ultra low sulfer fuel

[Gary - K7GLD]

Gary,Try to stay calm. I didn't claim to have answers. I asked the question. I mentioned European use because they have been using fuel that meets the new US standard for a while and someone here might have some info.



My original Post, " Any info on what the effect (if any) of this new "ultra" low sulfer diesel fuel on ist gen components will be?"



If I wanted someone to ***** at me I would have asked my wife.

Calm down, cool off...



My comment was aimed not only to your post, but also others who blithely compare what we are SUPPOSED to be getting in the new ULSD, against what they ASSUME the Europeans have BEEN using in recent years - yet we know NOTHING of what legislated standards, safeguards and controls THEY have in place as compared to our own.



Thus, "Apples/Oranges.



Watch that blood pressure - no quarrel was evident or intended on my part!

 

[Diesel Gunner]

Well Fellas,



If you are in Kommiefornia you have been getting ULSD for several weeks now if not a few months. That is all that the refineries here are producing. In fact, they are producing ULSD that is somewhere around 7-8ppm sulphur content due to Kommiefornia requiring a September 1, 2006 compliance date. The rest of the country has a December 1, 2006(?) compliance date. I am not 100% sure about the national date, my notes are on my desk at work. I will bring them home and post later.



The new spec is 15ppm sulphur and there is an ASTM spec for lubricity that all Kommiefornia fuel will meet. Go ahead a burn red fuel if you feel lucky. It is the very same ULSD with dye in it. Will the ASTM spec for lubricity be the end all? Who knows? For me, I will continue to use Clear Diesel and put my additive in it, and keep one eye glued to my fuel pressure gauge. I hate that GD lift pump.



There is allot of BS floating around out there about this as usual. I will post the website with the info that I was given after I get home from work tomorrow.

 

[Greenleaf]

ULS fuel Facts

Warning: This post is long for them who hate long informative posts.



There are some facts that we need to understand about the new fuel. The ASTM has set forth standards for lubricity. Please understand that our (I'm speaking to the 1st gen crowd as I always do) trucks have a much wider tolerance in the pump than do the new engines. The new fuel must lubricate the tighter tolerance fuel components found on the new engines.



The new fuel will act as a mild solvent when used in our trucks fuel system. It will free up some sediment. You will want to monitor the system or simply replace the filter much more often. The best method to monitor is the use of a fuel supply pressure gauge after the filter. If you choose not to monitor, then simply replace the element periodic like. If you have a gauge, then replace when the pressure drops below the specs.



The higher cost will not be realized due to the constant flux in price of the current diesel. ULSD is to be 10 cents more. Like we will know it? I pay 2. 84 to 2. 99 and back to 2. 86 at the SAME PUMP the SAME MONTH.



BP has been selling ECD for six years. It's ULSD fuel. MOSTLY used for experiment OTR truck engines and large power plant/municipality applications. Yes it's used in Euro applications.



The lower level of aromatics can cause the older seals to shrink. The common denominator is expected to be nitrile rubber seals that have seen long service/high heat. Aged seals simply do not contain the elasticity of new seals.



The use of ULS fuel will allow for greater use of extended drain time. This due to less sulfur working past the (piston) rings. If you have the fuel rate turned way up and work the throttle like a hammer, then the added soot introduced will likely null the extended drain so it's a moot point.



Last, it's not the law to burn ULS fuel in our trucks. You can burn any combo of veggie oil/bean oil and even waste engine oil. If you have the DOC/DPF on a new engine then yeah, you HAVE to burn ULS with max of B-5 bio. and use the new lube oil formula.



We CAN use the new lube oil formulated for '07 model year engines if you so desire but it's another moot point unless you have a large (combined engine) fleet.





Scott

Bus fleet BOMBer..... 'er, Manager

Crestview LSD

Ohio

 

[Jgolden]

Scott, Thanks for that.

 

[btoscano]

I have a recently reman pump and a new lift pump.



But the plastic fuel lines and their quick disconnects are original. Are the seals in these lines going to be prone to failure?



Thanks,

Brian

 

[JRussell3176]

My comment was aimed not only to your post, but also others who blithely compare what we are SUPPOSED to be getting in the new ULSD, against what they ASSUME the Europeans have BEEN using in recent years - yet we know NOTHING of what legislated standards, safeguards and controls THEY have in place as compared to our own.

Gary,



If you feel so strongly about it, I'm sure their (European) legislation is public record and can be researched using the Internet. If you researched it maybe you could then educate others on the subject, instead of ranting about how you and everyone else knows NOTHING.

 

[cerberusiam]

Guys, Gary's post just pointed there are some unknown differences in European formulation and delivery and cautioned against making those comparisons as a basis for formulating deductions. Please don't read anymore than that into his post. He clearly stated he meant it as informative only.



Remember what we say here has a way of becoming gospel and being disseminated to the masses. The "Ford owns Cummins" thing is still being passed on. :-laf



The truth is there are huge differences between European diesel and US diesel and there is no accurate way to judge the impact of mandated ULSD on US refiners and distributors. It truly is an apples/oranges comparison.



There is lots of info on the web and in publications about this subject but its a matter of combing thru the chaff to find the grain. I have not found much info on the European fuel or its handling but would sure like to if anybody has some links or pubs that can be semi trusted.



Cheers.

 

[Greenleaf]

There are numberous trucking magazines/euipment magazines/diesel engine magazines that are fee free if you qualify. They all contain articles on Bio fuel, ULS fuel, emissions, new engine data, euipment etc. etc



The best article yet was recently published in Newports Heavy Duty trucking @ www.truckinginfo.com titled; Fuel, the Double Whammy.

 

[jimnance]

Well Fellas,



If you are in Kommiefornia you have been getting ULSD for several weeks now if not a few months. That is all that the refineries here are producing. In fact, they are producing ULSD that is somewhere around 7-8ppm sulphur content due to Kommiefornia requiring a September 1, 2006 compliance date. The rest of the country has a December 1, 2006(?) compliance date. I am not 100% sure about the national date, my notes are on my desk at work. I will bring them home and post later.



The new spec is 15ppm sulphur and there is an ASTM spec for lubricity that all Kommiefornia fuel will meet. Go ahead a burn red fuel if you feel lucky. It is the very same ULSD with dye in it. Will the ASTM spec for lubricity be the end all? Who knows? For me, I will continue to use Clear Diesel and put my additive in it, and keep one eye glued to my fuel pressure gauge. I hate that GD lift pump.



There is allot of BS floating around out there about this as usual. I will post the website with the info that I was given after I get home from work tomorrow.

Don't know about California, but off road diesel in Oregon is labeled high sulfur and smells just kike diesel used to smell.