trailer braking

[DannyGriffin]

Has any one tried the Max brake? I pull a lot of trailers and wondered if it was worth the money.

MaxBrake™ - Hydraulic over Electric Variable Brake Controller

 

[jgillott]

Take a look over at the Towing/Hauling and RV section of the TDR Forum for extensive reading on the MaxBrake controller. Most if not all of the owners who use them have very high reviews of the product.



Personally, I feel that they give a feeling of control over the trailer that I haven't found in an inertia type controller. I highly recommend it.

 

[RustyJC]

The MaxBrake is worth every penny, and then some.



Rusty

 

[HBarlow]

I have not used a MaxBrake but have owned and used a BrakeSmart for about seven years and a couple hundred thousand towing miles. It is an outstanding product that provides trailer braking precisely proportioned and responsive to the tow vehicle's brake pedal.

The BrakeSmart was the forerunner, before the MaxBrake, that was manufactured and offered to the public about eight or nine years ago but, unfortunately, was developed by one company and sold to another company that lacked the financial resources to properly manufacture and market the product.

The MaxBrake uses the same engineerig principles. It uses a pressure sensor to measure hydraulic brake line pressure created by the driver's right foot and uses a mini-computer to convert brake pressure to trailer braking. Both of the controllers, BrakeSmart and MaxBrake, are the best brake controllers money can buy. You can be absolutely certain that a MaxBrake will provide you with the best trailer braking you ever experienced.

Southwest Wheel Company Steel and Aluminum Truck Wheels is an excellent source to buy from.

I have no connection with MaxBrake or Southwest Wheel.

 

[jelag]

Rusty is right... even if he rides a BMW instead of a Goldwing (smiles. . ) for that matter so is Harvey...

And they both work well with electric over hydraulic brakes...

Danny, can you add to your profile and list your truck...

BTW - this topic is now under discussion under Towing & Hauling

 

[JLandry]

Southwest Wheel Company Steel and Aluminum Truck Wheels is an excellent source to buy from.

Don't forget TDR members get a 5% discount from Southwest Wheel by using the code "turbodiesel" (without the quotes) at checkout.



John L.

 

[HBarlow]

Rusty is right... even if he rides a BMW instead of a Goldwing (smiles. . ) for that matter so is Harvey...

And they both work well with electric over hydraulic brakes...

Danny, can you add to your profile and list your truck...

BTW - this topic is now under discussion under Towing & Hauling

Completely irrelevant and off topic but I only ride a Honda ST1300 . . . but am looking pretty seriously at a Goldwing.

 

[HBarlow]

Don't forget TDR members get a 5% discount from Southwest Wheel by using the code "turbodiesel" (without the quotes) at checkout.

John L.

I didn't know that! Thanks for the tip.

I live close to the Lubbock branch of Southwest Wheel and shop there from time to time as a walk-in customer. I was just in there this week to buy a seven pin female connector.

 

[Dutch & Di]

We have been using ours for almost 2 years. We pull a 38'Carriage 5th wheel with our 3500 and are fulltimers. Before that we had the Jordan Ultima and really thought we would be hard pressed to find one better than the Jordan when it was no longer available. Boy were we wrong. It has worked flawlessly. We both drive and really like the fact that we don't have to change the settings when we change drivers or go from highway to city. Diana

Has any one tried the Max brake? I pull a lot of trailers and wondered if it was worth the money.

MaxBrake™ - Hydraulic over Electric Variable Brake Controller

 

[Robin]

It is a shame the Jordan Ultima is no longer available. It had features that no other brake controller can equal. I've used one for years. With the Jordan the initial application point and the rate of application can be adjusted. You can adjust it to apply the trailer brakes before the tow vehicle brake. And you can adjust how quickly the trailer braking increases as you apply the tow vehicle brakes. Recently I installed hydraulic brakes on our tri-axle fifth wheel and the Jordan works flawlessly with them.

 

[HBarlow]

The Jordan brake controller is not sold any longer, perhaps because of the pressure sensing proportional brake controllers BrakeSmart and MaxBrake which are far superior to the Jordan. I suspect their sales disappeared.

Try a MaxBrake and you'll understand what the rest of us are talking about.

 

[RustyJC]

The Jordan brake controller is not sold any longer, perhaps because of the pressure sensing proportional brake controllers BrakeSmart and MaxBrake which are far superior to the Jordan.

