Torque: DMax vs Cummins HO

[HiPerf360]

Originally posted by KennyM

Here is a link to the real numbers, these are from the EDGE web site.



http://www.edgeproductsinc.com/chart_dura.html



The D-Dud has proof it's a DUD.



Ken

Learn how to read a dyno sheet, The truck that Edge dynoed is obviously an auto. The higher the rpm when you start a run the lower your torque numbers will be. The HO Cummins is only available with a standard so you can start the run a lot earlier than 2250rpm and get a lot more accurate reading.



I want to see a six speed Duramax vs. HO Cummins on the same dyno the same day and started at the same rpm. I guarantee the Duramax would have more power to the rear wheels.

 

[PRout]

1. ) If we were to take a poll and find out how many Cummins owners have more than the D-max's 520 ft/lbs of torque, we'd fill up the server. 520 is no hurdle for a Cummins 5. 9.



2. ) Also so & so outsells Rolls Royce alot more than 2-1, so thats not much of an argument either.



'nuff said.



Go ahead, buy a dmax. You could have owned the real thing.

 

[HiPerf360]

Shortshift, Neither of your points have anything to do with what I said. I am not trying to bash the Cummins or D-max, they both have their strong points. And who said anyone was going to buy a Duramax? I love my Cummins but the day you can make an equal amount of power with a Duramax there will be one sitting in my driveway. I would even like to have a Ford but the dash is repulsive.



All I am trying to do is state the facts, I get sick of the brand loyalty BS where if it isn't a Dodge it's a POS. The truth right now is the Duramax is the most powerful diesel you can get in a light duty truck.

 

[KennyM]

I thought the argument was on RPM. When does the cummins with auto start to bulid, the Chebby/Allison starts at 2250. My truck Stock with Manual starts at 1500. :-{} Ken

 

[HiPerf360]

No, it doesn't. Automatics are very tricky to dyno, you have to start at a lot higher rpm to keep the converter locked and the transmission can't downshift. 2250 rpm is the lowest rpm the Chevy can start at and keep the transmission locked in overdrive.

 

[_MACKIN]

HiPerf360

Thank you for your truthful comments appreciated by more than me I'm sure.

You are correct. Dodge Cummins is one great truck I am sure every one how owns one wouldn't trade it for nothing wouldn't blame them or bash them. But the brand loyal BS is just that. The duramax is a powerful truck I know I drive one every day. When my truck (Allison)comes off the line rocks you back in the seat bone stock all I do is grin and say if they drove one I'll bet they would be very impressed. When I add my mods I'm sure it will pin you in the seat. All those dyno readings are auto #s. Allison grabs 60 rw hp to get it spinning.

MAC

 

[klenger]

Please excuse me for jumping into a conversation I know nothing about, but when you dyno an automatic, and you have to start the run at higher RPM's to keep the TC locked up, how does this translate to real world driving? In the real world, if your RPMs are down, and the TC is slipping, isn't a lot of the power wasted? I guess I see the point if you are trying to determine engine HP and torque, but power to the axle is what make the truck --->

 

[Chris N5CWM]

The DMax guys complain about the Allison

I have been lurking at the two main GM

diesel websites, The Diesel Page and GM Diesel.com for a long time.



My observations are that the Allison does

slip a lot when driving slow, ie, around

town. And there is a reflash that cures

a problem with transmission hunting for

gears at the slightest incline. It is typical

of any new product and has a lot of bugs

to be worked out yet. I'm glad that I'm

not one of GM's guinnea pigs!



-Chris

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Chris,

You mention 'hunting' for gears. . funny that you say that. The dealer I bought my 3500 from was a chevy dealer too.



The day I bought My truck I had driven my Moms F150w/ 5. 7 Triton V8 the weekend before. I had the opinion that the engine and transmission complemented each other.



When I drove the Chevy gasers I told my wife that they felt like they were 'hunting' for gears and she agreed. For my wife to notice it it had to be pretty bad.



