What's so Bad about the G-56?

[EBottema]

RB- I would stick with that good 99 you got and maybe get an ATS or DTT transmission. You got a good truck their, unless your dead set on a new one then go that route too.

I would stay away from the g56 personally. Early problems and DC accually stopping cannot be a good sign. I have also read that the g56 was placed behind the a lower output engine in europe. Plus that new clutch design might turn out to be costly to replace.

Dodge fixed something that was not broken (nv5600), that is never good, they tried to save money, time will tell. I'm betting the consumer will get the short end of the stick this time around.

 

[rblomquist]

Just found this on a Ford TSB website, interesting.....



Dual Mass Flywheel Applications:

F250/350 trucks with the 6 speed manual transmission built before 12-1-03 are equipped with a dual mass flywheel. All F-Series trucks built after that date with the 6 speed have single mass flywheels. Some F-450/550's built before the above date may have dual mass flywheels, too. When replacing, use only the same type parts that were originally installed on the truck. Broadcast Message 1472.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

" Seems like this is a horrible trans if you own a 5600, but if you actually own one you like it. "



The inference here, and I've read it before, is that those of us pointing out opinions and KNOWN flaws in design and operation of the new G56 are doing so purely out of some sort of "truck envy"



BS!



Folks come here LOOKING for honest info - and what has been observed on THIS subject and posted has NOTHING to do with any sort of "envy", PERIOD!



We know for an absolute FACT that early surfacing G56 problems HAVE completely STOPPED deliveries of trucks so equipped for about 2 weeks, as DC floundered for both a "fix" - and then a PR excuse for the problem. We have also heard from several members here commenting on clearly visible excessive lube leakage from the seals on that transmission, on completely NEW trucks still on dealer lots. We are hearing that the dual-mass flywheel that necessarily accompanies that transmission is ALSO very prone to problems and outright failures as used in a number of other applications...



So, recognizing the intended integrity of this board and it's members, should we act like the guys on the GM and Ford boards, and pretend all is ginger-peachy?



Do *I* "envy" owners of that transmission at this point?



Yeah, SUUuuuuure I do... .

 

[RonsRig]

Is there anyone reading this thread that owns a Dodge with a Cummins and the G56 and is having trouble with the transmission or clutch?

 

[EBottema]

You can call it TDR syndrome Gary. Whenever you don't say that something about a person's truck is wonderful or a new design is bad, you get an angry mob of cry babies around here.

 

[klenger]

Comment of Gary's post: My truck was build the 1st week the 2004. 5's were in production. When it was dropped offf the train in Denver, it sat at the rail yard for over a week because there was a delivery hold on all 04. 5's because of some issue with the exhaust clamps. My dealer finally called me and said the hold was lifted. Never got an explanation as to what the problem was. According to your theory, all 2004. 5 trucks are a POS because there was a delivery hold when they were released. Of course, we have not heard one complaint of anyone having exhaust problems with 2004. 5's.



I have yet to hear one complaint from a G56 owner here on the TDR about any problems what-so-ever with the G56. The dual mass flywheel also seems to get a lot of attention. To tell the truth, I don't even know what a dual mass flywheel is, but so far, there have not been any reported problems with it either.



I love my NV5600, but I would not hesitate to buy a new truck with a G56 if I was in the market. Life goes on.



BTW, For members that are somewhat new to this discussion, the G56 is not a getrag, never has been, never will be.

 

[Tim]

There is nothing wrong the the G-56. Mine has been fine. My dual mass flywheel has held up just nicely to my trailer, mountain driving, and just general around town stuff. There is nothing wrong with my G-56 and it does shift nicer than any NV5600. I hate where reverse is, I'll never get used to that... other than that, it's fine.



I dont care what you say that have never owned one, the simple fact is that you just don't know what you're talking about.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

You can call it TDR syndrome Gary. Whenever you don't say that something about a person's truck is wonderful or a new design is bad, you get an angry mob of cry babies around here.

YUP - and too bad, since free flow of information is what boards like this SHOULD be about... I suspect the new G56 will prove out to be a very decent transmission, once the early production bugs are worked out, but to pretend there ARE no bugs is as foolish as ME denying the problems caused by the VP-44's on 24 valve truck!



Of course, we COULD have done some sort of "poll" after the first couple of hundred trucks were on the road, and average miles on the VP-44's was only a couple thousand miles, and then, even THEY would have looked good...



Get real guys, there aren't enough G56's OUT there yet, or enough accumulated miles to establish ANY clear pattern yet, good OR bad - let's wait a few month's and a few 10's of thousands miles average, THEN see what surfaces. Until then, we *do* have early reports of some clear problems - and we're total idiots if we pretend they don't exist - and worse, if our dedicated stubborness compells us to not at least point them out to potential new owners.



And yeah, the VP-44 is a good design in a poor application - does that make the situation any better for new or existing owners - and should we deny the weakness out of some false sense of misguided loyalty and denial?



NOT in my book!



Peace!

 

[Lightman]

The G56 may prove it's self but the dualmass never will. I've had experience with a number of chevys and fords equiped with it. They dont hold up and are way too much to replace. Just a warning to everybody with one if you idle your truck for extended periods you might want to think twice because this will destroy them even quicker. The manufacturers that used them no longer use them. Why do you think that is? Just as one example in 95 powerjoke I replaced four dualmass flywheels in one year. This is a truck that drove to the job and idle for long periods. This gets expensive at $1000 a pop.