Harvey,



With all respect, I ran with a Jordan Ultima 2020 in our 2002 until we took delivery of the new truck - it's still running for the 2002's new owners. The only difference between the Jordan and the pressure-sensing controllers is that the Jordan took its input from the brake pedal position (i. e. , travel in its stroke) rather than hydraulic system pressure. I don't debate that the pressure sensing controllers are the ultimate in brake controller technology, but to say that they are "far superior" to the Jordan is really a stretch. In terms of performance, if the inertial controllers are a 3 and the hydraulic controllers are a 9 on a 1-10 scale, the Jordan was a solid 7 or maybe 8.



Actually, the Jordan is no longer on the market because Jordan (can't remember his last name) retired, and his was a one-man company. He sold the intellectual rights to his next brake controller to Camco, but the purchasing company hasn't brought anything to market because of the depressed state of the RV marketplace (or so they say).



Rusty

 

[AH64ID]

The only drawback I can see to these kind of controllers is the lack of a proportional brake with the exhaust brake on. Example, your coming down a hill and have the EB turned on, if all you do is touch the service brakes a proportional controller will sense the deceleration from the EB and brake the trailer accordingly. From how I read about the operation of pressure sensing units you will not get as much trailer braking this way. I do this often and it works very well to maintain or decelerate down a long hill without using the service brakes.

 

[jelag]

AH64ID

After several hundred thousand miles running both an exhaust brake an the Max Brake I can share with you... that we'd tow a 15K lb trailer down a 6% grade and use the right gear in the transmission and never have to touch the brakes on the truck... . (exhaust brake only) as the trailer would go over the 15K to the 22K lb range that we often had to tow with first an 01 and later an 04, we'd have to use the service brake to keep it under control... The exhaust brake alone wasn't enough to slow that much load... BTW these are trailer weights using the PacBrake exhaust brake, here in the Pacific Northwest in 5 western states and Canada...

 

[AH64ID]

That sounds about right based on what I have seen in the few heavy trailers I have towed.

But my point is that with a proportional controller, like a Prodigy, if your EB is on and slowing the load if you touch the brakes enough to engage the Prodigy it will brake the trailer in proportion to the braking energy of the exhaust brake, but a Max Brake wouldn't do anything that way.

There are some winding roads around here where the EB holds the speed perfectly, but you need to slow a little on the corners, with my Prodigy I just have to touch the brakes and the trailer brakes come on and slow me the required amount, if I need more slowing then I press the service brakes and get braking from the truck.

 

[HBarlow]

A Prodigy brake controller requires pressing the service brake pedal in order to activate inertia braking so it would NOT come on in response to deceleration created by the exhaust brake unless the service brake pedal is pressed.

So what would you gain? If an exhaust brake or the exhaust brake function of the turbocharger (ISB6. 7) doesn't provide sufficient braking to hold back a heavy load the driver has to press the service brake with any brake controller.

Buy and install a MaxBrake and you'll be throwing your Prodigy in the nearest dumpster.

 

[AH64ID]

A Prodigy brake controller requires pressing the service brake pedal in order to activate inertia braking so it would NOT come on in response to deceleration created by the exhaust brake unless the service brake pedal is pressed. [/QUOTE]



Which is why I stated if you touch your brake pedal. I am sure you have noticed you can touch your brake pedal just barely and activate the brake lights and brake controller and NOT get any braking.

So what would you gain? If an exhaust brake or the exhaust brake function of the turbocharger (ISB6. 7) doesn't provide sufficient braking to hold back a heavy load the driver has to press the service brake with any brake controller.

You gain the ability to brake with the trailer and the EB and not the service brakes without having to manually run the trailer brakes.

Buy and install a MaxBrake and you'll be throwing your Prodigy in the nearest dumpster.

I don't doubt its better in every aspect except where you want most of your braking to come from the EB and the trailer. If its not proportional you can't do that.

 

[RustyJC]

I don't doubt its better in every aspect except where you want most of your braking to come from the EB and the trailer. If its not proportional you can't do that.

This word "proportional" gets tossed around a lot in brake controller discussions. It means that the output generated by the brake controller to the trailer brakes is proportional to the braking effort of the tow vehicle's braking system. Other than the old ramped, time-based controllers, just about every controller claims to be "proportional". In fact, the brake system pressure sensing controllers are totally and completely proportional as the output of the controller is a direct function of (i. e. , is directly proportional to) the hydraulic pressure in the brake system of the truck.



