Strange noise in 4wd following dealer replacing hubs

[W2VC]

I have a strange noise that I am not even sure how to explain. It sounds like a metal on metal kind of barking. It only happens in 4wd and only began after I had the truck in at the dealer to diagnose a few other issues I was having. I was at 99,932 miles when I got to the dealer. The drive home put me over 100,000 miles and honestly I am a little gun shy after paying the price for the hubs/wheel bearing replacement (Why that was not covered under the drive train warrantee I will never understand...) Does anyone have an idea what this might be? I suspect it had something to do with the hub replacement, but they also did the water pump recall, replaced an apparently damaged crankshaft position sensor and fixed a leaking front crankshaft seal.

 

[SnoKing]

Did you check the lug nut torque?

Time to get it back to the dealer that screwed up something in the work they did.



SnoKing

 

[petersonj]

After listening to your video a couple of times, it sounds to me like the sound is occurring at each revolution of either the front axle shaft, or the front drive shaft. I can't tell which because the video doesn't indicate road speed.

A front axle shaft revolution would be equal to a tire revolution. A front drive shaft revolution would be about 3 or 4 times per tire revolution, depending on the front differential gear ratio.

Observing the noise frequency may help you narrow down the problem area.

- John

 

[W2VC]

I did check the lug nuts. They are at least conforming to the German torque spec

Road speed was from 5mph to 15mph. I engaged 4wh just below 10 and as I was turning increased the speed to right around 15mph before slowing down.

 

[W2VC]

Perhaps y'all can lead me in the right direction with a couple of questions. On this front end, what parts do not turn when in 2wd? I know the hubs and axle stubs (I think) would continue turning. I would imagine the front diff does not, but a co-worker told me that only one axle is actually disconnected? Obviously I am accustomed to working on older 4x4 trucks and I know just a little north of squat on the newer systems...

 

[MW Gibson]

This will explain how the CAD system works and may help you figure out the problem.
http://www.4x4wire.com/dodge/tech/solid_axle_cad/ Good luck on your search.

 

[W2VC]

So just a quick update. The stealership will not look at it until the 5th. The sound is now occuring in 2wd as well but only when turning left, though I can hear it very slightly at speed (50-70mph). It has also begun grumbling when turning left at low speeds and the tinking noise that they said was caused by the hub is back. I have checked for play in the front end and everything seems right. No play in the ball joints, very little play at 12 and 6 on the left wheel. All bolts are torqued correctly on the wheel, hubs and breaks. Breaks have about 50% left and rotors are true and without grooves. Tie rods look good and u-joints have no slop. I am thinking it is in the front diff maybe? I am afraid to look at it since they should (hopefully) cover anything wrong with the diff as I did report the issue before the warrantee expired.

 

[W2VC]

And one more update. The mechanic heard the video that I took (I sent the dealer an email with it) and wanted to do a test drive with me in the vehicle. He cannot actually look at it until tomorrow afternoon, but after saying he had never heard anything like it before, he said that he thinks it is a u-joint on the passenger front axle. There is no play in the joint though so I don't know whether to believe this or not. If I am reading correctly, the U-joints are under the warrantee, if they do not try to claim reporting the issue and misdiagnosing before the end of the warrantee is null since it is now outside of the warrantee. We shall see. Anyone ever hear a dry u-joint sound like that?

 

[petersonj]

It is possible for a front axle shaft u-joint that is seizing to make a similar noise. If it is seizing, you would likely not feel any play because the lubricant would be gone and the needle bearings would be breaking up and filling the voids.

The only thing that wouldn't match the symptoms is that failing axle shaft u-joints usually make more noise during sharp turns (u-joint posts are rotating maximum distance within their caps) and they make very little or no noise traveling straight ahead (u-joint post is not rotating in cap, the u-joint posts are traveling end over end).

