VE pump issue

[DVolk]

Well I finally got my new pump installed pump im haveing some issues :



Here is the issues ,,



1. When i fire it up it smokes like a SOB and continues when it is warm

2. it seams to kind of some what miss at idle .

3. boost pressure if the guage is working correctly is going to 25 to 30 psi on

full throttel .

4. the EGT is very high 6 to 800 on cruise when you stick your foot in it

it gets to close to 1200 .



The engine is a 93 dodge . The pump is from Diesel Care and Performance

with the 3200 rpm spring and a fuel pin mod .



Before the pump swap it never had this high EGT or boost pressure about a 1000 and 20 PSI I swaped it out because the pump leaked and was hard starting .



The truck has stock injectors and has big 4 to 5" exhaust

and a big Air cleaner .



What could be the problem a injector line crossed some how ? incorrect timeing ? I dont own a dial indicator to time it . The only book i have is for

a 90 from cummins i won off of e-bay .



Also the throttel postion sensor is not hooked to the pump but is plugged in

The truck has a 5 speed .



Please help !!!!!!!!!!!!!



Thanks Donovan

 

[cerberusiam]

What color is the smoke on startup? Does it start immediately or take a revolution or two?



When was the last time you had the injectors popped and set?



As a guess, you have a new pump that is making more pressure sooner and flowing more fuel. You have injectors that were used to a lower flow lazier pump. Both the miss and EGT's are quite likely from that.



How does it run otherwise? Good power and top end?

 

[NIsaacs]

Issue number 1 and 2 could be slow pump timing. Issue number 3 and 4 are not unreasonable for that modified pump.



Nick

 

[DVolk]

The smoke is white and is blue white when its warm and when i drove it

It was not the traditional black power smoke that it should make .



I tried adjusting the timing by moveing the pump . That result seamed to make the truck run worse than before .



The truck is extremely hard to start . When i got it started it sat there and

stutterd and sputerd . As a exsperiment i grabed a jumper wire and hooked it to the KSB and it ran smoother but was not right then if i un hook it it fall on its face .



There is so much smoke that you cant see hardly from it .



The engine also dont sound right its actually quiieter than my stock 92 .



The power was alright when i drove it nothing like it should be .



I have not had the injectors pop tested , Even if they were weak i dont think it smoke like that it smokes bad when it cranks over . It ran fine before the pump just leaked .



My ksb didnt seam to work any way no power when testing it at connection

at pump with a test light .



My neighbor said the exhaust smelled like raw deisel .



Also my neighbor bought a pump for there 90 5. 9 and says there haveing issues as well as the truck dies and starts hard and is a stock pump



These were both bought at Diesel Care & Performance out of Millington , TN

Are these guys sending out bad pumps ???????

My neighbor had thers installed at a shop

 

[TBartlett1]

All symptoms sound like late timing, high egt, smoke, hard starting.

The VE has a woodruff key unlike the P7100 so the timing has to be in the general vicinity.

Did the key fall out when you installed the pump?

I've had mine out several times and the key was very loose and would fall out if I was not careful.

I put some punch marks on my key to tighten it up a bit.

A crossed line is possible on the pump end. Check by starting and cracking 1 injector at a time, if 2 or more cylinders are weak/dead then that may be your problem.

The firing order is 1-5-3-6-2-4

On another forum I found the following post;

The firing order is 1-5-3-6-2-4

Starting counterclockwise at 6 o clock.



I had 4 and 1 criss-crossed, that's what was confusing me and making things go back on not quite right.



Note; the key is at the 6 O: clock position when the engine is at TDC of #1cyl.

I set the engine on TDC of #6 so the key is at the 12o: clock position and cannot fall out when I remove my pump.



Hope this helps

Tim

 

[NIsaacs]

White smoke indicates raw unburned fuel. This can be caused by slow timing. The fact that activating the KSB improved it some also indicates slow timing. Is it even possible to install the pump without the dial indicator? It has been years since I did one so I can't remember how important it is. I have one so I don't know... .



Also make sure the little fuel return screen at the pump return line connection is clean. Return line restriction will cause the pump to act bad.



Like you said, maybe you just got a bad pump... . dang it!



Nick

 

[Mikey-KE7LBB]

Pump timing should have been "locked in place" when you picked it up from the shop and engine set at TDC with timing pin before install. Then when it's in you just loosen the bolt that locks pump timing and release the pin and it should be pretty close.

The KSB advances the timing for a cold start to reduce smoke when cold and if it smoothed out when you applied power to it then you need to rotate the pump toward the engine to advance it.

Also anytime you need to remove injector lines, take them off with the clips in place to keep them lined up correctly... I found out about this little tip after I had them all apart and mixed up while changing a head gasket.

 

[cerberusiam]

Late injection timing will cause the white smoke, its just not injecting at the right time for whatever reason.



The reason coud be several things. Pump timing itself needs to close. Pushing the pump towards the head as far as it will go will increase the timing and increase the rattle. If you can't get a good hard timing rattle by pushing timing as far as possible there is a problem. Are you sure the timing gear did not slip and possibly drop a tooth when you had the pump off?



With the pump locked in place you need to know where TDC is exactly to make a difference, otherwise there is only one way the pump installs.



If the timing has not slipped and all you changed was the pump it really sounds like there is an issue with the pump itself. Small wear tolerances in the rotor and disturbution head plus the piston will drastically change the injection event and cause these problems.



Since you are seeing the same problems with another pump from the same shop it's a good bet the pump is the issue. Proving that gets to be a problem as they will tell you they build to spec and it cannot be the pump when it actually is something in the pump that is worn that cannot be measured.



Both pump and injectors can contribute to these problems so all you can do is try to eliminate as many things as possible. The injectors may be the easiest to address but if the shop is not on the ball with the rebuild you have mixed results. Since you have stock injectors they SHOULD be able to set them correctly. If they were POD's you would probbaly have to send them off.

 

[DVolk]

I know the key didnt fall out as i pulled the front cover off as i wanted to check to see if the kdp had been fixed , it was and i replaced the key with a new one and swelled it as it said in the book .



I set the marks as shown in the book and pulled the valve cover off of #1

to confirm " TDC" Every thing was good . The pump was locked in time .

although here is the one thing that i wasnt shure about , although the pump shop said it was ok , no problem . Rather than the timing mark be lined up

at " E" It lined up with " D" . My screw up is i forgot to check were the

timing mark was lined up at on the stock pump was i was haveing trouble

with the timing pin locking in place . .



I unlocked the pump after i had the gear was mounted in place ,the hole engine bumped ahead putting the fan on but i turned it back after pump was un locked .



Tim on the firing order how can you tell the order on the pump looking at it ?

the diagram in my 1990 cummins B series book didnt really jive with the truck

So it might be possible i got it crossed ????? .



I wish there was some one whom lived close Id buy them a room for the nite

and make them diner at the hotel my wife works at , My dad helped with the last pump i did and it fires in the first turn , but my dad has been gone now a year :{ any other ideas ??? Thanks Donovan

 

[cerberusiam]

Donovan, my son is about 3 hours north of you in WA. He went thru about the same thing with 2 trucks and finally tracked the problem down. Give him a call and kick around what he did to fix it.



I PM'ed you his contact info.

 

[DVolk]

First of all thanks to Allan I talked to Drew if i cant figure it out he will come come help me .





Second if any one e-mailed me please do so again something come though my junk box and i deleted it before i seen it to stop it from something cummins power