The inertial controller's characteristic of generating trailer brake output under the conditions you cite has nothing to do with "proportionality".



Rusty

 

[AH64ID]

What ever term that you want to use to define the brake controllers that brake the trailer proportional to the deceleration of the tow vehicle, not the brake position, will allow for better trailer braking with the exhaust brake functioning than any controller that does not look at the rate of deceleration.

Proportional based controls offer a smooth braking response to almost any stop. Through the use of a sensing device, the brake control can determine the tow vehicle's rate of deceleration and then apply the trailer brakes to match. In other words, Proportional controls deliver power to the trailer brakes in direct relationship to the actual physical deceleration of the tow vehicle.

The exhaust brake is considered a secondary brake; however, when properly used they can negate the need for the service brakes in many grades and towing applications. Braking the trailer harder than the tow vehicle also provides for more control and better handling, especially on winding mountain roads. So for me its vital to be able to get the trailer to start braking easily with the deceleration of the exhaust brake.

Not to mention the owners manual says not to tap into the hydraulics for trailer brakes in bold.

 

[HBarlow]

Your opinion is your right but you don't know what you're talking about. Quoting advertising hype from a Prodigy product is as valuable as a current politician's promises.

I bought my first travel trailer back in the early 1970s. In those days we used an old-fashioned but extremely effective Kelsey-Hayes hydraulic-electric controller that tapped directly into a brake line off the master cylinder. Hydraulic pressure was routed to the controller mounted under the dash via a length of copper tubing through the firewall. Hydraulic line pressure directly activated a rheostat in the controller providing trailer braking. The KH provided precisely modulated trailer braking exactly as called for by the driver.

When lawyers and do-gooder regulatory agencies killed sales of KH products by suing manufacturers when fools crashed their tow vehicles and trailers companies like Tekonsha began marketing the useless, erratic, unreliable motion-sensing junk you are fond of. I've tried several of them and found them worthless. The driver never knows if he'll lock the trailer brakes or push through an intersection against a red light.

Try a MaxBrake and then you'll realize what we're talking about. Bragging on a Prodigy only makes you look silly to those of us who know better.

Please post the quote from the Dodge Owner's Manual. Thousands of knowledgeable trailer pullers who have pulled trailers hundreds of thousands of miles are using BrakeSmart and MaxBrake controllers very successfully. Their numbers are growing every business day.

After several years of frustration with the useless Tekonsha Voyager controller trying to tow a triple axle Airstream I found a brand new but old Kelsey-Hayes brake controller in an RV dealer's parts department back around 1998-1999. I bought it and installed it in my then '94 Furd F-250. The Furd had front disc brakes and rear drums. The K-H worked perfectly. I tried to give the useless Voyager away and finally threw it in a dumpster.

When I bought my first Dodge 3500 in 2001 I installed the K-H. It worked fine but my Dodge was a 2001. 5 with four wheel disc brakes. The hydraulic line pressure of a four disc system was too high for the brake controller to handle. When I applied the brakes line pressure slammed the rheostat so violently I knew it would soon be destroyed so I removed it and put it on a shelf.

A year or so ago I gave it to a friend who has an early 2001 Dodge-Cummins 3500 he pulls a heavy fifth wheel and a small VW dune buggy on a trailer behind. He was too cheap to buy a MaxBrake and installed my old K-H controller in his truck. His Dodge has front discs and rear drums. He loves it. The old K-H provides perfectly modulated braking every time he touches the pedal. He had been blowing through intersections towing double or slowing to crawl speed as he passed through small towns with traffic lights. Now he can cruise at the speed limit with confidence.

I spoke with the engineers at Kelsey-Hayes (the name has changed to Hayes-Lemmerz or something similar now) several years ago about their controllers. The engineer explained that their brake controllers were perfectly safe and functional in modern ABS trucks because they didn't displace much brake fluid. I haven't looked at a GM brochure in several years but GM truck brochures used to contain a fine print line that stated a hydraulic-electric brake controller that tapped into the truck's brake lines was acceptable as long as the brake controller did not displace more than a specified small quantity of brake fluid, something like . 02 cu. in. of fluid.

Please don't waste your time and keystrokes trying to convince those of us who know better of the virtues of a useless inertia sensing brake controller.