When Toyota Gets a big Diesel...

[gsbrockman]

Grass is not always greener on the other side. Jap stuff has big issues also... ... . but the quality spread is not as far apart as some would believe.

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[Semicrazy]

Everytime I here Toyota and Quality in the same sentence I laugh :-laf ... they are not all that they are cracked up to be... they have growing pains and quality issues.



Competitive Connection

January 2, 2007



A look at the competition

Toyota recalls more vehicles in the U. S. than it sold last year prompting study of Vehicle Development Process

Last year, Toyota recalled 2. 38 million vehicles in the U. S. -- more than the 2. 26 million vehicles Toyota sold in that year. This statistic resulted in a formal review by Toyota to determine what needed to change. After a two-month review of its product development process, the significant lessons learned include:

1. Engineers in some cases may have rushed out products without conducting enough quality checks, nor building a sufficient number of physical prototypes.

2. Toyota also concluded that it outsourced engineering perhaps more than it should have, and relied on computer-aided engineering and other computer analysis too much.

3. Toyota is determined to build more physical prototypes in the future to quell recalls and quality glitches.



Other actions taken as a result of the study include the decision to slow down Toyota's ambitious growth plans around the world. Each product plan in every market was reviewed to determine whether to delay, cancel, reallocate or proceed. This review was in response to product recalls and other quality problems.



Even as it slows down the pace of new product introductions, Toyota still wants to extend its business in every segment (of the auto market) in every region of the world. Toyota sees its growth coming from three key efforts:

1. To transform its Lexus premium brand, a North American-only franchise today, into a more global premium franchise;

2. To launch low-cost $6,000 to $7,000 cars in emerging markets around the world;

3. To develop commercial vans that would compete globally, including in Europe and North America. (Source: Wall Street Journal 12/11/2006)



Despite the recalls at Toyota, GM brands still lag behind most of our transplant competition when it comes to the public's "trust" perception, according to Strategic Vision Inc.

Volvo 61% Pontiac 22%

Toyota 43% Chevrolet 21%

Honda 35% GMC 20%

Cadillac 34% Hummer 16%

Buick 23% Saturn 7%

Saab 22%



********************************************************************************************************************************



Then & Now

At the end of 1985, there were about 171. 6 million vehicles registered in the United States. Today, there are more than 237. 2 million vehicles registered in the U. S. That is a more-than 72-percent increase in just 20 years! Personal auto ownership is growing at an enormous rate, and the number of automobiles on the road is expected to double during the next 15 years. However, the domestic automakers’ overall share of the U. S. market is rapidly decreasing. In 1986, Detroit’s Big Three controlled 73. 6 percent of the U. S. market. In 2004, they fell below 60 percent for the first time ever with 58. 5 percent of the overall market and are expected to fall below 50 percent by the end of next year.

 

[LesStallings]

I really did not intend to start a quality discussion when I made the first post.



Let me tell you why I was impressed: When I looked at the truck, I had a first impression that duplicated the first time I saw a second generation Dodge. It just looked tough, sort of a refined muscular look. Toyota has a "sport" look, with all painted front fascia and a big chrome grill version.



I first got in the rear seat and the whole cabin seemed modern, practical, VERY comfortable - without the Yank Tank feel of Mega Cab. I believe the trim level on the Toyota was part of an option package, nice, but no fake wood or tacky "bling".



Sitting in the driver's seat did not feel foreign. I mean that all the controls felt like they were in the right place. It is obvious that the engineers were very much affected by the time spent in Texas learning what truck owners liked.



A cutaway chassis was on display. No one was asking "where's the beef?" I have a lift in my shop and have been under my CTD a fair amount. The Toyota half ton chassis looks like it can handle much more than one half ton. It will be interesting to see what their heavy duty chassis looks like.



Anyway, quality issues will be revealed over time. Initial impressions are just that. I think I have seen the future of light duty trucks and I believe the Toyota truck will have a significant influence.

 

[Arkapigdiesel]

I'll say this, and have said it since I heard that Toyota is coming out with a diesel pickup... ..... watch out.



Toyota has proven itself in building quality vehicles, and if they prove that they can do it in the light/medium duty diesel engine market then they will be tough to tangle with IMO.

 

[RustyJC]

No, every Japanese vehicle ever built hasn't been perfect, but history shows one thing - the Japanese learn quickly, and they learn well. My 2002 Ram has never been back to the dealer, but my previous 1999 Honda Civic Si and my current 2003 Acura 3. 2TL-S have never been back for a warranty problem, either.



By the way, the Honda and Acura were built in Marysville, Ohio. The Ram (and my previous 1996 Ram) were built in Mexico.



Rusty

 

[ohnoitsyu]

And while the Japanese manufacturers do have recalls, you have to give them credit for OWNING UP TO IT!!! By the way, not all recalls are mandatory; some are voluntary product updates that are still considered recall status.



If everyone was concerned - and truly wants - vehicles with top quality and performance, when the Japanese companies come out with trucks that rival the towing and weight capacities of the so-called American companies (we all know the truth, but I don't need to say it, right?), this board and many of the other Dodge, Chevy, and Ford boards will be abandoned. Those who want to cherish their inferior junk will still be here. :-laf



Did I say that out loud?

