Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) timing tools, SP500 vs SPX 6860?

[rattle trap]

to the best of my knowledge i ve only found 2 tool kits specifically designed to address P7100 pump timing measurement/adjustment.



snap ons SP500 and otc/spx/miller 6860.



of course chrysler calls for the miller tool since miller is there official manufacturer.



im a bit confused on which tool kit is a better buy.



SP 500 is a pump gear puller, d valve adapter, d valve socket, and a metric dial indicator. it runs about $235

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Snap On SP 500



SPX 6860 is similar, but instead of a pump puller you get a barring tool and thrust washer. it runs about $100 more ($338)

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SPX 6860



ok, so either way i will need the OTC 1/2" barring tool but that is only about $50.



is the snap on style pump puller required? will regular style pullers work? what is the purpose of the SPX thrust washer? where can i get a thrust washer that would work if i ended up with the SP500? maybe some kind of transmission?



theres some complaints about the SP500's dial indicator. is the miller one any better?



i will be doing this with the timing cover off so the snap on style puller wont work for me this time, but maybe in the future?



any suggestions?

 

[BAnsley]

hello

Snap on buys their timming tools off otc,I have a otc kit and it has everything in it as shown with the snap on kit you show. As soon as i get back to the shop i will tell ya what part number i have.



Later Brian

 

[rattle trap]

hello

Snap on buys their timming tools off otc,I have a otc kit and it has everything in it as shown with the snap on kit you show. As soon as i get back to the shop i will tell ya what part number i have.



Later Brian

snap ons stuff for the SP500 is all stamped blue-point, and their barring tool isnt as good as OTCs.



since OTC is owned by SPX, my guess is, otc's kit has been discontinued OTC doesnt list them on their website anyways.



i would just buy these parts piece-meal if i could find the dial indicator extension anywhere.



plus i cant find the reason for the thrust washer ??? my only guess is it helps to tighten the pump nut to press the gear back on?

 

[TCorban]

I'll sell you my Miller SPX 6860 timing kit (used once) for $285 plus shipping from 43214. It worked great for me. The thrust washer set is a combo of flat washers and roller bearings- it looks like it's designed to prevent binding when you're tightening things down. I'm selling the truck, so I don't need it any more. I'm at -- email address removed --.

 

[WDixon27]

my snap on kit off the tool truck and otc barring tool from ebay work fine with no questions about anything, the puller worked fine with the cover on and with the cover off

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

I've done more than a dozen timing jobs with my Snap-on kit, works great.

 

[rattle trap]

oh ok, the puller works w/o cover as well? thats good.



i ve considered buying the parts the same way you did SP500+OTC 7471a.



i really want to put this together cheaply as possible.



im also entertaining choice #3. i read about the oil plug dial adapter, but i cannot find much info on it and whether it works with normal dial indicators.



im only entertaining this idea because i do allready own a dial indicator, regular puller, and d valve socket. trying to minimize redundancy in the tool box but dont have objections to buying a pre assembled kit.



so from what it looks like, thrust washers are used to seat gears and pulleys onto shafts, then you back the nut off, remove washer, and retorque? seems a lot of people have got away w/o one so i guess its only an extra convenience item

 

[TCorban]

Sorry- just noticed the cost on the Snap-on tools. I'll drop the price on my Miller SPX6860 set to $250 delivered so you can save some money over either option. -- email address removed --

 

[SpencerC]

the barring tool isnt 100% necessary if cost is an issue, just hook a 5/8" x 1/2drive socket on a ratchet or power handle onto the harmonic balancer and away you go. Or I believe you can put a socket onto the alternator pulley and go from there, never tried it but heard of others doing it for valve lash adjustments. .

 

[charlessmith]

I looked at Todd Corban's Miller SPX6860 set today. The "thrust washer stack" is several thin flat washers and a couple of radial roller bearings.



This is used when you have just pushed the pump gear back on the tapered pump shaft, and you are now going to tighten the big nut. The roller thrust washers are used under the nut as you tighten it, to prevent turning the pump gear due to friction between the nut and the pump gear. After you have tightened the nut the first time, take it back off, remove the roller thrust washers and since the pump gear is now stuck to the tapered pump shaft you can retighten the nut without shifting the gear on the shaft.



A very interesting note on the radial roller bearing washers. I believe these are identical to a radial roller thrust bearing used on the reverse gear in the Porsche 915 gearbox, used between 1972 and about 1982. I fitted one of Todd's roller bearings to one of these Porsche reverse gears that happened to be hiding on the back of a work bench, and it fits. If anybody wants, I can lookup the Porsche part number on this radial roller bearing, it can probably be sourced through a bearing house.

 

[rattle trap]

hey charlie thats pretty cool. i know T5 trannies use a similar bearing and i ve seen this used to press balancers back on, but dont have one handy to compare.

todd sent me some pics, but im in the process of moving to texas so ill need to wait until i have a permanent address.

 

[Dan_69GTX]

You say you already have a dial indicator - is it metric? I found it a pain to have to convert everything to metric - but it can be done.

Also check out the FAQ I created years ago regarding pump timing:
https://www.turbodieselregister.com...mission-faq/96154-pump-timing-p7100-pump.html

Dan

 

[rattle trap]

nice FAQ!



currently i only have a standard . 001" type.



i have considered buying a digital indicator that does both inch/metric, even then its still much less than the $200 snap on wants for there dial indicator. i guess the issue would be the special spacer though

 

[charlessmith]

I looked at Todd Corban's Miller SPX6860 set today. The "thrust washer stack" is several thin flat washers and a couple of radial roller bearings.

<... >

A very interesting note on the radial roller bearing washers. I believe these are identical to a radial roller thrust bearing used on the reverse gear in the Porsche 915 gearbox, used between 1972 and about 1982. I fitted one of Todd's roller bearings to one of these Porsche reverse gears that happened to be hiding on the back of a work bench, and it fits.

This radial bearing is used in Porsche transmissions from '65 through at least '83. The Porsche part number is 999. 202. 001. 00 Most of their 999. part numbers can be sourced commercially.



Forgive the condition of the bearing in the picture, it's the only one I could find on short notice ... you know in one of those boxes that have been under the work bench for 20 years

 

[rattle trap]

well the snap on guy got me!



SP500 is on its way, $157 incld tax.



so it still looks like otc will get my business on a barring tool though.

 

[charlessmith]

well the snap on guy got me!



SP500 is on its way, $157 incld tax.

Way to go!



I just bought a SP500 through the SnapOn web site. $262. 39 incl tax and shipping.



I should have gone through a friend's shop that's visited by a SnapOn dealer. #@$%!

 

[rattle trap]

i forgot students get some sort of discount from snap on, mac, matco, SK, and maybe more ???



its not 50% like they say, its a variable upto 50% and certain items are excluded. duplicates are also prohibited from discount and theres a total cap on spending as well.



after browsing the catalog, i really find not much else that spectacular in there.



only interested in dodge ram/cummins specific tools.

 

[WDixon27]

snap on online is only for the desperate, ya don't get no kiss with the *&$%ing they give you :-laf i think my sp500 was like 175 from mr tool, a non independent snap on truck is about as bad as online, we are between trucks at the moment and it sucks with no weekly service as crap still breaks and builds up after almost 4 months of no service, i am hoping we get a indy and not a factory guy, indy's will cut you a deal

Way to go!



I just bought a SP500 through the SnapOn web site. $262. 39 incl tax and shipping.



I should have gone through a friend's shop that's visited by a SnapOn dealer. #@$%!