Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) What's happened to the epidemic of VP-44 issues?

[Gary - K7GLD]

Anyone else noticed the extremely low number of VP-44 problems and failures popping up in this forum? Used to be VERY common to see several a week - now, they are relativel rare - could it be that aftermarket fuel system improvements - LP and such, along with the revisions in rebuilder components provided by Bosch have finally eliminated the VP-44 as a major failure item?

 

[Wyomingcowboy]

Or the awareness of the driver and the availability of air dog, fass, or other viable alternatives to carter have helped to drastically reduce the number of occurances?

 

[PVanderlugt]

Well, seem like most of the VP problems showed up when it started to get warm, so maybee we will see some more here in the next couple of months. I think mostly though, that all the factory original pumps have been replaced with overhauled/improved units and these newer generation pumps are doing well, with probably some credit as well, like WC said, to improved awareness of the lousy LP that Dodge gave us.
Pete

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Yeah - I had indicated the possibility better aftermarket LP's helped - and yeah, seems the warmer weather is a trigger to be watched, but so far, the landscape is sure looking better, where the VP-44 is concerned.



Another fear along those lines, was the unknown of the drier ULSD - either it's working better than feared, or so many are using lubricity additives that the hazards aren't showing up...

 

[JLandry]

Or maybe folks are driving less now?



Ya know it would be neat if we had historical statistics on VP44 failures per miles driven. That might be interesting data to see.



John L.



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[CurtLee]

Or maybe its been covered so much that all they need to do is search for what they're looking for. Good possibility, eh?:-laf

 

[Nigel]

Gary - K7GLD

If it makes you feel better my truck is in the shop for a VP44 right now.



Nigel

 

[icman95]

I will go with the knowledge is power option. I wouldn't have known squat about vp44 problems if a friend and TDR member didn't enlighten me to them. I joined here shortly after and learned a bit more. When it was time to mod my truck I put in the FASS before the vp or the lp failed, so I hope I headed it off at the pass. Point is that disscussing it here taught me what to do to prevent it, rather than fixing it. Hopefully it will hold out for a long while.

 

[jgillott]

I will go with the knowledge is power option. I wouldn't have known squat about vp44 problems if a friend and TDR member didn't enlighten me to them. I joined here shortly after and learned a bit more. When it was time to mod my truck I put in the FASS before the vp or the lp failed, so I hope I headed it off at the pass. Point is that disscussing it here taught me what to do to prevent it, rather than fixing it. Hopefully it will hold out for a long while.

I agree, people owning these trucks now are seeing the benefit of the things we learned through first hand experence years ago.

 

[FourBarR]

Here is a static for you kms driven 497,554 (x 0. 62137= 309165. 12k) 0 vp44. original still running perfect.

 

[2-ND TIME]

VP44's

FourBar4 I would be curious what your build date is mine is 101019 of 98. Yours must have a Monday truck. This one was supposed to have been built on the 12th so they were really pushing them out!

 

[bill8333]

My truck has 170000 miles on the clock and it's the original I/P. The original lift pump was replace by the dealer @ 98000 miles. Now she has the intank pump and no problems 70000 miles later.

 

[MRose]

I was reading a article not long ago that was on the ulsd and they were saying that they had improved the lubricity after the original transition from lsd, that could be a big factor. 180k on factory IP, failed diaphram from the fass having to much pressure, still ran great, no codes, just needed ether to start. 205k now thanks to Oregon Fuel Injection. Anyone else notice IP prices dropped to $1050?

 

[MVieira]

Gary,

I feel that the updates have vastly improved the VP44. When I lost mine I only had 30,000 miles on my truck. I probably could have went a little longer before I changed it out, but knowing something isn't right eats me up like a cancer. I noticed a slight surging pulling heavy, got the CEL & P0216, and then got the dead peddle twice. This all happened on one trip back from Oregon. Since I had very low miles I felt the best thing was to have my pump rebuilt. I took it into Diamond Diesel in West Sac. and they sent it into their main rebuild facility, in the bay area. They sent me back a report that the main cause of the failure was the brass advance piston sleeve, which they had an update to a steel sleeve, which I think you had the same thing fail in yours. But they also gave me an itemized list of all the updates my pump needed. My serial number VP44 needed a shaft and front support bearing update, a diaphram update, along with a FPCM update. Parts alone would have cost $1400 and I could buy a reman. off the shelf for $1093 that had all the updates already in it. I asked Margaret, who I've dealt with for years and trust, what was the failure rate on these rebuilds with all the updates, and she said they have had very few failures on the current pumps with all the updates. My truck was a late 2002 built in Mexico. I feel allot of the P0216 timing failures were due to the rapid wear of the brass advance piston sleeve on the VP44's in the 2001 & 2002's. Correct me if I'm wrong but it was my understanding that the early VP44's in the 98. 5 to 2000 trucks had a steel advance sleeve and somewhere in the 2001 and 2002 build of these trucks, Bosch started using the brass sleeve, which proved to be a bad idea and they went back to the steel sleeve.

