Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) TST Powermax problems

[Diesel Dale]

Ok gang,I could use you vast wealth of knowledge here,,I am a new member and a TST dealer out east here and have a little problem,,I have been installing the Powermax box in some of my customers trucks and have developed a minor problem I need some help with,,Seems the trucks have been cutting out(leaning out or defueling) and then abruptly return to normal service,,It seems to be happening when they are fueling up while driving at normal conditions or even when a severe stomp of the loud pedal is applied,one even does it at idle at times,,The box does not dim at all so power is not lost and they have the new map sensor harness and the crimp connector changed at the pump,,TST tells me the box is not the problem and I'm at a loss so any help is greatly appreciated,,I have done a search here and can not seem to find what I am looking,,The problem is not year specfic as the trucks in question are years 1999,2000,2001,,Any ideas??????

 

[DRR-24V]

Why not try hooking up a fuel pressure guage to one of the problem trucks and see if it's running out of fuel pressure?

 

[Todd T]

Mark may not like to hear this, but it is the box. or the connection of it to the vehicle alone.



I truely believe it is the Map harness. but could be the PM loosing ground or power momentarily and flacking out the MAP sensor.



it is a stumble that I have felt several times in my truck and cannot isolate it or duplicate it. I have talked with others and they have the same thing, but nothing fixes it.



to date I have soldered the connection for the power at the trucks harness, greased (dielectric) the ground and the connector at pump and replaced the fuse assembly with a BUS type fuse and holder.



and every once in a while the truck takes a stumble and then alls well until the next time. mine has never done it at idle but everywhere in between. part throttle, hard acceleration, constant speed. you name it.



Oh yah, I have recrimped the map sensor harness and greased it too. checked for the oins being bent or pushed back in the connector. the list goes on.



chin up, maybe someday someone will find it.



just remebered, I changed the Map sensor (new) and cleaned the AIT, which was not dirty to begin with.

 

[MikeR]

Todd and Dale,

I agree with you about Mark not liking to hear that it is the box... well it is. I've had the same random thing happening since about Dec of last year (box was installed in Nov). Mine's a std PM3.



At first I thought it was a cut out or stumble,but when it does it a slow speeds,I noticed it's a surge or burst of power. Mine doesn't do it very often at all,but it does it at; highway cruising,city cruising,powering up,or creeping through parking lots. It never surges when the switch is turned off (stock power),and doesn't matter what level it's on when it does.

I have unplugged it and drove it for a long time,then upon reconnecting it,it surged again. Yes,I had a psi gauge hooked up to 2 different lift pumps when it surged,and the pumps didn't skip.

I replaced and soldered every connector with OEM automotive connectors,replaced the glass fuse with an ATO style,I also cleaned the IAT and MAP sensors,I replaced the lift pump *AND* I replaced the ECM with a Cummins unit. No matter what was replaced,it still does it! At one time I had a Blue Box on for a few week test,and my truck never stumble with it.



I didn't want to say anything on the TDR for a long time because I thought I had an isolated problem and only knew of one other person with the same thing,and until I knew all the components on my truck weren't causing this. Apperently I'm not alone.



I love my PM3 and want to continue using it,but I would sure like to get rid of the surge. I emailed Mark my findings a couple weeks ago,but haven't heard back yet.



-Mike

 

[EScott]

I too have seen the stumble (PM-3 w/remote) but have noticed a curious coincidence. The ONLY time I have ever had it happen is if I run my tank down to below an 1/8th of a tank and then fill. Within the first 1/8th down from full I will get usually one stumble...



That's it for the rest of the tank I am good, and if I don't run too long with the low fuel light on it NEVER happens. Could it be water? I dunno. I would prefer that it didn't happen at all.

 

[**ICEMAN**]

mine too!! one quick little stumble and might not get it again for weeks. i just had it reprogramed to a competition series and it did it once. but man oh man,, you wanna talk about throwing you back in the seat,,wow! what a difference. yeah i know that i signed a waiver that it was for off-road use only,,but oh well. now to work on the fuel delivery,,0psi at half throttle on level 5. my stumble didn't occur while mashing the throttle,,just cruising 70mph,,,very light throttle. thanks dale for the concern and trying to pin point the problem. keep us posted.



p/s: by the way,,,WELCOME ABOARD!!!!!

