Torque and aircraft engines

[Sageair]

This may be a rather unusual post as it does not deal with diesel engines but I have found that most people who are interested in things mechanical tend to be interested in all things mechanical so here goes. As a pilot I often look at the horsepower rating of piston aircraft engines (vs turbine engines) and wondered what kind of torque they develop as torque numbers are never reported. The engine I was most recently interested in is a Teledyne Continental T. S. I. O 550E. For those who care the engine nomenclature tells you alot about the engine. T S =turbosupercharging. I=injected. O=opposed cylinders(like a Volkswagen). 550=cubic inch displacement. E=series. At any rate this engine develops 350 H. P @ 2700 r. p. m which calculates to be (drum roll please)680 lb/ft of torque. And it will do so up to an altitude of approximately ft msl before H. P starts to drop off. I suspect that there may be a grand total of one person (me) who finds this interesting but there it is for what its worth.

 

[dmurdock]

make that 2... i have always been interested in airplane engines, especially the early ones (early 1900's)

 

[maint.man]

When I was in college, we had a IO540 and I beleive it was rated at 300hp. Like you said , it looks like a volkswagen on steroids . I tell ya', it did sound sweet , but not as sweet as the radial engines on the beechcraft D- 18 that was there. Oo.

 

[hdm48]

Well, my father had a BT13 with a P/W 985 rated @425hp. My favorate is a Merlin 1650-3 with a P-51-d behind it. Most kids had swing sets in their backyards, I had a L-5 and a f-105 ejection seat in the living room.

Just to pass it on, a BT-13 is most commonly called the Vaulte Vibrator. That's 3000 nuts and bolts flying in loose formation.

 

[BLACKRAM]

I'm interested. Tell me what amount of torque my Lyc IO360 puts out (A3B6D). That is 200 hp.

 

[DRR-24V]

SkyRaiders !

I worked on the Flight Deck of the USS Ranger. Those AD SkyRaiders with the R4350 engines didn't even mess with the catapult, they just flew off the deck even when loaded. The sound was unreal. That engine was a ring of fire in the dark, looked great. I was scared of those props at night though.

 

[Champane Flight]

Run

As a X mech on the old Lycoming recips and turbines, I can tell you that most aircraft engines run at peak torque. Holding a RPM is the most important factor on a aircraft. The old Skycranes used to have flex meters on the rotor blades to indicate when too much power was being used. They had twin monster turbines on them, with the power to rip the blades right off, without bleeding RPM..... The old Hueys were a little different, they would bleed off with a little weight on em. Although any crewchief worth his salt could beef em up a little... .

 

[K_Arts]

I am actually going through Aviation school right now for Avionics. I will actually ask my instructor today about this. Hopefully I can get an answer... LOL



Kev

 

[JConley]

The people to ask are the propeller Mfg's. The propeller blades are designed to keep the engine under a specified RPM at max power. The diameter of the prop also is a big factor since the propeller looses efficiency when the tips go supersonic. This is why you see short fat props on a C-130, and long thin blades on an Ultralight. Since the props are designed to convert the torque to thrust, they would be the ones that know this info.



I worked at an aircraft engine overhaul company, and I have torn down everything from a O-200 to a TIGO 541. The O-200 takes 4 hours to disassemble, the TIGO takes about 20.



Forgot to mention. Once when I was at Oshkosh, I saw a 5 cyl radial diesel engine. The Diesel is perfect for aircraft operations since the RPM's of a diesel are exactly where the gas engines operate. The only downside is the weight.





John

A&P IA

 

[GSchlegel]

Aircraft Engines - Love em

How many vehicles in regular operation today are still using 30's technology? How many gas engines today can do what an aircraft engine does day in and day out, ie. : produce 100% max rated power for over 5 minutes (takeoff and iniatial climb) and then operate for hours at 75% max. rated power and do this for 2000 hours?



I love their sound too, but I have preferences. The old Continental O-145 (145 hp) sounds a lot better then a Lycoming O-320 (150-160 hp) and a Continental IO-360 (6 cylinder - 200 hp) sounds better then a Lycoming IO-360 (4 Cylinder - 200 hp), (but my personnel experience says the Lycoming is more reliable). Of course the larger engines such as the IO-540 sound great. Next step up are the liquid cooled V-12s like the Allison and Merlin. For me the top of the heap are the radials. I don't care if its a Shakey Jake (Jacobs), P&W, Continental, or even that Russian geared, compressed air start radial thats available now. It makes 360 to 450 hp. Sorry, it's name escapes me. One of our local EAA members has a Russian 2 seat aerobatic plane that he demoed for us at one of our meetings. (Sorry, I can't believe my brain has locked up and I can't think of it's name either. ) If any of you can fill in the blanks, I would appreaciate it, meanwhile I'll try to do a brain re-boot.



