Update On Hydrogen Application

[HBarlow]

I must be one of the dumb one's, installed generator over weekend and on first run 95 miles one way ended up with 25. 3 freeway driving at 65 with cruise control. I think I am smiling.

Scientists call it the "placebo effect. "

 

[brods]

Mark - You used a Calculator... .



All - Keep yer panties from bunching up, I don't really care if you believe this device or not, I don't and was just commenting. Maybe this thread belongs in the political section with the Obama BS, oops, I started another topic.



Studies, many, going way, way back to the 1970's, even NASA made a study that is the darling of the Browns Gas fans, of course they never read the entire study.



"Feasibility demonstration of a road vehicle fueled with hydrogen-enriched gasoline Author(s): Hoehn, F. W. ; Dowdy, M. W. Abstract: Evaluation of the concept of using hydrogen-enriched gasoline in a modified internal combustion engine in order to make possible the burning of ultralean mixtures"



The conclusion is that the actual minimum energy consumption was the same for gasoline and hydrogen-gasoline, although the minimum-energy-consumption equivalence ratio decreased from 0. 79 to 0. 67. " In other words, adding the hydrogen reduced the mileage until they leaned out the mixture. Then the mileage was the same, but never better. Note that the procedure called for optimizing the ignition timing in both cases.



And this works WITHOUT adding hydrogen.



These 'gizmos' have been tested by every TV station in the country during sweeps week, never a success story, eg. Video



And who knows how many Students have had their ***** handed to them for presenting this same stupid subject over the last 40 years. (My 1974 Electrolyzer for Soap Bubble Bombs cheated with Calcium Carbide for really big bangs, Acetelyne)



Now, If I am Joe Car Designer in Detroit, am I really such an idiot that I continue to push my silly little designs for Fuel Cell cars, variable cylinder management and Hybrids when a $5. 00 box of parts will win me a JD Power award, all I gotta do is ditch a cup holder and I am in!



There are MANY, MANY easier ways to improve fuel mileage, Breaking the rules of nature isn't one of them.



All I am saying is that the Laws of NATURE have NEVER been violated by ANY invention, Even the Atomic bomb was just a theory, much more complex, and easily proven with the SAME rules of thermodynamics.



Chill out and have fun, just don't fall for scams. Yeah, their only $50, but it is just like paying $100 for the two magic words to make your debts go away... .



I am running a half off special!

LOL ever think of going into politics? Notice how you said a whole bunch but did not answer the original question?



I agree that you cannot violate the laws of nature. You brought up what seems to be about the only way that H could have a net positive effect on a smofigified diesel without breaking any laws. A smogified diesel is one that is NOT tuned for maximum efficiency. Gasoline studies... ... apples to oranges.



So did you mis-speak or does H really increase combustion efficiency on a diesel engine?



It is odd that so many are so sure it does not work yet they never supply links or references to tests or studies for diesels that would put the issue to rest once and for all. Likewise you would think there would be some hard data supporting the generators if they truly made a substantial difference. [shrug]

 

[brods]

I sure love these fuel line magnets. .



Yessir, increased my mileage 2. 75 mpg's and ive only had a week so far to reap the increased benefits. Once they season the fuel lines, I figure on a 5 MPG improvement easily. Naww, no change when I dyno'd the rig with or without them, but sure helps with mileage.



A friend of mine that sells 'em says he gets 92 mpg's in his 'ol datsun pickup with a new, modified array of magnets that he is going to start testing next week for production. . Yessir, HIGHLY recommended. I won't go on any trip without them, they have paid for themselves 20 times over already. . No need for any other mods but these. What, you guys callin' me a liar??? You morons! I dont need to take this abuse anymore. . I know they work, and thats good enough for me.



Oh, by the way, I just happen to have a few for sale. . Will give ya a good price with your tdr discount

Lol, we might be buying fuel line magnets after all!



Simple device which uses electrical field to boost gas efficiency developed by Temple University researcher

Six months of road testing in a diesel-powered Mercedes-Benz automobile showed that the device increased highway fuel from 32 miles per gallon to 38 mpg, a 20 percent boost, and a 12-15 percent gain in city driving.

