stanadyne vs BG ?

[BGlidewell]

Take the high road men!

Remember to remind me this in a few weeks too.

 

[BigPapa]

Required during the '90s? On what engines? 500 ppm sulphur content or LSD diesel fuel was offered for sale on line in October '93 before the EPA standard went into effect in early '94.



I think it is only a small number of TDR members driving Dodges with pre-94 12 valve engines.



I have read that regardless off the contrary myths about sulphur providing required lubricity in diesel engine fuel it did not actually provide much lubricity. I don't know where I read it and am admittedly not certain of what I read. I will do a little looking when I have time and see if I can learn more about the subject.

LSD or S500 was available in most of the US until 2010. ULSD or S15 became available in 2006 and was mandated to be the only diesel fuel available for highway use available by the end of 2010. Who's uneducated Harvey? I thought you were an old oil man. You should know that the sulfur does not add the lubricity, the process that takes the sulfur out takes the lubricity out.



The Stanadyne Lubricity Formula was developed for the military when they wanted to run Jet-A in everything they ran. Jet-A is drier than our wonderful ULSD. They started having injector pump and injector failures so lubricity formula was developed and solved the problem. When ULSD was forced upon us the problem was already solved.



I never implied that I could "feel" a difference when running Stanadyne. For 5 cents a gallon, that's pretty good insurance to me. As for the Performance Formula, I run it occasionally. If you choose not to use it that's fine with me but don't call me uneducated and simple minded because I choose to use it.



Scott

 

[GCroyle]

Harvey,



I have an additional product for your HB Miracle Engine Tonic line.



Clutch Renu, just one can sprayed into your bellhousing and the friction material grows backover a few months, adds lube to the pilot bearing, increases coefficent of friction, restores burned castings, not to mention give you a 5% overdrive, yup, disc will spin faster than engine, gets you more miles per smile.



Distributor inquiries welcome.

 

[Steve St.Laurent]

My previous warning evidently either wasn't read or was ignored. Leave the personal attacks and hyperbole out of this - keep to the technical discussion (PLEASE). I deleted a bunch of stuff since my last post that didn't have anything to do with the technical discussion at hand.

-Steve St. Laurent
Lead Moderator

 

[BigPapa]

Come on Gary, PLEASE don't encourage him.



Scott

 

[mwilson]

We offer "Weld Beautifier" as a potion here at FOM.



If you are not so great a welder, you only penetrate about 1/64" into 1" plate steel and your beads look like chicken droppings then you need "Weld Beautifier" to really complete your sub-standard welding job. :-laf







Just Rubberized Undercoating... ... . this is how we insult our welder somedays, he can't be taking it too personal as he asks for "Weld Beautifier" when he comes to the back counter for more spray cans of it... ... .



Mike.

 

[HBarlow]

Harvey,

I have an additional product for your HB Miracle Engine Tonic line.

Clutch Renu, just one can sprayed into your bellhousing and the friction material grows backover a few months, adds lube to the pilot bearing, increases coefficent of friction, restores burned castings, not to mention give you a 5% overdrive, yup, disc will spin faster than engine, gets you more miles per smile.

Distributor inquiries welcome.

Gary,

I'd like to sign on as your first dealer but this topic may be considered off limits so I will only chuckle privately and leave it.

 

[Mhannink]

Have any of you practitioners of the fuel additive religion ever thought to ask TDR writer Joe Donnelly who has a Ph. D. in chemistry for his opinion about fuel additives?



As I said in one of my first posts in this thread, I think belief in additives is nonsense but have no quarrel with those of you who believe and practice this belief. It is your money and your truck. You have every right to spend your money as you choose.



Thanks for the fun. I enjoyed it.

i have not asked mr. donnelly only because i do not know who he is and so i do not know to ask him. i would love for him to chime in and comment. i love good technical explanations even if its opposing to my opinions. i can change and its not a bad thing. mr. donnelly may have good solid proof he can provide as to why additives are either not needed or a mistake.

Required during the '90s? On what engines? 500 ppm sulphur content or LSD diesel fuel was offered for sale on line in October '93 before the EPA standard went into effect in early '94.



I think it is only a small number of TDR members driving Dodges with pre-94 12 valve engines.



I have read that regardless off the contrary myths about sulphur providing required lubricity in diesel engine fuel it did not actually provide much lubricity. I don't know where I read it and am admittedly not certain of what I read. I will do a little looking when I have time and see if I can learn more about the subject.

i think it was bigpapa but someone said exactly what i understood. correct me if i am wrong, but from what i understand sulfer does not provide lubricity however removing the sulfer also removes the lubricity of the fuel. an old saying i learned in my training is you can never have too much lube. if removing the sulfer also removes the lubricity then why not play it safe? also how much does it add to the operating costs? i know it will vary depending on the additive but can any of them be that much. is a few cents a gallon or per tank really a big deal? how about for added security.



im guessing the post was deleted but i think barlow referenced cummins literature. they recomened its not needed but does it hurt? the 6. 7 with the dpf i could see that as possible but the older ones?

Why would you expect me to pay for your silly test to prove something that only you and small number of other religous devotees believe in. That sounds much like your basic philosophy of life. You want something and believe someone else should pay.



