transmission questions

[RedRamer]

Don't mean to start another transmission fight, just looking for general answers from those with some transmission experience pulling trailers.

I'd like to buy the DTT transmission but it's too much money.

Mine works but there are a few things that bother me...

Speed limit up here is mostly 100kph and with 3. 54s I pull 110kph at 1,875 RPM, 100kph @ 1725 RPM

I feel it's too low a speed for good TCC pressure. Last month I pulled an 8'x8' billboard trailer box a thousand miles and felt that the transmission was slipping as the peddle seemd lower than it should be for the speed, but RPMs were OK.

The other thing I don;'t like is 200+ transmission temps when in towns or heavy traffic, mostly in 2nd or even going up a steep incline in 2nd - that's heats it up in no time.

A transmission shop tells me if I put in a shift kit, it will increase oil flow and I could then increase the pressure a bit. Says that would lock up the TCC better and help keep the transmission cooler.

I don't want to drive in 3rd cause this transmission should pull in OD locked up, right?

Any comments?

 

[pwr2tow]

Line pressures are relavent to peddle position so the more you push on the go peddle the more line pressure in the transmission. The reason your foot was in the throttle more is because you were pulling a load and haveing the foot in the throttle more is a good thing when pulling as far as line pressure is concerned, bad for fuel mileage but good for line pressure.



A good modified valve body should take care of your concerns for the short term as long as you do not add alot of power enhancements, stay under 60 extra HP.



Instead of the valve body you could add a pressure lock and then a simple toggle switch to ground and keep the converter locked in lower gears which would help keep temps down, but you will have to remember to turn the switch off when going too slow or comeing to a stop or you will kill the engine just like a manual without pushing in the clutch.



My recommendations would be both of the above and then start saveing money for a TC for later.



Ron

 

[Extreme1]

A couple other things:



1) Pulling in 3rd with the T/C locked will lower trans temps compared to leaving it in O/D and not getting into lock up. I have my gauge hooked up to the line out to the cooler and as soon as the T/C locks, the temp DROPS!



2) There is an anti drainback valve that in the cooler line that you could remove to get better flow. (Not sure if it's in a '97)

 

[Fish]

goober,

as you can see below, I have the brake-torquelock-pressurelock setup. I use 3rd locked up for town towing and it rarely gets over 200. Torque converter will lockup at 35 mph on the flat and 40 on a moderate hill. Once it locks up ,slowly increase the throttle until it downshifts, then let off until it locks up again. Hold that and it will climb town hills without a problem and temps in the 170 area. My sensor is on the way to the cooler. The pressurelock keeps the pressure up high so the torque converter doesn't slip or shudder and the temps stay low. On steeper hills I just back off on the throttle to keep the temps down. I leave the system on any time I am going up and down hills.



If you are in OD the transmission won't lock the TC until 52 mph, so you spend all that extra time in "slushpot" making bubbles in your fluid which greatly reduces its' ablility to be cooled and you get high temps and transmission wear. If you have high temps in your fluid you need to change it pretty soon to avoid further damage to the bands and clutches. When I accelerate on a freeway ramp, I run it up to 50 mph in 3rd locked and shift to OD when I'm settled in my lane. I never get hot temps even with the brake system off.



When I was in Nova Scotia last fall, I would use the OD on the flats and going down hills if they weren't too curvy. When the speed dropped off on a hill from 100K to about 90, I would push the button for 3rd, let the TC lockup and climb the hill and push the button again just before the crest and let it go to OD again. That way the transmission doesn't lug getting ready to shift and has plenty of power to climb the hill. Never climb a steep hill in cruise. It will floorboard the throttle and over heat every time.



Also, many Ram owners are not using the correct trans fluid (ATF+3 or 4), and many others do not know that the transmission fluid pump doesn't work in park and that you should cycle through reverse and drive before checking the fluid level in neutral! It should be checked after the engine warm-up, not cold. The first time I checked mine correctly after I started towing, I had to add 3 and a half quarts!! Murphy is alive and well!!



Warren Fisher

 

[RedRamer]

Thanks guys;

This was the first I heard of the BD Pressurelock device.

Read some on it and it sounds like the cat's meowwww.

It should take care of my low pressure, low RPM concerns on the highway.

I agree about running it up to speed on 3rd lockup. The real problem I have is overheating in 2nd. Seems every Town has a stop sign at the bottom of a hill and huge climb from getgo on the other side. Never can get her up to 3rd.

The other time is in heavy traffic, stop and go and backing up with trailer.

Those get my temps up to 230+ in no time.

Was thinking maybe a 2nd cooler with a fan and the shift kit as this transmission guy tells me it will increase the pressure / flow. I'll ask more about these shift kits tho.

goober



btw Fish, I got a good friend in Slidell met up here years ago with wife Becky. Used to do some shrimping and sent me a **** load of e'm one time!!! Decent diesel mechanic too.