 

[BLarkman]

We know they don't work but my first real pull, Lebanon, Or over the Cascades to Burns only used 19 gals vs 25-26 for other trips. We drove 1805 miles toYuma via Salt lke and Bryce canyon using 145 gal. Our trip hoe last year homedrove1258 and 129 gals. You figure it out must be the plesabo effect

bob

 

[BLarkman]

update on my fuel economy. Drove from Yuma to Lebanon, Or 1339 miles. I turned unit off when we left and and averaged 9. 8 to 10. 2. At Hawthorne turned unit back on and milage improved to 13. 6 and 14. 2 I refueled at Burns Or and drove over the pass home using 18. 6 gals which I felt was because once I was over the pass i was all down hill. I restrung wires, while in Yuma, they had worn out,cost $9. 95 ffor a roll of stainless wire.

I am still a happy camper getting around 25% improvement.

bob





update on my fuel economy

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

update on my fuel economy. Drove from Yuma to Lebanon, Or 1339 miles. I turned unit off when we left and and averaged 9. 8 to 10. 2. At Hawthorne turned unit back on and milage improved to 13. 6 and 14. 2 I refueled at Burns Or and drove over the pass home using 18. 6 gals which I felt was because once I was over the pass i was all down hill. I restrung wires, while in Yuma, they had worn out,cost $9. 95 ffor a roll of stainless wire.

I am still a happy camper getting around 25% improvement.

bob

Thanks for the update - I've been watching the various installation results here for the last year or so - don't get too discouraged over the bricks tossed your way - I got laughed at for YEARS over my use of the Frantz TP bypass oil filters - lots of "TP belongs in the bathroom", and "It'll all dissolve, end up in the pan, and RUIN your engine" sort of ridicule... :-laf



BUT, I was way too stupid to listen to those "can't work" criticisms, and just kept on enjoying my reduced wear and cleaner oil... :-laf



Keep the reports coming!

 

[HBarlow]

Can I get a package deal? A coffee can with a roll of TP, a hydrogen generator, a magnet or two, a wind wing for the roof of my cab, a few dozen or those triangular doodads that glue onto the back corners of my trailer trailer, and a vented fuel tank cap to allow for fuel to run out the top when my fuel consumption runs into negative numbers?

With a set up like that I might be recruited for a job with nobama's EPA.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Can I get a package deal? A coffee can with a roll of TP, a hydrogen generator, a magnet or two, a wind wing for the roof of my cab, a few dozen or those triangular doodads that glue onto the back corners of my trailer trailer, and a vented fuel tank cap to allow for fuel to run out the top when my fuel consumption runs into negative numbers?



With a set up like that I might be recruited for a job with nobama's EPA.

Dunno about that Harvey - but I'd be sure to wear a good quality hardhat if I walked around very much while wearing those BIG blinders... :-laf:-laf

 

[HBarlow]

I wear a ballcap to protect my bald head. Do I need more?

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I wear a ballcap to protect my bald head. Do I need more?

If your head is as bald as mine, a few layers of good carpet for padding is a big plus - also, some form of glare protection helps protect others around me as well too when the hats off.



I dunno, there's always new "discoveries", and advancements in technology hitting the scene - 99% of it seems to be either overstated, or outright fraud - but I still sorta like to keep informed and hold an open mind - and I sure appreciate the bold few who dare step out and actually try some of the new stuff - keeps me informed on their dime...

 

[Mhannink]

you know laws are made to be broken. with that being said im still on the fence on these units myself. i discussed these units a while back with my teacher. he did not think it was possible. for one thing the claim the make about hydrogen breaking up the fuel molicules he didnt believe and i dont know enough about the chemical rections to know either way. another point he made was that the oxygen created by this system is used for buring the hygrogen and not for supplementing the burning of the diesel fuel. lastly his thought was that the gasses being put in there are gonna actualy hurt you power wise because its displacing the air in there making it less then what you would have otherwise.



on the other hand though you have real world test results from people who have nothing to gain by lying that this system works. now i am not an engineer nor very smart. im just a simple mechanic and turn wrenches to me this has an air of too good to be true. we will see though im not saying its impossible just confusing.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

WELL, the way I see it, is that IF what some here are trying is capable of improving MPG by even only several MPG - at the current and likely future cost per gallon of fuel, it could significantly reduce annual fuel expense - BUT, that assumes there are no hidden costs related to maintenance and upkeep of the setup, or harmful side effects not yet seen.