 

[CumminsAholic]

Well guys, I have a miss too. Only at full throttle with my box turned on. Not all of the time, not even half of the time, usually like once a month, if that. The difference between me and you though is I don't have a PM. I have a BD 4 wire box. Same thing as a PM and blue box though.

Corey

 

[Briar Hopper]

I've experienced this "stumble" with TWO different boxes... the first time was with the original PowerEdge I had. Exchanged it for a new one, the new one did the same hiccup about a month afterwards...

I get a hiccup about once every two weeks from my TST PM3 Competition version. Even though my fuel curve has been re-programmed.

I doubt it's the boxes doing it. It's got to be something like a programming glitch in the engine's ECM (maybe they used Microsoft windows 98? ) Or the MAP sensor harness. I really think it's just a defueling thing, a little hitch in time where ECM fails to cooperate with the fueling box, for just an instant.

I've seen such anomalies in the robotics interface programs I use at work.

Anybody with a Blue Chip box ever experience this hiccup/stumble? I bet they have... .

JMHO here, pick it to pieces if you want. The truck runs, I ain't gonna hassle Mark, or the boys at Edge, about it. So it scares the wee out of me once in awhile? Not as often as the radar detector does. THAT one is good for heart failure, and sweaty hands!!!

 

[blackbeast]

If all connections have been checked, and by checked, I mean using a meter, check resistance of all connections. (We have seen this before, where all connections "seemed good", but there was a high resistance connection)

Try putting a ferrite coil on the pump wire. These can be had from any Radio Shack for a few dollars. I would also put one on the power lead to the box. You may have to move the coil around, but about 6 inches from the tap should be good.



It's worth a try.

 

[MHindman]

I know Todd t and I had the same problem with our tst boxes. I went back and forth with Mark and my dealer about this. My box would cut out at times. I went over all the problems with the box with Mark. Connections, new wires, he even sent me a new box to try. After a lot of pissin around, and some time... the lift pump and the injection pump went out. I had my dealer look at the truck about a week before, and the pressure was OK, and so was the map sensor. So I would say, if you have went through all the stuff with Mark, then I would say its the pumps. But its not going to be easy to get your dealer to change the pumps. After I got my truck back the problem was gone. And it ran great. Keep in mind I did solider and all that mess before I found the problem. Anyone know what it would take to put the PM3 from a 99 onto a 01? Do I need a connector of what?

 

[Bigsaint]

Me too

Count me in . I was on the way into work last week, decided that I haven't played with the TST in a while (PM Comp. with remote). Up'd the remote to level 6, nailed it after taking a slow turn, threw me back in the seat until I hit about 2500 (4th gear) then stumbled real bad. Post FP was 7 psi's. I checked all the connections at work, waited patiently for the end of the tour, raced my buddy in his 5. 0 GT ( I won), without the box on. Turned the box to level 6 for the rest of the ride home, no stumble at all through the gears and under hard acceleration .



MHindman, all you need is a new Map wiring harness. When I purchased mine from Enterprise, they shipped a triangular Map plug by accident, a quick call had the correct (flat plug) at my door in two days.



Scott W.

 

[Joseph Donnelly]

Be careful with the Scotchlok connector on the fuel pump wire. Crimp it on with needle nose pliers and then DO NOT turn it on the wire or the connection will be bad. For example, one Ram would not respond to changes in the 10 level remote control. Putting the Scotchlok on again in another place and not moving it at all after crimping it fixed the problem.

 

[Todd T]

I'm not blaming the Box. I think there is an Integration problem between it and the truck. either wiring or something other.



or i could just be a glitch that the truck always had, but with the boxes now controlling more of the fuleing they amplify the problem to the point that we can feel it.



as far as i can tell, it will do both surge and stumble. I have felt my truck do both. it is not running out of fuel (see my Sig) i have 18 PSI at idle and 14 while cruising. i cant say it has ever done it under a full throttle stomp. it is always either just costing or under light throttle.



I have noticed, it is more likely to happen in high humidity and/or after sitting overnight in rain or humid weather. that leads me to believe it is MAP sensor or a bad connection somewhere.