I already know fuel additives only add to operating costs. YOU prove the advantage and report it.

you know if i had the money i would pony up for it in an instant. i would even do it myself. there is nothing wrong with a good experiment with quantifiable results. you dont believe in additives, but is there anything wrong with finding out with scientific results?



hbarlow i ask you the way i asked you in the very beggining. as a person who is genuinly interested in your view and why you have the opinion that you do. you say you know fuel additives only add to operating costs. in effect your saying they do not do anything correct? would please provide proof as to why none of the thousands of additives available do nothing for how the truck runs. what are the nuts and bolts as to why they dont work?

 

[BGlidewell]

alge? how do you deal with it?

 

[rscurtis]

The best way to deal with it is to keep the fuel free of water and cool. When I had my rental business, I had an above ground 275 gallon tank (something you could never do today in over-regulated NY), and routinely treated the fuel with Biobor algaecide. Never had a problem. Many machines would run for hundreds of hours without fuel filter changes. I also had an inline spin-on filter on the dispensing pump, I'm sure that helped too.

 

[HHhuntitall]

... . :look-both-ways-before-entering-traffic: ... . welllll, back to the BG and Stanadyne... Stanadyne is the only substance recommended by Cummins dealers, what does that say? As for the BG, my first expereinces with it came by purchasing diesel that is treated with it from the local fuel distributor. For weeks, I had been filling up with their treated fuel, and noticed a difference in reduced smoke from my old '97... . so much so I noticed a drastic difference when I filled up somewhere else. It even prompted me to change my fuel filter a few times..... When I finally realized what was happening, I was curious as to the reason, so I asked the distributor. He could only think that he treats all the fuel that comes in with the BG fuel conditioner. And for the last several years, I have several trucks running green diesel('87 Freightliner, '90 Kenworth, '92 Peterbilt), and tractors and equipment that have been running the same fuel, only dyed. Over that last several years, I've had to pull down several pieces of equipment for repair, and in the process have done some preemtive work on injectors and pumps. The fuel systems appear spotless, injector nozzles have less carbon build up, and the oil seems to have less contaminants. This might not be such a shocker, but even the certified Bosch dealer that remans my injectors and pumps mentioned how clean they looked and their appearance, asking me if the hours and mileage I told him were correct. That, in itself, I think says something. While I have few quantitative measurements to give, I think when other professionals notice a difference, it should be noticed. The only quantitative information I can give is fuel mileage in the trucks. The OTR tractors pick up very little, but the pickups tend to gain 1-2 mpg on highway, with the most gains being on my '97 at 3-4mpg. The most noticeable difference in internal effects would be on my 875 versatile tractor, with the 855 Cummins. The oil previously, when running fuel from the Co-op, would turn a dark black color around 100-120 hours, but now lasts to 150-60 hours before beginning to turn a dark color... . so now we run oil changes every 200 hours instead of 150. At 44quarts a change, that adds up over time.



As for Stanadyne products, I can't say much as to their benefits, as I don't use it. My other product of choice is Troco DieselGuard. I don't have enough use out of it yet to state weither or not it's worth having, but I will in a few years.

 

[rbattelle]

I checked out the BG website, as I'd not heard of it before. The DFC stuff sounds a lot like Stanadyne Performance Formula.

I use Stanadyne myself, for two reasons:
1. Enhanced lubricity to combat any lack from ULSD or winterized fuels.
2. I frequently operate on #2 diesel during cold winter months, so I want something that reduces the chances of cold weather fuel problems.

The BG DFC has lubricity, but says nothing of reducing pour point. I'm not saying it doesn't address cold weather fuel issues, but if that's important to you, you might check with the company to verify.

On edit:
Oh, it looks like the DFC+ addresses cold weather fuel concerns. I guess regular DFC doesn't?

-Ryan

 

[ALoehr]

well harvey may like the oil of his snake, but in the summer (Michigans U. P. ) I use a liberal glug or two in each tank of the cheapest TCW-3 outboard motor 2-stroke oil I can find... . be sure it is low ash, or your fuel filter will plug up in no time flat. I do this to combat the lower lubrication value in ULSD as compared to pre-07 low sulfur fuels. I have noticed some power/ milegae benefits, though minimal, but it does keep my fuel system well lubed and my VP44 running strong. In the winter I use either Power Service Diesel Fuel Supplement® +Cetane Boost® Power Service Products, diesel fuel additives, prevent gelling, clean injectors, disperse water, boost cetane, reduce emissions, improve fuel economyPower Service Products, diesel fuel additives, prevent gelling, clean injectors, disperse water, boos or Lubrication Engineers BTU+ Total Treat #2410 Lubrication Engineers - BTU<SUP>+</SUP> Diesel Fuel Improvers (2410-2420) which I would suggest when available. I mix both 50/50 with the TCW-3 and treat the tank with the recomended amount for the treatment. EX. ( 1 pint recomended amount, I would use 1 quart of the 50/50 blend) I will not claim unrealistic mileage/ power gains, but I do notice improved mileage and reduced combustion noise when using the L. E. product. oh yeah, and I have 240k and counting on my original VP44 w/ no issues if that gives any credit to the claims

 

[BGlidewell]

@<30F my truck started loping at cold start-up in park while warming up. After treating with stanadyne the lope never happened again.