Time and testing will be the actual proof - which is why I look on with interest at what others are doing...

 

[BLarkman]

Well expenses are;

canning jars and rings free, got from wife (have to return sometime)

baking soda free swiped out of kitchen

distilled water 84 cents a gallon

relay $7. 00

misc hoses,nuts,bolts,wire about $20

stainless wire $9. 95 a 50' roll

lots of fun playing with it and showing it off

about 50% interested and same amount say it won't work but wife and I just smile when we fillup. Who cares what others think,but thanks for the positive input really appreciated .

bob

 

[DavidC]

60 minutes had a story on these systems a few weeks ago. They bought a Honda civic and had the system installed. Emissions remained the same and the mileage actually lost ground. The EPA official and 60 minutes concluded they spent alot of money for a box. I would imagine that if these systems worked every vehicle manufacturer would be in on it.



Dave

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

60 minutes had a story on these systems a few weeks ago. They bought a Honda civic and had the system installed. Emissions remained the same and the mileage actually lost ground. The EPA official and 60 minutes concluded they spent alot of money for a box. I would imagine that if these systems worked every vehicle manufacturer would be in on it.



Dave

FACT is, *I* wouldn't give a plugged nickel for ANYTHING the EPA or 60 mMinutes sez on any subject...



YMMV - literally!

 

[Bob4x4]

There i one thing i have come to find out about most of the people on this site. You would not know progress if it stared you in the face. Most of of you Tree Hugging Whining Liberals can wait for Congress to help you out on fuel prices. Keep making those Arabs richer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I doubt many tree huggers are here on the oil burning site

 

[HBarlow]

Wow, "tree hugging whining liberal. " You really know how to sling insults.

That's the most despicable, rude, insulting, obscene, disgusting, immoral, nasty thing I've ever been called in my entire life.

My guess would be you probably don't understand political issues any better than you understand science. And don't have much of a sense of humor either.

 

[BLarkman]

the question was asked about maintance and why is not everyone jumping on this. IMHO I believe part of the reason is you have to check jars on a regular basic, like open tool box and visually look at fluid levels. Is the fluid real dark brown and need changing.

Do the wire need changing. I had to do this after driving to Yuma and believe I had too strong a solution and now watching concentration more. I did not have to add water to jars on way home and wiring looks fine. A lot of people just want to install and forget!! I have been told thats "too much work". I hope this answers some questions.

bob

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

the question was asked about maintance and why is not everyone jumping on this. IMHO I believe part of the reason is you have to check jars on a regular basic, like open tool box and visually look at fluid levels. Is the fluid real dark brown and need changing.

Do the wire need changing. I had to do this after driving to Yuma and believe I had too strong a solution and now watching concentration more. I did not have to add water to jars on way home and wiring looks fine. A lot of people just want to install and forget!! I have been told thats "too much work". I hope this answers some questions.

bob

That is part of the ongoing maintenance issue I referred to earlier - much the same as guys doing their own biodiesel, or even the TP changes in the Frantz oil bypass filters like on my '02 truck - while in many cases, there's no challenge to the benefits - it's simply too much added bother for the "get in and DRIVE" folks... :-laf:-laf

 

[Mhannink]

That is part of the ongoing maintenance issue I referred to earlier - much the same as guys doing their own biodiesel, or even the TP changes in the Frantz oil bypass filters like on my '02 truck - while in many cases, there's no challenge to the benefits - it's simply too much added bother for the "get in and DRIVE" folks... :-laf:-laf

you hit the nail on the head gary. to me it seems like to much work and maintenence for a vehical that is supposed to go a long time with little work. this system depending on the miles you drive needs to be checked almost weekly and completly flushed once a month or so. for me im driving 2 hrs a day on average and covering about 30k miles a year. i also do a lot of road trips. my philosiphy(sp?) is DO NOT TURN WRECHES while on the road unless absolutly nessacary. i dont want to have to service this thing while im on the road. to me there are other ways of getting better fuel milage that are maintenece free. all i want to do is get in and drive, and know that my truck will make there with no problems