 

[Fish]

Yeah Goober,

You can't go much of anywhere in Louisiana without going through Slidell. This little town has 3 freeways that merge about a mile from my house. What was your friends last name? I might know him.



I wouldn't modify your truck until it is out of warranty and extended service contract. They cancelled my contract because of the brake system.



How much does your trailer weigh? Do you have the heavy duty towing package? I talked to the guy at DTT and he suggested I get the oversized pan with the radiating fins before I got extra coolers. It's good for about 20 degrees in most situations.

Good luck!

Warren

 

[RedRamer]

His name is Roland Whal, retired, used to do mechanic work for a paving co.

My warranty!!!

See my sig?

 

[Fish]

Steve H

Sorry about that! You can't see all that stuff from the message writing window.

I think some of the difference is the 4. 10 rear end I have makes it go up hills better, but out of OD I have had the TC lockup as low as 30 and go up some pretty steep hills that way, but I'm sure the pressurelock helps a lot.

I sorry, but I don't know Mr. Whal.

7K is what I used to have. The one I just got is 10k. I expect things are going to get harder. What'cha think?



Warren

 

[pwr2tow]

If you use the toggle switch idea (mystery switch) I would recommend not useing it for backing or shifting through gears, only when you reach the speed you want, then engage the toggle switch for lockup and better cooling of the trans.



Ron

 

[RedRamer]

Fish;

I tried a 2k steel bin in the box along with the trailer once. That was pushing it imo. No more getgo speed, real slouch on the hills. I woulda needed the 4. 10s. Woulda been alright with a 230 plate probably, but then what about the transmission right?

Around here, it's mostly flat lands, so 98% of the time the 3. 54s are fine for cruising. Problem is, I cruise at low RPM. We're planning BC trips and southwest states in the future, that's why I like to get things ready for it now.

I think your 4. 10s will be just right for 10k, and will probably equal my set-up (3. 54 w/7k). I just don't know about those hills though. I find my setup just on the shy side of the power I really want. That's why I'm hunting for transmission solutions before I power up to the 230 plate.

Not too many folks seem to have experience with the pressureloc.

I read some posts where BKondolay hammered the mistery switch / torque loc system and some systems included the pressureloc and I think the pressureloc was an inocent bystander.

btw: I like the way you guys make a stew,,, with shrimps no less. !!!! Gumbo something... Becky made one once... what a treat!



RonsRam1999

What's that IAT change in the your signature? That's quite a boost.

 

[Fish]

Goober,

Yeah, I have a lot in the bed also. [Box? I thought boxes were horse trailers] I have a 200 lb generator, firewood and a bunch of other junk. I got a tonneau cover from Camper World that fits around the kingpin with a spandex gasket. Keeps everything pretty dry.

What is a 230 plate?

I'm afraid I don't watch rpm's much unless they are close to max and I watch them to see when the TC locks up in 3rd. Seems to me they are a little under 2000 at 60/100K which is the speed I usually run in OD, and a little over at 65. I'll pay closer attention when I haul out next time and get back to you.

When are you going on your trips? I've got a convention in June at Chicago and will be heading through Wisconsin toward Winnepeg and Bamf in early July. Maybe we can meet up somewhere?



You're right about the BD systems. I've only seen about 3 people on the forums that have all three components like I do. I was concerned about downhill braking and fluid overheat when I went to Diesel Injection Service, and this is what they recommended. I think its an excellent system with a stock engine , but the transmission can't handle a bunch of extra horspower without having problems.



Bill Kondaly is selling TC's and Trannys. He wants to put questions in people's minds so he can sell more of his stuff. I don't really blame him. I expect it's hard to work around a competitors product to make your stuff work right. I also think it's the people that race these trucks that really tear up transmissions not people like us who are just trying to get over the next hill safely.



In town, if I forget the system and start up a hill, as soon as I turn it on, the temp rise slows to about half and rarely gets over 200 degrees. I'm sure that is because of the pressurelock.



The other problem is that most people turn the system on in OD and leave it on when they take an off ramp. The transmission stays in OD down to 30 mph and when the system drops out it has a heck of a time going through 3rd and 2nd to get to idle. It shudders and shakes which ain't very good for anything. This is a peculiarity of Dodge because the shifting sequence is 1-2,1-3 instead of 1,2,3 like ford and Chevy. So I use the system in overdrive only going down hills at 50+ and if I need to take a ramp in the middle of one, I turn the system off, hit the OD button and when the rpm's stabilize, turn the system back on, accellerate slightly to let the system actuate, then let off the pedal to ride the exhaust brake down to 30 where it has no problem going to idle. If you don't Murphy will get you.