I used stanadyne performance formula every tank full since the truck was new and I had a fuel pressure gauge in the truck since it was 3 months old. I never let the fuel pressure drop below 5 psi on a heavy pull. I did go through the Carter lift pump growing pains. Never satisfied with the low pressures, 10 psi. at idle and would drop to 5 psi. on a heavy pull. Put a new pump on the engine and same thing. I then relocated the pump to the frame rail with the Vulcan big lines kit and got good pressures but then got cavitation issues and erratic pressures. I changed the Carter on the frame rail again and it was fine for a short time but same thing again. I finally installed an AirDog FP-80 on my truck when it had about 20,000 miles on it. This gave me 15 to 16 psi at idle and never lower than 12 psi. on a long pull and pushing it hard. !0,000 miles later was when my VP44 started acting up. The point here is I always used a lubricity additive every tank and always had a positive fuel supply to my VP44 and it was the engineering error by Bosch to make the change to the brass advance piston sleeve.

My truck was still under the 7/70,000 warranty from Dodge at that time, but I already had an Edge EZ, a turn-buckle on the HY35, and the AirDog fuel supply pump. I couldn't do that and feel good about it. What was one of the first things I read on the TDR ? Once you modify "YOU ARE YOUR OWN WARRANTY STATION".

I guess I added more than my $. 02 worth to Gary's thread, so I apologize for being long winded here.

Hey Gary do you miss Vacaville/Allendale much ? Or are you just like all the other Oregonians now, just another transplanted Californian that bad mouths Californians. Sorry for the pun, I've got several relatives up there that fall into that category. Anyways I wish you well and take care.

Regards, Mike.

 

[SnoKing]

So the other day I am talking to this guy in the park about Dodge Diesels. He has a 2001. 5 2x4 HO and tows a really big 5th wheel. Mobile Suites! I ask him how miles are on his truck. 125K! Any issues? None! How is yours fuel pressure? Don't know! Stop by and I will put my test gauge on it. Ok!



He stops by and I install the gauge, he starts it and I see the gauge go slightly to vacuum!!! Do not know how long he has been driving that way! I cycle the key three times and no codes.



Tried to get him to order a LP from Vulcan, and he goes to a local shop that installs a NAPA Carter to the tune of 400+. He is going back to have them install a pressure gauge also.



So, some people have all the luck and money!



Back to VP44, maybe most of the bad ones have been located and replaced, and there are not that many brass bore ones still on the road. Or some people are just lucky. I was not and at 52K to boot.



SNOKING

 

[Beast2B]

Is there any indicator on the pump that would tell me if my IP has the brass or steel sleeve? Mine is an early 01 HO (purchased April 2000). currently 85k miles and original injection pump. I added the frame-mounted secondary Carter at ~15k and occasionally check fuel pressure.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I guess I added more than my $. 02 worth to Gary's thread, so I apologize for being long winded here.



Hey Gary do you miss Vacaville/Allendale much ? Or are you just like all the other Oregonians now, just another transplanted Californian that bad mouths Californians. Sorry for the pun, I've got several relatives up there that fall into that category. Anyways I wish you well and take care.



Regards, Mike.

Good to hear from you again Mike - all your VP-44 and LP issues are on the money, and closely parallel my own - for all the same reasons! That Bosch switch to the brass advance cylinder was a vast mistake, and a suicidal early failure issue for a high percentage of pumps in the '01-'02 trucks. Even at that, they might have survived better if Bosch had ground a slight bevel on the edges of the ring used on the advance piston - that ring has avery sharp edge that easily can start eating away at the cylinder walls, especially if they are of a soft material such as the brass ones.



As to missing California - yeah, many good folks down there - and I sure miss the get-togethers with you and the other guys, as well as the Dyno runs at Imler's and breakfasts in Sacramento - also, the great shopping on every imaginable item - nothing like that here in our part of eastern Oregon!



By the way, gonna be down that way end of May, first of June - any dyno runs or other activities going on about then?



BUT, I didn't have to move away from California - or here to Oregon, to have negative thoughts as to the politics and taxes down there, of course, this state will eventually catch up - but so far, no complaints, and at least, much quieter, less crowded, and FAR Less gang and drug related issues here - sorta makes up for the lack of shopping - and besides, it's only a 300 mile round trip from here to Bend... . :-laf

 

[Joe Mc]

Not sure if mine bit the big one on the way to work today yet, truck is 5 miles from work and I can't get to look at it till I get it home tonight. But, for the sake of this thread - this is the same pump that was on the truck when I bought it w/75k miles in 5/01, present odometer reading 174,687 = roughly 100k miles on the same pump. Will post findings once I figure out what actually happened.

 

[FourBarR]

2-ND Time my truck was built ST. Louis June 10 1998. Soon will be at 500,000 kms. and plan to post truck history. Have a great day.

 

[DFerverda]

I have put over 100k on my 98. 5 since i got her, without replacing the ip, but have had the dead peddle a few times in the last month. Once it set off the cel, but only got a companion code, and the light went out on next startup.
I have been looking at vp's and was wondering if it is worth the extra $ to go with blue chip, or a more expensive rebuilt ip?
I guess the question is, do all rebuilders replace the computer, as well as all the wear parts, not just what shows wear?
My clock reads 235k now and i think the original owner put in a reman ip, but the 47 re is original and still going strong.
Dirk