the songs they do write are filled with repeatative and rough(not much tight here)construction.



I do have a extensive music library and have everything from classical to electronica(which I am having even a rougher time with than Eddie and company).



I will check it out further.

 

[SLightfoot]

The guy IS talented!!!

OK, I have played guitar for most of my life now, electric and accoustic, and I am here to tell ya, THE GUY IS SERIOUSLY TALENTED!!!



It's not just about his speed, or his dexterity, or his fiery picking... . it's about his musicality.



Go out and find "Live without A Net" and watch Eddie play his live, unnacompanied guitar solo. His feel, sense of rythm, and pure innovation are demonstrated to the Nth degree in this solo. It isn't just fast playing, it's darned nice music.



For those who have knowledge of the electric guitar, you all know that he invented a lot of the playing that we have heard from so many others.



What is unfortunate is that in today's rock bands, I'm hard pressed to determine whether they can actually play their guitars or not. Some of these new band guitarists are simply BAD!



Eddie can play the guitar. Full stop.



Shawn

 

[Max340]

Shawn, that video is EXACTLY the point I ma trying to make... .



Play it in slo mo, and Eddie STILL defeats logic and speed. Unreal.



Is VH the last word in guitar? No. Is he a landmark or milestone player in the world of Rock Guitar? Absolutely.



CF, your opinion needs updating. It still seems based on distaste for the genre.



A Guitar solo that is based on long drawn out riffs with little or no body, go figure, isn't that the hallmark of Rock guitar solos?



I have to agree, Diver Down was a bit of a cover album. It was the album that started the rift between Eddie and David, and for exactly the reason you stated. Ed figured they had more to offer than covering Motown tunes.



If you seriously believe that the songs are not "tight", you have not listened very well, as some are very tight. Second, if Rock aint about repetitive phrases, then maybe some one needs to redefine Rock.



BTW, if you want to complain about repetitive phrases, don't listen to Bach, his fugues will leave you with a negative impression.



One question: If a musician is considered truly talented if they can add to a group, who exactly gets selected for the arias, interludes, and "first" seats in the classical style? I was under the impression that a soloist of any sort was one that was talented above the others and thus was being "showcased".

 

[Champane Flight]

First seats.

Solo artists or first seats as it is know are picked by talent and seniority. In a classical sense they read and play the score,if it is long or drawn out it is the composers fault,not theirs.



I can tear up any musician out there it has nothing to do with genre. I listen to allot of new musicians and groups everyday. Some of the new groups are without merit,and some are without boundrys!I try very hard to turn off their personality,looks,and political tastes when I listen to their music.

However in some cases(even you have to admit)it is hard to do. I also tend to be suspicious of artists who try to pull the attention away from their music with their personal appearance.



The repetative nature of rock can be overcome with tasteful lead building on the existing chords and a building of tempo. A fine example of this is Stephen Stills "Manassas"(this man has talent),I can name several other artists and musicians with a knack for this. I have seen "Live without a net"and while I must admit his speed is very notable,his performance is just OK. I don't know guys,I have been listening to Eddie,Sammy,and David for two days now and still don't see the unlimited talent?I do have this urge to go out,get a Tat and marry a actress though.



Have you guys listened to any John Hiatt yet?Try "Crossing muddy waters",it is his latest and some say his best. When you listen to it check out the drums... ..... And of course his guitar. Remember he is a song writer and his voice isn't his high point... ...

 

[5thram]

They all sound great when drowned out by the Cummins Six. I especially like the percussion section!!!!!

 

[Bob Wagner]

and

The Wife and I went to High School with the Van Halen Brothers and Dave Lee Roth (Arcadia High School Arcadia, CA 1976)



They were just a backyard party band at that time.



Van Halen played at a party for my wifes 16th birthday



Great Band!