Are you sure the gumbo had shrimp and not crayfish? I like the mudbugs' taste a lot better than shrimp and they are usually considerably larger. I hope I didn't spoil your memory.



Warren

 

[Bob Wagner]

Originally posted by Fish

Goober,









Bill Kondaly is selling TC's and Trannys. He wants to put questions in people's minds so he can sell more of his stuff. I don't really blame him. I expect it's hard to work around a competitors product to make your stuff work right. I also think it's the people that race these trucks that really tear up transmissions not people like us who are just trying to get over the next hill safely.

Warren

Warren, That is a bald face lie. Have you ever spoken to Bill Kondolay?



If you have you would have known that is a BS statement



Shame on you!

 

[RedRamer]

Uh Ohhhh!

Warren, looks like the dust is kicking up round here.

Gotta watch what you say when talkin trannies, you know:-{}



Your system includes the exaust brake right? So when you're talking of hiting the button when going on an off ramp, you're doing this for the brake release, right?

But what about the pressureloc system. Do you have to turn that on and off for whatever reason? I didn't read anything about it having a switch or something.

The 230 plate is 230hp injection pump plate, considered a mild bombing around these parts.

This year's trip will be Ontario, north up by Cochrane, Timmins, ThunderBay etc. Good fishin and lots of dry-camping spots. Alaska is next summer!

When Roland came up, he had a crate of shrimps - solid blocks with about 50-100 in each block and he brought along 7 blocks. No, that gumbo was shrimps! Some friend of his still shrimps on the lake.



Bob Wagner - - - please read line #1 of post #1 in this thread.

 

[Fish]

goober

No. The button to leave overdrive for 3rd. I do all my exhaust braking to a stop in 3rd. Everything is connected to one switch for turning the system on. There is another switch on the pedal that tells the system when you are decelarating. As long as you are maintaining speed or accelerating, the Brake stays off. As soon as you let off the pedal the brake valve closes to hold the back pressure on the engine and releases at 30 mph. Anytime the system is on, the pressurelock is on. If you are in 3rd and just turn the switch on while already decelarating, the brake comes on, but the torguelock doesn't, so you have to goose the pedal a little so the torguelock will actuate. BD doesn't tell you this in their manuals. The brake is ineffective without the torquelock. They do mention the shudder coming out of OD while stopping.



This procedure is what works best for me.



Oh well, maybe we can hook up some other time. I spend most of my summers somewhere up there.



Warren

 

[RedRamer]

Will do for sure. If you're near Niagara Falls, let me know.

Plan one of these days to be down to Slidell also.

Keep in touch and I'll let you know how I make out.

goober

 

[Fish]

Mr. Wagner

You are wrong. I have talked to mr. Kondalay, both on the phone and by email. He is a very nice and concerned person and knows a lot about transmissions. But when he makes an attack on a competitors equipment without disclosing how the truck was used and how overpowered the engine was, he is not telling you all of the circumstances that contributed to the failure. He is telling you what he thinks is the cause or what he believes you need to hear. This is his opinion. It is part of the sales process practiced by businesses everywhere. I am quite familiar with the process having been in sales myself for over forty years. I am sure that some the trannys he referred to had pressurelocks installed, but I'm not convinced that the pressurelock was the sole cause of the transmission failure. I have had a Pressurelock installed for 40,000 miles and I don't have any torque converter problems. Of course, he may not know the circumstances and the owner of the truck probably won't confess that he hot-dawged his way into the problem.



My point is this, Mr. Kondalay stated his opinion. General statements have always bothered me. Just like abusive statements about minorities, they condemn all for the errors of a few. They make me wonder about motivations! I certainly don't have the expertise that he has in transmissions, but I wonder how he can examine the remains of a transmission and say without reservation that a competitors product is solely at fault. There are too many unknowns in the situation. But saying so, I'm sure, didn't hurt his business any!



Now Mr. Wagner, I admire your steadfast support for mr. Kondalay although I doubt that he needs it. But you have stated that what I say falls behind a bull and that I am a liar.



DO THIS AGAIN AT YOUR PERIL!

 

[pwr2tow]

Warren,

OOHH OOHH now you went and done it, the "good ole boys" aren't going to let you in now, and your condemned to a life in hell from Mr. Wagner.



If you don't want to hear about another DTT ******* match DO NOT READ ON::



I have been trying to get Bill to fess up to certain things for quite some time and he always use's his marketing ploys to tip toe around me. I will admit Mr. Kondolay is a little smarter than me when it comes to these games, but I am learning.



Like a great man once told me(analogy):: give him enough rope and one day he'll hang himself.



I just got hackled by his followers on another thread. I asked him some questions and did not make them clear enough, and in my opinion he tip toed around them, so I asked point blank, one way, no way out questions, I'am still waiting for his answers.