Sorry I talked so long. Before I met my wife, aviation was my first love.



Gene

 

[Skydiver]

Torque at ground level

Because of the wide open area and almost no air traffic or red tape the city of Tuskeegee Alabama allows skydiving at their airport.

Most of you have heard of the

Tuskeegee air-men,may have even seen the movie.



Well from the stories told at the airstrip some of the air-men would fly low over the field say at 50 feet then go to full power. Yes the torque from those old war birds would roll them right over and into the ground. Was also told that a dozier would just push the crash off into the woods.

 

[GSchlegel]

Skydive,

That reminds me (brain starting to re-boot), the guy I bought a Luscumbe from was a test pilot for Beech Aircraft in Wichita. He occassionally would fly the prototype T-34C (PT-6 powered) down our runway in Benton, KS. The turbine in the prototype was not de-rated like the production aircraft. He would fly down the runway about 20' off the deck and then open up the turbine. He said he couldn't hold it level, the aceleration was so great he couldn't hold the stick in place, stick comes back and he climbs out. It was very impressive!

Gene

 

[Utah Willie]

Torque and Aircraft

Give me an R-2800 with stacks ... . ala B-25s... . or an R-4360 four row, twenty-eight cylinder, as in the later model F4Us... . Corsairs... with stacks..... makes a Cummins sound like a small cats' purr.

For smooth, though..... let's go for a 1710 Allison in a P-53, where the engine is about a foot behind the pilot ( and the driveshaft runs between his legs) and an energetic prime would have lit fuel running down the fuselage and onto the wing.....

 

[Skydiver]

Utah

I would like to see and hear 4 in row.

About once a year I get to ride in 1953 T-6 . Sometimes when the P&W wasp fires it will snort out a 4-foot long flame. 1300 cubic inches 9 cyl. Best sounding engine I've heard.

At the DZ one of the pilots gave the old cessna 182 an energetic prime and it backfired. Luckly the fire extinguisher was charged up. The fire did do a lot of damage but its fixable.

 

[DRR-24V]

Just Think About It !

Anytime you can get 1 HP per cubic inch on a gas engine, you are doing well. A/C engines have been doing this for years. R3350= 3350 HP. (water injected)

 

[Cobra]

oh yeah it interrests me too. I have some time in fixed wings but most of my flight time in in rotorwing. Hence the handle. I flew hueys and the mighty Cobra. All that torque from the engine is called P factor causing you to use more left (I believe) rudder on take off. Oo.

 

[ETOBICOKE]

Canadian Warplane Heritage

Have been down to the Canadian Warplane Heritage a few times in the last year to photograph their Tiger Moth. The last two times they have been working on the Firefly and the Lanc, here are some phots of the Packard Merlins in the Lancaster, from the information that I can find they are rated at 1640 hp each. As far as I can tell this about the max hp for a Merlin from that era. the Firefly has a single Griffon engine, the rating would be either 1730 or 1990 hp depending on the version of engine. This is the second Firefly this group has had, the first one crashed into Lake Ontario during an air show, and this one seems to be just as jinxed, it keeps eating engine parts. It's also lost most of one wing in a crash just after it was restored a few years back. Fortunately the company that originaly restored it was able manufacture a replacement wing pannel to replace the damaged one. The Lancaster has a distinctive sound and for it's size is quite agile, it's actualy able to make a 360 deg turn within the airport boundry.



http://community.webshots.com/photo/31869527/31870314HPlTpCykOa

side veiw of Packard Merlin in Lancaster



http://community.webshots.com/photo/31869527/31870172wmHxyMGJww

front view of Packard Merlin, note the leading edge of the wing is tipped up (hinged) revealing the wing spar and the engine plumbing and wiring



http://community.webshots.com/photo/31869527/31870404xblJJFRfaM

Firefly, Griffon engine, cylinders and heads have been removed to work on the cam shaft and valve train.



Neil

 

[Cobra]

Neil,

Sounds great but I couldn't bring up the pics. I clicked on the res x but nothing happened.

 

[Sageair]

2000ney

to calculate the torque of your engine multiply h. p x 5252 and divide by r. p. m

h. px5252

... ... ... ... ... .....

r. p. m

 

[ETOBICOKE]

Photos fixed I Hope

Photos worked last night right after I had posted them, but didn't work today. Web shots must have done something to prevent photo links from working properly. I edited in the URL for each photo, you will have to select the size to view it at.



Neil