Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) transmission cooler fans

[Big White Beast]

Well since the weather has warmed up I'm not to happy with how hot the transmission was getting in traffic. Pretty much normal at speed but around town I'd hit 210° easy. So I decided to try something. Just got done installing 2 small SPAL fans on the transmission cooler. Ordered them from Mattsons radiator in L. A. at $42 each. Their site say's 330 CFM each and 6. 3 amps draw. Must have a high start up current though. Turning both on I popped several 20 amp fuses trouble shooting it. A 25 amp fuse held fine. My meter won't read DC current that high so all I could really do was check the wire if it was getting warm. Didn't seem to be at all, so I'll attribute it to start up draw on the motors. I hooked them up thru a switch near the transmission gauge that fires a relay and decided to put a LED so I'd remember if they were on. Can't hear them over the Cummins.



Todays actually a nice day so I'll report back on any significant gains when it's hotter out. I was a little worried that they would block too much air when off but there doesn't seem to be any temp difference.



Garrett



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[Lsfarm]

Part number?

Hi Garrett, can you supply us with the part number for these fans? I have been looking for some small shallow fans like you show, but all that I have found are too deep, and cause interference with the back side of the grill.



thanks Greg L

 

[Big White Beast]

Greg,

Here is the sight I got them from. I didn't look around too much, so you may be able to find them cheaper. Look under products, then fans tables, it lists them all with current draw, CFM & depth.



http://www.mattsonsradiator.com/



If you look at the pics this is attempt number 2. I tried only one fan before and had it mounted a little lower than the top one in the pic. This interfered with the hood a little bit. Actually ground a little of my grill away. Mounted in this location it clears it no problem. Should have fudged with it just a little more the first time.



If you want more details of how I mounted them I can take some more close ups and send the to you. Let me know at



-- email address removed --



Garrett

 

[Big White Beast]

Another thought.......

They do have thermostats available to hook to these. Although I'm not sure where you'd draw the temp from. I think SPA gauges have alarm outputs that might work. Any ideas on how one might make a temp sensor work so that it came on at say 160° (line temp)? Might have to put another sensor on the line. I know the pan temps are cooler than these but when sitting for a long time in traffic there wasn't much air flow so it couldn't be too cool either.



I have the Mag pan so I could put a sensor in there. Wonder if they make a 1/8" NPT switch that I could just thread in.



Off on another internet search.



Garrett

 

[Big White Beast]

Checked current.......

Bought a cheap ammeter just to make sure. It's the gauge type that goes in the dash and reads 0-60.



Fired up the fans and it flashes way past 60 and then settles to 11-12 amps. Right about where the manufacturer said. That gave me a little piece of mind. I'm sure the inrush isn't past 60 as my 25 amp fuse will hold it. Cheap gauge probably always jumps when current is applied.



Anyone know if they make a slow-blow fuse for the standard atc type fuses? I've got it wired into my painless wiring so it's not a mini.



Garrett

 

[Dave MacArthur]

Garrett-



What is your engine coolant temp doing when the trans goes that high? I've been thinking about this lately. We have two trans coolers. One is the trans oil to engine coolant heat exchanger and the other is the trans oil to air heat exchanger that you put the fans in front of. I don't have a transmission temp gauge yet so I don't know how much correlation there is when the trans temp starts heading up. I'm installing a Horton fan and I think that I will be able to significantly drop my transmission temp using that. My thinking is that the stock fan clutch is not doing any of us any good as far as the trans temp is concerned. It activates due to air temp and therefore when you are moving slow around town you aren't getting enough air flow through the radiator to cool the trans. At least with the Horton, I can hit the manual switch if I see the trans temp going up (as soon as I install a gauge). The Horton has an engine coolant sensor and an A/C pressure sensor. Either one will turn on the fan. I think it would be a good idea if it had a trans temp sensor as well but I'm wondering if there is enough heat going into the engine coolant to turn it on anyway. It may be though that the trans temp can go too high without the engine coolant going up enough to turn on the fan. Anyone have any more info?



