TDR Oil Tests

[Cummins Pilot]

Yeah, I know. But I just loved that Premium Blue formulation, and now it's gone. It's like I've lost a beloved pet or something.



I felt so vindicated all these years running PB when the TDR article came out. I guess if it will still carry the Cummins logo I'll continue to run it.

Ryan

I'll second that.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

You can also supplement your CJ-4 oil with some CI-4+ for an additive boost.

That option is looking better all the time!



Seems to be an excellent method of extending the use of dwindling CI4-Plus supplies. I'm thinking that a 3/1 ratio - 3 quarts of CJ to 1 quart of CI would do the job - any comments?

 

[Elite1]

I was wondering why they tested the Delvac 1300 & not the Mobil Delvac 1 (synthetic) ?

 

[Buffalo]

RBattelle,



If you don't mind going to a reasonably priced, fully synthetic, 5X40, you may want to consider the Schaeffer's 9000. I called them & spoke to one of their engineers & he told me that they will keep producing the 9000 as a CI-4+ until around 2010.



If you haven't heard of this oil, check on bob is the oil guy.com. It is, extremely, well thought of on that site. Great UOA results, also.



Schaeffer's 7000 (semi-synthetic, 15X40) is changing to the new CJ-4 rating.



Joe F. (Buffalo)

 

[rbattelle]

If you don't mind going to a reasonably priced, fully synthetic, 5X40, you may want to consider the Schaeffer's 9000. I called them & spoke to one of their engineers & he told me that they will keep producing the 9000 as a CI-4+ until around 2010.

Synthetics don't make much sense for my application, because I insist on frequent oil changes (3k miles). And I don't live in a very cold climate.

Ryan

 

[steved]

I was wondering why they tested the Delvac 1300 & not the Mobil Delvac 1 (synthetic) ?

IIRC, they compared MOST oils... started with conventionals, then did synthetics. Like any test, they can't do them all.



steved

 

[Buffalo]

Hi Ryan,



I certainly don't mean to criticize 3000 mile OCI's. You definately won't hurt anything except maybe you're wallet & the effort it takes to do those changes.



I've been extending my OCI's trying to get more "bang for my buck" out of the oil & filters. Was changing at 5000. Went into the 6000 range then 7000. My last change was at 9626 miles & the oil was still good, as confirmed by UOA (Chev. Delo-400, 15X40, CI-4+).



When I started to extend the intervals, I started doing UOA's to make sure I wasn't hurting anything. It's, certainly, not worth doing if you are going to damage your expensive engine.



One of the things that started me thinking about extended oil drain intervals was when I read, in the TDR, about a couple that towed, commercially, & changed their oil every 5000 miles (Rotella & Fleetguard filters). They had 1,153,000 on the engine without a rebuild. I was changing at 4000 miles, at that time. I, immediately, extended to 5000 miles. There's no way I'll ever see that many miles on any of my engines.



In your case, I know you love your truck & there is such a thing as that "warm, fuzzy feeling" that you get by REALLY taking care of your truck. That has value, also.



So, I'm not asking you to follow my advice but, I believe you could stretch the intervals, a bit, safely.



Joe F. (Buffalo)

 

[steved]

One of the things that started me thinking about extended oil drain intervals was when I read, in the TDR, about a couple that towed, commercially, & changed their oil every 5000 miles (Rotella & Fleetguard filters). They had 1,153,000 on the engine without a rebuild. I was changing at 4000 miles, at that time. I, immediately, extended to 5000 miles. There's no way I'll ever see that many miles on any of my engines.



Joe F. (Buffalo)

I did the same thing... was at 3k, then (because I tired of frequent changes and on the road changes) I started "extending" to 5k. I started the 04 on 5k intervals, then installed a bypass and reluctantly upped to 10k (which was confirmed by UOA)... it was a very hard thing to break myself of (shorter OCIs)...



Now I'm thinking of stretching to 15k or 20k, or maybe not changing oil and just changing the bypass filter... but it is still a very difficult decision to make... and I don't even consider the CJ-4/CI-4 debate.



I change my subaru's oil on 5k intervals... and don't even worry about it.



It is all about your comfort zone...



steved

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

The silence from the Amsoil Zealots is deafening.....

On a serious note, the results of my used to be beloved Delo 400 burns my ***, but what can you expect from our crack EPA and predatory oil ?

Here is a comment Amsoilman made regarding the new CJ-4 (Post 15) and even by Amsoil's favorite wear test (infamous 4-ball) it doesn't stack up as well against the CI-4.
https://www.turbodieselregister.com...sions-2003-2007/170402-amsoil-engine-oil.html

I'm glad I got 5 gallons of CI-4 stocked up which will get me another 40,000 miles after this current oil change. Hopefully Amsoil will keep producing CI-4, if not I'm going to check into the Schafers.

I thought someone posted on running Amsoil's CJ-4 on a long drain and had good wear metal numbers, but I couldn't find it so don't take my word for that.

On the subject of oil change intervals one guy I knew with a '91 only changed his dino oil every 10,000 miles and the original untouched engine was doing fine at 1,250,000 miles when he sold it. Unless you're pretty bombed and sooting it up fast 3000 miles is pretty overkill. Other than soot our Cummins engines produce a lot less parasitic combustion byproducts than gas engines do.