She picked the 6spd over all the others. I liked it too but I would have gotten the auto to keep her from hating it.



Back to the Chevy transmission. . Its just odd that we'd all use the same term to describe the behavior. Maybe they haven't qute discovered the right correlation to throttle position engine speed and gear selection. Or mabe they respond a little too quickly.

 

[Alan Reagan]

Just to be clear, I'm not brand bashing anyone. My preference is that I don't like to drive a vehicle that shifts a lot. That's what I hated about my Ford. I pull 10,000 lbs and once I get moving I don't want a lot of shifting. That's why I want a straight shift with the power to pull it. I sure as he$$ don't want to see the Dmax be a piece of crap like the other stuff Chevy has built and called a Diesel truck. That only brings down the resell value of the good Diesel trucks already on the road. I owned a Chevy "Diesel" dually before. Like to have never got rid of the thing when it was time to sell it. My point is that I like my truck and the way it works. That's not brand loyalty. That's personal opinion. I have what I want. I don't own stock in Cummins or DC. When something better comes along that I like, I'll buy it. For now, I'll happily stay with what I have.

 

[PRout]

Originally posted by HiPerf360

Shortshift, Neither of your points have anything to do with what I said.

I believe we were discussing torque.

I would even like to have a Ford but the dash is repulsive.

You just jumped me for not staying on topic.

All I am trying to do is state the facts

The dash being repulsive isnt a fact. But, ok. Its your thread.

I love my Cummins but the day you can make an equal amount of power with a Duramax there will be one sitting in my driveway.

By the quote below, Youre already saying it makes more power now. Its kinda hard to have it both ways.

The truth right now is the Duramax is the most powerful diesel you can get in a light duty truck.

... Guess were not gonna factor in average life span, Proven history, or fuel mileage.



The Van Aaken, a 1 time 5 minute plug in.

#ad




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[Champane Flight]

Where?

Duramax tech:" Lets see? I need to find the intermeidiate throttle position imediater positive iononic senser? Is it under the dashboard under the transmission splicer shift transducer detecter? Because if I plug in the therminating pulsar emiter without disconecting it first, it will cause a negative ionic charge which will send into Allison into hyperdrive and short out my impulse speed shift analyzer!!!"



Most advanced? Maybe. Best? Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay!

 

[HiPerf360]

Shotrshift, Look at my sig..... That is the torque was talking about



Stock vs. stock the Duramax has more power.

 

[HiPerf360]

BTW... My truck has TWICE the power of the graphs you posted

 

[PRout]

Hiperf,



Very impressive torque coming out of your CUMMINS. Too bad the Dmax cant do that.



Time for me to bow out of this one, as it doesnt seem to be going anywhere.



Good luck w/ that new Chevy.

 

[Bad340fish]

Shortshift... . good use of the quotes.



Jon always :{ when people make fun of the Duramax lol.



I rode in one for the first time on thursday. Nice truck really. . wierd thing was that its quiter on the outside than on the inside. The trans really seems to work good empty. . not sure about with a load behind it. The guy that owns it is a friend of mine that has 4 or 5 of them for his company that haul mid sized utility trailers(guessing 5000lbs?) all over the country. They have had absolutely no trouble with them at all(the one I rode in was a 01 with 37K on it).



Actualy we do need Hiperf 360 to own a Dmax for testing reasons... . why you ask??? Because that boy Could screw up a steel ball . He has succesfullly injured everyting between the cummins and the Dana 80 on his truck. I say if he can have a Bombed Dmax for a year with little trouble its safe for anyone to own one

 

[Randy]

Hyperf360,

If you want more stock power, then wait for the 2003 High Output Cummins. It features the High Pressure Common Rail Injection system. The power output will be 305 HP and 555 ft/lbs torque. It will also have the option of a new high performance automatic. Lets see which engine will out perform, the Dura-dud or the mighty Cummins...

 

[JoeyD]

Why no 5spd auto?