 

[catoiler]

Just picked up my 05 3500 SRW,NV5600 equiped truck and I don't miss the 48re at all!Drove the G56 and it was nice but I still like the NV5600 better. I know what it will handle after what I threw at it in my 02. Still don't like gear boxes that use auto trans fluid in them.

 

[AMink]

This may be a little hijack, but it was mentioned above, too. What is the difference between single and dual mass flywheels? What is the theoretical advantage of a DM and what happens to them in the real world that has caused so much trouble? Just wonderin'.

 

[RJOL]

YUP - and too bad, since free flow of information is what boards like this SHOULD be about... I suspect the new G56 will prove out to be a very decent transmission, once the early production bugs are worked out, but to pretend there ARE no bugs is as foolish as ME denying the problems caused by the VP-44's on 24 valve truck!



Of course, we COULD have done some sort of "poll" after the first couple of hundred trucks were on the road, and average miles on the VP-44's was only a couple thousand miles, and then, even THEY would have looked good...

Gary... I guess you're right. I'd better sell my 2005 immediately and get me a 1st or second gen or 3rd gen with a NV5600. Oh wait a minute... I owned one of those VP44 2nd gens for almost 5 years. I didn't have any problems with the VP44 or anything else... Maybe I should have kept it... I'm so confused... I guess I'll just keep my 2005 and wait for all the warranty problems...

 

[DPKetchum]

Just maybe it dosen't have any bugs. Its been in use a while. Just not in Dodge trucks. Curious if the dual mass flywheel was also used with this trans. in the other application? Anyone know?

 

[FATCAT]

DMF info

This may be a little hijack, but it was mentioned above, too. What is the difference between single and dual mass flywheels? What is the theoretical advantage of a DM and what happens to them in the real world that has caused so much trouble? Just wonderin'.

AMink, go to this link to get a little history on Fords use of the DMF and Standard Transmissions explanation of why these type of transmissions tend to fail.

 

[QWaller]

AMink, go to this link to get a little history on Fords use of the DMF and Standard Transmissions explanation of why these type of transmissions tend to fail.

Sounds like the new G's are not gonna like bombing too well. I need to go back to physics class to properly grasp that info on how it works (or doesn't). Maybe it sounds good to an egghead in front of a chalkboard and hasn't quite panned out in the real world YET. Hopefully Dodge has got it figured out. DC should be covered ok with the upcoming warrenty change and all.

 

[LDobie]

Thats the point I want to add to this, what about the warranty change next year?? The bulletproof motor will still have its 7/100 warrant I'm sure, but the powertrain, i. e. G56 Trans, DM Flywheel etc will be back down to 3/36 won't it...



From my interpretation of a DM F/W, the friction ring almost acts as a clutch within the flywheel, allowing slippage and breakage before something in the motor or transmission itself is destroyed. The damper springs absorb the harmonics caused by the differences in vibration frequency (diesel shake rattle and roll) between the engine and transmission. Its kind of along the line of that sweet spot range of RPM when you can shift without using the clutch, b/c everything is in unison. This is probably why the G56 is reported to be smoother.



One final thought, it is POSSIBLE that the engineers learned from others past failures and have a better and more reliable design. The aftermarket guys will undoubtedly have a replacement solution, should a problem arise.



Oh, and I found the exact truck I would buy on a lot in Wisconsin, the fact that you get basically 1/2 of the warranty on an '06, we may see the '05's being snatched up in a hurry over the summer months, regardless of the G56 predicted failures over the long haul.

 

[dhill]

Thats the point I want to add to this, what about the warranty change next year?? The bulletproof motor will still have its 7/100 warrant I'm sure, but the powertrain, i. e. G56 Trans, DM Flywheel etc will be back down to 3/36 won't it...

I believe the clutch, and related parts are only covered 12/12 now. I know some one will correct me if I'm wrong.



Dave

 

[DPKetchum]

Not releated parts. Clutch DISC due to WEAR is a 12/12. The pilot bearing,throwout bearing and a DEFECTIVE pressure plate are actually 7/70! Usually when NEW engines and drivetrain items appear in a product line the warranty GOES UP not down. Is D. C. that confindent that the dual mass flywheel and G56 trans is that bullet proof?? If they start failing under 50 or 100k with any regularity D. C. 1800 line will be on fire as well as dealer service depts taking big heat. Normaly if a product is proven and repair percentages are really LOW there is NO NEED for 7/70 or 10/100 etc. It also shows that the manufacture is that confident in their product.

 

[AMink]

I always thought that if a company (ANY company) was sure they were building the best, the warranty would be top notch. If everything is done by the book, why not warrenty for 10/200? That right there would get folks in the door! After all, if Hyundai or Kia (can't remember which) can have a 10/100, why not Dodge? I think lowering the limit will hurt sales. JMO

 

[durango12]

g56

was just in a dc 6 speed training class last week and the early g56 trans were shipped one quart low on fluid . new design trans will have a trough built in to direct oil to better oil rear bearings . all this info is per the dc class instuctor. i will say that the g56 is lighter and does appear to be very stout , so maybe there will not be any more issues. the dmf flywheel may be another story only time will tell.

d12