Joe D. I havent touched that pump wire since it was installed. not even when I greased it, i used a small pocket screwdriver to apply the grease around the connector and wire. do you think it could just be the vibration? maybe I should tape or hotglue the wire to the pump so it wont move or vibrate?



I'll try that and see what goes



the only thing i noticed about fuel level, was the surging trouble I was having. since I put the helper pump on and replaced the lift pump. I havent noticed the surging, accept when it gets cold out, it comes back a little, and I mean very little.

 

[Ramboy]

You are guys aren't alone with your PM's. I have the same problem with my Ottomind. When it happens, it happens several times in a few days. Then I can go for several weeks before it will do it again. Sometimes happens right after heavy acceleration and sometimes during heavy acceleration. I haven't been able to establish any definite pattern. Sure gives you a sinking feeling when it does happen though.

Phil

 

[Mopar-muscle]

gee , i guess i'm glad i have my old tecnology power edge wit ha hot 3 , only time i had a stumble was when the crimp connector broke off the pump wire from the engine vibration . other than that never a miss ... for it to be happening to all these trucks points to either evryone twisting the scotchlok as joe d says or ??????

 

[Briar Hopper]

Good point about the Scotchlok, but I'm not using one. I have the original "stealth" needle connector that came from Edge Products when I bought my PowerEdge. I simply hooked the TST wire to the connector and left it, it's right there in the original location on my pump wire... . I never did like Scotchloks for ANYTHING...

Sure, it's possible there's a weak connection even with the needle connector, too much resistance. Most plausible explanation so far, and the most commonly heard among the dealers selling these boxes...

I believe Mark at TST has a new high-tech connector for the pump wire, I saw it on display at the Scheid Diesel Extravaganza, but did not get to ask about it. It looked wild, like it'd REALLY get the job done. Somebody ought to call and ask about that connector. I'd like to know, myself, about price and availability of that connector... .

 

[WOWZY]

I got the pleasure of testing some of the original PowerEdge boxes. Some of them had a stumble and some didn't. Brett and Taylor at Edge Products found it to be noise interference and corrected it by adding better noise shielding to the box and and the Pigtail. After that the stumbles were non-existent.



It probably is the same thing happening to the TST boxes.

 

[CumminsAholic]

I think Wowzy could be on to something here... Do ya happen to know what kind on noise shielding?

Corey

 

[DarrellB]

About That New Connector

I to was having problems with my PowerMax. I called Mark at TST a couple of times on diffrent problems, one was the Map sensor connector was not making a good connection and truck would not build any boost. He instructed my on a couple of things to do and I did these and it took care off the problem. One was to use this stuff called wire dry spray it on both connections and let it dry and push them back together. Works great have not had any problems since. Not too long after I took care of that one I lost all boost in the truck, called Mark back, just Monday and he told me it was the map sensor itself. I bought a new map sensor $21 and installed it and it works great now. But while I was on the phone with Mark I told him I was not happy with the scotch lock connector on the pump wire he told me to come up that he had a new connector that would not go bad or loose it's connection. I'm going up Monday of next week to TST to get them to install the connector and put a new end on the wire for the boost sensor. By the way Mark said he would not charge me for any of this.

I will let you guys know how the connector works out and if it's as good as Mark says it is. I might even buy some more goodies for the RAM.



Later

Big D

 

[TBrown]

It sounds like most of you having problems are using scotchlocks. I had the same problems with mine, it was random and would go away if I played with the connection at the pump. Last time I had my truck down changing the transmission, I figured it was about time to fix the connection problem. I took off the connector, cut the pump wire where the the connector was. Soldered two three inch wire extensions onto the pump wire I had cut in half, sealed the connections with shrink tube, solder the two ends together like you would put them toghether to join with a wire nut. Then soldered another wire to them and soldered a blade connector that hooks to the TST harnes. All of the connections were sealed in shrink tube. Was a bit worried about cutting the wire, but it has worked flawlessly. Started up with out missing a beat. One thing about driving these trucks if you ever have a stumble is, even after it is fixed and gone. Ever time you hit certian rough road surfaces they sometimes feel like a stumble, and it gives you a sick feeling, still can't get over it. I did this about 6,000 miles ago and haven't had any problems since.