Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) ultra-low sulfur

[BSouders]

the truck stop where i get fuel now only carries ultra-low. what is your opinion on this as far as lubrication for the p-pump and related items. i always add power service fuel additive anyway. thanks in advance. truck is a '96 2500 4x4 auto w/342,000 miles.

 

[fest3er]

By now the refiners and distributors will have worked out all the problems with producing, transporting and treating ULSD. I would expect that most fuel in this land will come close to meeting the ASTM(?) specs for fuel. And since you religiously add fuel treatment, you should have no troubles at all.

 

[Wingate]

Is it just me, or do the older fuel systems seem to leak more fuel on ULSD...

My in-laws old 7. 3L international engine always has little leaks and seepage on it. I just had to replace the fuel temp. heater o-ring due to leaking... I wonder if the older o-rings and seals aren't compatible with the newer ULSD... Or maybe its just a 16 year old truck. . but his JD tractor is starting to do it also...

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

ULSD came out not long after my '96 rolled 400,000mi, now at 428,600 no ill effects have been noted.

 

[BSouders]

Thanks for the info.

 

[KB0OU]

I put some 2 cycle oil in my fuel and I dump used oil from my wife's car in my fuel tank to add lubricity to the fuel. Does not hurt a thing, I think it helps. Truck has over 415k miles.

 

[GAmes]

I think it is silly to dump anything extra into the tank, be it something you buy or contaminated fluid from a drain pan. I've used literally thousands of gallons of ULSD and only add conditioner if buying fuel in the south and enroute to the great white north in the winter. The injector pump has never been worked on (except for a timing change) and the original injectors were changed at about 530k.

 

[KB0OU]

Used Oil

Hey GAmes,

Burning used oil in diesel engines is old hat.

A lot of over the road trucks do it with a auto feed feature which constantly burns old oil and refreshes the oil in the sump.

It is part of a "Green Initiative" to limit pollution from used oil. Check with the EPA on it.



You might want to read up on Lubricity of Ultra Low Sulfur Fuel.



John kb0ouOo.

 

[GAmes]

Hey GAmes,

Burning used oil in diesel engines is old hat.

A lot of over the road trucks do it with a auto feed feature which constantly burns old oil and refreshes the oil in the sump.

It is part of a "Green Initiative" to limit pollution from used oil. Check with the EPA on it.



You might want to read up on Lubricity of Ultra Low Sulfur Fuel.



John kb0ouOo.

Old hat is an understatement. Cummins quit producing that system many years ago, and there is nothing green about burning used oil, or fresh oil for that matter. It won't burn completely in the cylinder any more than it will burn cleanly if you light a pan of it on fire.



I've read plenty of the internet myths about ULSD. Sulpher is a lubricant, the mix of additives isn't enough, yada, yada, yada. Strange that I have used more of it than 99% of the membership with no ill effects.



If the oil isn't good enough to lube the internals of an engine what makes you think it will lube the internals of an injector pump or injectors which have lot closer tolerances than bearings?



I really don't care what you dump in your tank. I won't be the next buyer, assuming it runs long enough to sell it. I just don't want to be looking at a used truck that some else has who has bought into your non-sense.

 

[KB0OU]

Hey GAmes,

You ain't the only person that has every run a diesel.

I have over 415k miles on my 96 Dodge and that is by far not the only diesel I have ever owned. Don't worry, I will not force you to buy any of my diesels.



John kb0ou

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

I put some 2 cycle oil in my fuel and I dump used oil from my wife's car in my fuel tank to add lubricity to the fuel. Does not hurt a thing, I think it helps. Truck has over 415k miles.

Your signature says you only have 401,000 miles



I think I need to update mine too :-laf

 

[KB0OU]

Hey Vaughn,

Just a little indication of how long I been on here, I have updated it a couple of times. .

 

[GAmes]

You ain't the only person that has every run a diesel.

Guess that applies to Joe D. and every other expert that writes for the TDR.



So, can you answer my question? Here it is again.



If the oil isn't good enough to lube the internals of an engine what makes you think it will lube the internals of an injector pump or injectors which have lot closer tolerances than bearings?



Here is another. Why would you add something to the fuel that has next to no cetane and does not completely burn during the combustion stroke?



The injector on the right has 520k on it. What do yours look like?

 

[KB0OU]

GA,

What oil is not good enough??

You tell me the cetane of 10 onces of 2cycle oil mixed into 30 gallons of diesel fuel. .

It is apparent that you know, or maybe not. ????????

Guess what, it really does not matter to me.

Go run your diesel, I will take care of mine.

John

 

[GAmes]

OOPS, thought you were touting used motor oil and how it won't harm the engine, or do harm to the environment. Or do OTR trucks run 2 cycle oil now?