Thanks,



Dave.

 

[Jeepthing]

What size spal fans did you use?

 

[Big White Beast]

They are 6.5" fans........

Dave I had another thread about transmission temps and my new thermostat. I put the 180° thermostat in and the truck runs much cooler now. I believe though that the lower temps do not turn on the fan as much. Without pulling much air through the shroud the transmission temps get a little hotter. In theory anyway.



It was a little warmer today and the fans didn't seem to help a lot. Then again it's hard to tell. I'm monitoring line temps. Those are the hottest and am not really sure how the pan temps will effect the output. I know it has to help cool the fluid down going back to the pan. How much I can't tell.



I'm thinking of getting a second sender for my transmission gauge and mounting it in my mag pans port. I could flip a switch and see how it effects the pan temps. Either way their in to stay now.



Garrett

 

[PBayer]

Garret

I had a 2001 auto w/DTT. Also not happy with the rising temps. I tried the same fan setup and saw no noticable reduction in temp. Besides the temp comcern I just didnt like the auto in a diesel truck so I traded it in for a 02 6 speed. Problem is solved. I love it.

Paul

 

[Dave MacArthur]

Garrett and others,



Are your transmission temps running much higher than the engine coolant temps? How much higher? In theory, shouldn't the engine coolant be absorbing/equalizing the trans heat?



p. s.



Maybe this is a little justification for the Horton Fan . Being able to turn it on at any time to cool the trans temps down. I know someone else posted that they installed an intake air temp gauge and were able to reduce their intake charge temps by turning on their Horton.

 

[Big White Beast]

Output temps.......

As I posted earlier these are the temps from the output line on the transmission. I'm sure the pan temps are closer to engine temps when idling. That's also why I don't see a big gain from the fans on my gauge.



I have the 180° thermostat and the engine runs cool. Even with my heavy truck in the hotter weather. Both those fans and the relay cost me around $110, that's way less than the horton setup. If I had other heat issues I'd probably think more about it then.



Garrett

 

[Midnite]

Re: Checked current.......

Originally posted by Big White Beast

Anyone know if they make a slow-blow fuse for the standard atc type fuses? I've got it wired into my painless wiring so it's not a mini.

Wouldn't a circuit breaker work? I've seen some that are manual reset, and others that reset automatically. I would think that an auto-reset breaker would be just the thing for what you've got.



Mike

 

[Bandit1]

i to have seen the 210 degrees while idleing with my DTT 89% tc, bill said that is well within specs but i put an electric fan over my transmission cooler back in may, i only use it while idleing and my temps dont go up as fast but i am sure that it has to help with the pan temps since i my gauge is in the out line that is the hottest part before it goes through the heat exchanger. i am satisfied with my setup and this one looks even better since it is a dual set up, looks great

 

[Big White Beast]

Midnite.......

I thought about that too. Only problem is if it trips because of inrush current it will reset and same thing happen again. It's 14 gauge wire from the painlees fuse box to the relay and 12 out from there so I think it's covered. I was just a little worried till I got the ammeter and read running amps.



Now I am looking into a way to tap the pcm signal to trip another lower voltage relay so I can have the fans on untill I hit OD. I have my OD default to off when the truck starts and never turn it on till I'm at 60 and up.



Going to need and instruction manual for all the gadgets before I'm done.



Garrett

 

[badams1]

Trans fluid temps

I noticed my trans temps going up in traffic while unloaded right after I had the BD t/c installed. I have a dual Westach gauge setup. One side reading the trans outlet temp before the cooler on the engine where it gets the hottest. I was seeing 250F+ on that gauge while idling in gear here in Houston summer heat. I called the BD guys and they acted like that was no big deal. I did not like that high-a-temp because I felt it would degrade my ATF4, synthetic or not. Hey! the higher the temp the less time between fluid changes, there is data to prove this. My other gauge is set up to read from the big Mag hytec pan where I get to 180F max!. I have the largest Perma-cool thermostat controlled , fan powered cooler set at 180F after the radiator cooler so that, saves the trany. I put the transmission selector in neutral at long stops. The high temps start coming down right away because the t/c is not churning that ATF4 against the brakes. I may wear out the neutral switch often but I won't allow the system to get above 200F using the above procedure and equipment. It works!