Ron

 

[Snow man]

Goober, if it were my truck,I would not install a lockup switch to keep it in lockup,this is not becaue i own a DTT product,it is because by installing this,you are keep the transmission from kicking down as needed,forcing it to stay in to high a gear,and locked up no less is not conductive to long engine life. If you drive with one hand on the switch,and turn it on and off,at the right times,it will not hurt a thing,IMO,but no does this,we relax after a few miles,and forget about it. I did it to my 96. As far as the pressure lock,im no transmission expert,but with stock power,i feel you will get more for your money with a valve boby or shift kit,that actually raise you pressures across the board,not just in lockup,and firm up shifts,as well as allow some oil cooling in park. Then if you decide to slide the plate forwrd,or put in a fuel plate,your transmission wont need any more mods to hold the power. I have used both DTT valve bodys,and trans go shift kits,they both held the extra power and eliminated the slippage. I'm sure the BD,ATS and ,any other valve body would work fine as well. On a side note,you guys who are seeing high trans temps out of lockup,this is telling you the TC is not efficient,it is wasting to much power,turning it into heat,so the true fix is a quality torque convertor that will cut a lot of the slippage out,and this will bring your trans temps down to safe levels without having to force a lockup. My trans temp has only exceeed 200 hot line once,it was while plowing a heavy wet strom,in a tight area,and the temps quickly came down once i moved to the other side of the lot,When towing my backhoe,8000 lbs,the temps never ,ever get above 185,and they dont go up much when its out of lockup either. I didnt have guages when the transmission was stock,so icant give back to back readings of stock vs DTT.

 

[Fish]

Originally posted by Snow man

Goober, if it were my truck,I would not install a lockup switch to keep it in lockup,this is not becaue i own a DTT product,it is because by installing this,you are keep the transmission from kicking down as needed,forcing it to stay in to high a gear,and locked up no less is not conductive to long engine life.



(Snow man,

I think you and I and Goober are talking about different things. You are talking about a switch directly controling the TC lock up. )



(We are talking about a switch that turns on a system module that modifies the way that the Torque Convertor works so that as long as the engine is decelerating with your foot off the pedal, the TC will stay locked and give exhaust braking down to 30 mph. )



As far as the pressure lock,im no transmission expert,but with stock power,i feel you will get more for your money with a valve boby or shift kit,that actually raise you pressures across the board,not just in lockup,and firm up shifts,as well as allow some oil cooling in park.



(You are mis-informed. Whenever the Pressurelock is on the pressures are up all around. )



On a side note,you guys who are seeing high trans temps out of lockup,this is telling you the TC is not efficient,it is wasting too much power,turning it into heat,so the true fix is a quality torque convertor that will cut a lot of the slippage out,



(I agree, but this is often not economically possible. On the other hand, I feel some of the problems are due to having the transmission OD on, letting it downshift automatically and trying to climb hills that way. It will stay unlocked all the way up the hill if you never reach 52 mph. Your temps will go out the top!

In my opinion, OD off is the better choice. Put the pedal down until you get close to 30 mph and start backing off on the pedal until the TC locks up and you should have all the power you need for most hills!)





and this will bring your trans temps down to safe levels without having to force a lockup. My trans temp has only exceeed 200 hot line once,it was while plowing a heavy wet strom,in a tight area,and the temps quickly came down once i moved to the other side of the lot,When towing my backhoe,8000 lbs,the temps never ,ever get above 185,





(Mine don't either as long as the Pressurelock is on. )



and they dont go up much when its out of lockup either. I didnt have guages when the transmission was stock,so icant give back to back readings of stock vs DTT.

(It sounds like your equipment is effective. What did it cost you? Mine was $1200)



Warren

 

[Snow man]

Fish,my setup didnt cost much more than yours,(1600)ish,but i did my own install,Ive got a lot of my time into it,its worth every penny DTT charges to profesionally install it all. You cant compare your setup to mine with a stock TC,there is no comparison,I had the stock TC long enough,the engine revs,but the truck hardly increases in speed,you literally need to get into lockup to accelerate decent. This why your temps are high out of lockup. If your happy with the stock TC's performance,and you are hapy with your setup,thats all that matters,I wasnt happy with my TC ,even with stock power,and i wasnt happy with my 96"s stock TC either,it always felt like the trans was slipping,from the fluid coupling being to loose. I never did change the TC on my 96,and i used the mystery switch a lot similar to how you use yours,out of necessity,you just couldnt put the power down until you locked it up,it just revs,and hardly moved. That trans was on it way out when i got rid of the truck,the Tc was shot,I knew that from the material in the trans pan i found, I credit that to running the lockup switch,and the TST#6.