 

[fest3er]

GA,

What oil is not good enough??

You tell me the cetane of 10 onces of 2cycle oil mixed into 30 gallons of diesel fuel. .

It is apparent that you know, or maybe not. ????????

Guess what, it really does not matter to me.

Go run your diesel, I will take care of mine.

John

May I gently suggest you research the additives in 2-smoke oil? There are additives, and I think they are not compatible for use in close-tolerance diesel fuel systems. From what I saw of those additives and their purposes, I decided I could not put it in my fuel. That said, it is, after all, your truck and your choice.

 

[GAmes]

the truck stop where i get fuel now only carries ultra-low. what is your opinion on this as far as lubrication for the p-pump and related items. i always add power service fuel additive anyway. thanks in advance. truck is a '96 2500 4x4 auto w/342,000 miles.

If you are to believe these guys Fuel Additive Test - Ultra-Low Sulfur Diesel - Diesel Power Magazine adding stuff to the fuel is nothing short of magic. Adding 16 oz of two stroke oil to 30 gallons of pump diesel (200:1) gives a full mile per gallon increase. That means one pint of 2 stroke has the equilavent of 2 gallons of diesel BTUs. Diesel has 130,500 BTUs per gallon (1145 per ounce) so apparantly 2 stroke contains 16,313 BTUS per ounce, 14 times as much. So that leads to some questions. If you believe the myth that ULSD diesel doesn't have enough lubricity and that 2 stroke oil has the lubricity you need why not run straight 2 stroke? It costs roughly 4 times per gallon more than diesel but you get 14 times as many MPG. OK, might be too thick for the lift pump to pull fromthe tank, so why not 50:50? Also, if 2 stroke is so powerful why does my outboard mix of 50:1 (gasoline has 115,000 BTUs per gallon) give me 1 1/2 MPG at WOT and a 4 stroke engine that uses no oil in the fuel get 4 times that on an equal sized boat



The same holds true for the products that are actually marketed as diesel additives. If a few ounces per tank give such marvelous results why not double, triple, or quadruple the dose? I have no idea what they cost but why not 50:50? After all, to get those kinds of numbers they have to have BTUs just short of explosives.



Of couse there are some glaring flaws in the article. First is the Powerstroke only got 14. 6 mpg highway. My brother has a 98 6 speed 4X4 2500 Ford with a Powerstroke and his highway mileage is very close to mine (19 to 21). They also state that sulphur is a lubricant, WRONG!!! Natural lubricants are stripped during the process of removing sulphur, but sulphur is a corrosive-plain and simple. Then there is the glaring ommission of what the best highway and best city averages of untreated fuel were, or did they only run one tank of untreated while running multiple tanks of treated fuel? The biggest flaw is the lack of a control to weed out the variables, you know, average speed, traffic, idle time, wind, terrain, temp, fuel quality, etc. It is easy to get a 3 mpg decrease in mileage by only driving 75 instead of 65, or driving into a 20 mph headwind at 65 instead of having a 20mph tailwind at 65.



What I'm saying is before you buy into those anecdotal stories use some common sense. Go by a truckstop and watch the trucks at the fuel islands. How many of them are dumping additives into their tanks? If additives really give those kinds of results every owner/operator out there would be using them.

 

[KB0OU]

GAmes,

It is apparent that You are mistaken somewhere... ... .

In a previous post you said Sulfur is a lubricant... .

"Sulpher is a lubricant, the mix of additives isn't enough, yada, yada, yada. Strange that I have used more of it than 99% of the membership with no ill effects. "



Now you say it (Sulfur) is not????????

"They also state that sulphur is a lubricant, WRONG!!"



I take your statements for what they are worth,,, a lot less than $. 02... .....



Thanks

 

[KB0OU]

BSouder,

Did you get your question answered?

I like biodiesel as it lubricates better than regular diesel (ULS fuel).

I have run peanut oil, cannola oil, and soy oil and they all do well. Like I said before, I like to put a little 2 cycle oil in the diesel they sell now to add to the lubricity.

I am running the original injectors and fuel injection pump on my 96. It has just over 415kmiles on it and runs better than new.

I checked my injectors about 25 kmiles ago and they still looked very good, popping off nice (within cummins specs). I will probably check them again in about 150kmiles.

I have a 90 gallon tank in the back of the pickup plus the original tank that came with the truck so I do a lot of mixing of fuels from time to time.



John kb0ou

 

[GaryOwen]

I've read plenty of the internet myths about ULSD. Sulpher is a lubricant, the mix of additives isn't enough, yada, yada, yada.

For clarification, GAmes earlier mention of sulphur being a lubricant was a post of internet myths.