2001. 5 auto with way too much money invested. But I love my truck!

 

[jburnes]

I had some temp probs too. I ran a remote cooler w/ fan (DERALE #15800). I cut and flared my return line from my cooler running the best hose available (300 degrees high pressue hose).

It was easy and has added 1 qt to my fluid caps and have not got above 185 since. I also included a fan heat sensor and powered it all w/ a painless 4/3 system(also very!!!easy to install 10-20 minutes). Cost for all was about $250 but well worth it.



'96,4X4, 56K,3. 54's, Banks, 4"t-t Rip Rook exaust, 285's, New transmission done right!

 

[Hittinger]

Jburnes

I would like to know if you connected your Derale #15800 oil cooler between the T. C. and the water to oil cooler. Towing trailers in the southwest while pulling hills your water temp. goes over 220* due to the trans fluid dumping high heat in the water to oil cooler. How did you mount the cooler to the frame? Any other ideas you came up with everyone would like to know. Jburnes took Garret's idea of the fan in front of the air to oil cooler to the next level.







Keith

 

[rweis]

I have a couple of questions.



The transmission is working, the oil flows out and we measure it at it's hottest point. If the transmission works less hard, or the oil going in is cooler would the hottest point be cooler? How does the transmission work less hard? Not sure unless it is keep the rpm's up so the torque is higher, the pump is pumping faster and pushing more oil through the coolers. I don't know, maybe someone out there does.



The water exchange cooler is based on water temp. If the water temp is closer to the minimum temp (180 degrees in my 2002) would the transmission cooling be better? How long is the transmission fluid in the water exchanger? What if it were there 10 times as long? (ie MUCH larger). Are we looking at the wrong end of the stick? How can we cool the engine better? would that cool the transmission better, the induction air better, better combustion, yada, yada, yada. Is the transmission air exchanger fans a band-aid, or just one of the only ways we can work on the problem? I don't know.



I'm starting to think that if I can keep the engine temps NO higher than thermostat temp of 180 it might be a different approach, but no idea if it would work. As I understand it the engine does need to be a a minimum temp for good combustion, and since the thermostat is 180 degrees, I would assume (you know where assuming gets you?) that 180 is the minimum acceptable temp.



What about the northern guys, what happens to your transmission temps when your thermostats are barely open?, are they lower (measured at the crossover line and also at the pan)? Are the pan temps lower because the engine and outside air temps are lower?



Just not convinced we are working the correct end of the problem. Has anyone run a LARGE water heat exchanger, and held the engine temps really down? Full time fan etc, maybe electric for HP reasons?



Sorry about the ramblings, but the solutions don't seem to be solving.



Bob Weis

 

[Hittinger]

Observations on heat from transmission

The other day I ran some errands in the morning with lots of traffic so fluid temp. went up to 180*-190*. When I got home at noon I raised the hood to check the oil and my hand rested on the radiator . It was cool to the touch ( outside temp in the low 50* ) engine not really warmed up. Then for some strange reason I put my hand on the radiator behind the air to oil cooler and I burned my hand from the heat. The difference in temp from one side to the other on the face of the radiator was night and day. Behind the AC condenser was cool to the touch but behind the air to oil cooler you could not put your hand there.

The engine and radiator can take care of the transfer of heat but when you dump all the excessive transmission oil heat my water temp runs at red line alot.





Keith

 

[rweis]

In the service manual for 2002 page 7-3 the radiator coolant flow goes from the transmission cooler side to the side where the turbine is, ie truck right to left as you are facing the front of the truck looking from front to the back. So the transmission side would be the side right out of the engine and HOT, and the other side by the alternator would be the cooler side after the radiator has done its thing.



Bob Weis