- John

 

[W2VC]

It is more prominent in 2wd when turning to the left... I guess I have always been lucky with u-joints failing in such a way that they were loose and clunked. Sounds like it very well could be the u-joints.

Thanks John!

 

[W2VC]

So the dealer slid my truck in today. They determined that the problem is with the front differential. Basically they say they need to replace the carrier assembly. I have followed the regular maintenance schedule on the truck, but they are claiming that any driving in the Texas panhandle/New Mexico is severe duty. They are demanding service records before they will submit it to MOPAR to try and get the warranty to cover it... He quoted me about $4,000 to do the job if they don't cover it. He would not tell me what precisely was wrong other than the carrier assembly is wore out, and that it is expected to wear out from 115,000 miles to 150,000 miles. I have a feeling I am being fed a line of baloney here.

 

[jhenderson]

Get away from there as quickly as possible. Get a copy of the estimate and diagnosis as evidence for future reference. Find a decent general repair shop and get a second opinion.

 

[W2VC]

Get away from there as quickly as possible. Get a copy of the estimate and diagnosis as evidence for future reference. Find a decent general repair shop and get a second opinion.

Yeah, I am with you. I could understand if they said "Well the side gears are chewed up" or "The carrier bearings are shot", I might have entertained the thought that they might be right. However, the lack of specificity on the actual issue, his determination that any driving out here is "severe duty", and the fact that he said even if it was done under the warranty that there would be no warranty on the replacement parts leads me to the conclusion that he is a con artist trying to meet a quota or something. I am going to ask them to show me the damage and tell them to button her up so I can find a transmission shop to have a look. After market carrier housings loaded are between $300 and $400, so all I really need is someone who can do the work. I have never rebuilt a diff, and while I am sure I could figure it out with a lot of time, I just feel this might be best left to a professional. Or a friend with the skills who works for beer. Either way, not these clowns at the dealership...

 

[sag2]

Look at your owners manual. According to the schedule in DealerConnect it says to check the diff's for leaks, and then it says,

Inspect the front and rear axle surfaces. If gear oil leakage is suspected, check the fluid level. If using your vehicle for police, taxi, fleet, off-road or frequent trailer towing change the axle fluid. *

I don't see anything about driving in the Texas pan handle.

 

[W2VC]

So I finally got the truck back today after paying about $200 for gear oil (really?!?), and I am looking at their quote and the service invoice. It looks like they are saying the problem is in the rear diff! Needless to say, I will be pulling the covers tomorrow and having my own look. The service invoice states that there were metal shavings in the diff cover and that there was "visible play in locking gears", but that it also failed to release the locker in reverse. Isn't the 10.5" an open diff? I would guess that means the locking gears are the spider gears? What do y'all make of their description?

The invoice states "REMOVED RF WHEEL VOCER RETORQUE AXLE NUT" which I am guessing is wheel cover. So maybe the metallic noise was the axle nut. Gotta find out what size that puppy is and the required torque. She did not make the noise on the drive to my office so hopefully it remains at bay. I will put her in 4wd on the way home and see what happens.

 

[W2VC]

So I finally got the truck back today after paying about $200 for gear oil (really?!?), and I am looking at their quote and the service invoice. It looks like they are saying the problem is in the rear diff! Needless to say, I will be pulling the covers tomorrow and having my own look. The service invoice states that there were metal shavings in the diff cover and that there was "visible play in locking gears", but that it also failed to release the locker in reverse. Isn't the 10.5" an open diff? I would guess that means the locking gears are the spider gears? What do y'all make of their description?

The invoice states "REMOVED RF WHEEL VOCER RETORQUE AXLE NUT" which I am guessing is wheel cover. So maybe the metallic noise was the axle nut. Gotta find out what size that puppy is and the required torque. She did not make the noise on the drive to my office so hopefully it remains at bay. I will put her in 4wd on the way home and see what happens.

I just read the 11.5" is a torsen, not an open diff. Interesting...