 

[Crash&Burn]

WOW... ... ... . just found 5 gal Rotella 15w40 CI 4... at $41. 99



they had more, maybe I should go back!

 

[24V-DSL]

I'd go for it.



I bought 20 cases of Delo 400 CI -4+ today at a farm implement dealer in my area. That'll last me for 110K. I'm bummed over the change and apparent crappy results of the Delo CJ4.

 

[RGardner]

Got 8 gallons of Rotella synthetic yesterday for $15. 50 at the local farm supply store.

 

[BTowler]

Synthetics don't make much sense for my application, because I insist on frequent oil changes (3k miles). And I don't live in a very cold climate.



Ryan

Synthetic is also superior for hot climates, and 3000 is overkill.



As far as grade, I saw a post that showed Cummins recommends 5w40 for all engines if you run synthetic.

 

[ROADWARRIOR]

I've got good news if you like Cen-Pe-Co oil. I think this e-mail says something about their product also.



Dan



Yes. No formula change. I do not anticipate a change in the ParaSynthetic formula until the majority of equipment has a diesel particulate filter in the exhaust, which is probably more than 10 years away.



The only reason we would consider changing it is if we could make it better. I think we have demonstrated that we will not compromise older equipment to meet the latest specs, which is why we have Antique Engine Oil, Classic Engine OIl, Racing Oil, and Steam Cylinder Oil. None of them meet the most recent specs, but they are all far superior in the engines they are intended for.



Blaine



-----Original Message-----

From: Mandy Koch

Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 8:41 AM

To: -- email address removed --

Subject: RE: Para Synthetic 15w-40



So you are saying that the Parasynthetic is the same blend that it was a year ago and has not been altered to meet the CJ-4 specs. If this is the case, how long do you guys plan on making it to the CI-4 specs? Will it always be available?



Thanks,

Dan



-----Original Message-----

From: Blaine Ballentine [mailto:blaine@cenpeco.com]

Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 11:14 AM

To: 'Mandy'

Subject: RE: Para Synthetic 15w-40



Dan



Cen-Pe-Co ParaSynthetic Oil exceeds API CI-4. We have a new oil called Cen-Pe-Co Extreme Duty Oil that meets CJ-4. I am not aware of any issues with CJ-4 oils, but CJ-4 limits the amount of detergent and antiwear additive we can use. I like the extra antiwear additive of our ParaSynthetic oil in the ISB, because it has sliding cam followers where all the big trucks have rolling cam followers. So, my advice is to use the ParaSynthetic unless you have a 2007 engine with a diesel particulate filter. By the way, extra antiwear additive is why I use the 10W-30 regular version of the ParaSynthetic oil in my cars.



Blaine Ballentine

Lubrication Engineer

Central Petroleum Company



-----Original Message-----

From: Mandy

Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 9:45 AM

To: -- email address removed --

Subject: Para Synthetic 15w-40



Hello,







I am currently using your Para Synthetic 15w-40 motor oil in my Cummins ISB motor. I was wondering if your latest oil of this variety was still CI-4 compliant or if it has been changed to the new CJ-4 specs? I have heard of some issues regarding the new CJ-4 oils and know that some manufacturers still make CI-4 oil and was hoping you are one of them.







Thanks,



Dan

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

OH how I love THIS part of the above post from an oil refiner - bold face is mine:

The only reason we would consider changing it is if we could make it better. I think we have demonstrated that we will not compromise older equipment to meet the latest specs, which is why we have Antique Engine Oil, Classic Engine OIl, Racing Oil, and Steam Cylinder Oil. None of them meet the most recent specs, but they are all far superior in the engines they are intended for.

At LAST an oil outfit that will openly ADMIT that the new stuff IS a "compromise", and one that WILL potentially harm older engines over the long haul...

 

[Greenleaf]

My oil supplier sells Shell Rottella T CI-4 Plus in 55 gallon drums. They will for some time. I also buy Schaeffer Supreme 7000 Synthetic Blend 15-40 CI-4 Plus. They will continue to manufactur this.



In my real world test, the Schaeffer oil is far better in terms of (much) less wear metals than the Shell Rotella CI-4 Plus. They gave me a copy of their test result as performed by a race engine builder. 7000 synthetic blend verses race oil of many other brands. Guess who's oil was far better when the bearings were removed?:-laf

 

[RGardner]

Anyone tried or running Mystick oil?

 

[magothy1]

Been using Mystik in the boat for awhile, it seems to do ok but I haven't run any oil tests on it. Handful of guys south of me have always liked it. I used Valvoline forever, loved it, but they quit with the distributor I use. I think it's a Citgo product, but I'm not sure of that.

 

[daveshoe]

There are always farm equipment dealers

Get on a tractor and lug the chisel plow through a clay hill. Watch the smoke roll and at night you may see the stack start to glow red. We are talking about serious lugging and extreme stuff compared to what we do to our trucks.

That being said,a source that may need to be investigated is farm equipment dealers. You still should be able to get 55 gallon drums of New Holland,John Deere,or other tractor oils. The Cummins engine originally installed in our trucks was the same unit installed in a Case tractor.

It would be very cool if the TDR techs could run tests on the ag oils and see how they stacked up. I hope all the tractor dealears will keep on stocking product for the older stuff. If not,it looks like we could always go with some of the premium ag oils.

 

[RGardner]

The John Deere oil was in the good catagory.