 

[UP N MTNS]

my ancestors dropped a bomb on that country for a reason, now we've spent several years rebuilding it so that they can overtake this one without firing a single shot. They thank you for your continued support. They aren't getting mine!

Statements like the one above make me laugh,do you own a computer,TV, cell phone,radio or any modern day electronics? I know what you are saying but there is no such thing as Buy American when it comes to modern day electronics/cars/motorcycles.



I always get a kick out of the Harley crowd bashing anything other then a AMERICAN made Harley,take off all the Japanese components on a Harley and you would not even be able to push it more less start it.



My Toyota truck was built in California with parts from USA and Japan, my Dodge was built in Mexico with parts from USA and Japan, can you guess which one I'd consider more American?





Who own's Dailmer Chrysler? LOL







Adam

 

[CRuth]

A little competition is always a good thing. I like my truck but its far from perfect. A litte push to do things better is a good thing.

 

[DPKetchum]

I'm 52 and was involved in no wars. But after watching lots of late night history channel and what the Japs did to prisoners of war and they way they do business I knda get the same feelings. I was in a Nissan dealer 15 years and liked the product a lot. But I might have not wanted much to do with them after some of real truth facts about them came to light. Just remember that Nissan,Toyota,Honda dealers are FULL of techs doing repairs,pushing maintance and turning labor hours every week like any Dodge dealer or any domistic dealer does. Years ago there was a big differance in quality but the spread/gap was shorthened up a while back. I say it one more time. The grass isn't always greener on the other side of the fence. Plus I THINK in the way America does business with ANY imports that whats good for the goose is good for the gander in the area of import/export and plants being built etc.

 

[JR2]

Read all about the new toy here http://autoshow.autos.msn.com/autoshow/detroit2007/Article.aspx?cp-documentid=1693725



Here is a quote that should make the brake issue go away



All Tundras come with tires and wheels that are at least 18 inches in diameter. This is the largest base wheel size in the full-size pickup segment. Toyota officials said they needed the 18-inchers to accommodate the Tundra’s large-diameter brakes.



As for buying a truck from them, yes I would Toyota is no more Foreign that Dodge or any of the other manufactures who have plants all over the world.

 

[LesStallings]

Let me see... the truck is built in Texas and the motor in Alabama. Yep, that's made in Japan for sure!



Did you read the part about the HVAC rivaling the system in a Lexus?? Tell that to the megacab folks.



"This changes everything. "

 

[dcherill]

Japn'ese had better hope the new diesel from Japan is better than the last one they shoved on us. Japanese trucks have a market niche and it ain't in the 2500/3500 size. So far they realize most 2500/3500 "work" truck owners probably wouldn't buy a Japanese made vehicle as it would be priced to high for workin' folks to make any money with it.

JIM

uh, the duramax is doing all right, and that is a Jap. Motor



http://www.isuzu.co. jp/world/technology/randd/project3/09.html

 

[scootergmc]

Lee, I'm all with you. I can't wait!!



edit:

This will be my first & last post on this one... my ancestors dropped a bomb on that country for a reason, now we've spent several years rebuilding it so that they can overtake this one without firing a single shot. They thank you for your continued support. They aren't getting mine!

No problem... do you own anything electronic... ? :-laf

 

[LesStallings]

The world has become a GLOBAL market.



My camera is from Taiwan, my truck from Mexico, my vegetables from California (now that another country!), my beef from Brazil, my luxury car from England with a German V12, my shirt from India, etc.



All this and the American economy is the strongest ever. The stock market hit a new all time high AGAIN today. I'm not sure there is a problem here other than a need for world peace.

 

[DSteimle]

there was a small group of individuals before 1989 that truly drove and enjoyed dodge trucks ( to the tune of about 7% market share)



dodge built its first truck for the rest of you in 1994 when gm had 6. 5's and ford was pushing pre-powerstroke 7. 3's. the imports hadn't even thought of that market yet. but since 94 dodge has constantly been upgrading and improving its product to be more powerful, better looking, and the most cost efficiant vehicle in the marketplace.



now along comes toyota with a concept of what will be (i know the 1500 is real, but none of us has seen the 2500,3500) and many of you are ready to burn the dodge in the yard and cover the ashes with the toyota. real loyalty



just dont belive the yotas will be perfect (just as the last real contenders weren't (duramax and 6. 0)). they all break, they all have bugs, and when the money gets tight they all fight warranty. i say go for it.



when it's all said and done my first gens will still be parked next to the road runner and belvedere, just like they were when it all began :-laf

 

[bcpalmer]

I love my Dodge and I don't plan on trading it in on a Toyota if and when they build a HD truck. But that doesn't mean that Toyota doesn't build quality vehicles as do other manufacturers. They will surely be a major player in the HD truck market if they choose to enter. As for the statements concerning Japan in World War II, don't forget that Dodge is part of a German corporation.

 

[cojhl2]

If everyone was concerned - and truly wants - vehicles with top quality and performance, when the Japanese companies come out with trucks that rival the towing and weight capacities of the so-called American companies (we all know the truth, but I don't need to say it, right?), this board and many of the other Dodge, Chevy, and Ford boards will be abandoned. Those who want to cherish their inferior junk will still be here. :-laf

Did I say that out loud?

I don't think we are necessarily inferior. It's just that we haven't met the latest challenge yet.



Competition forces either 1) Business failure or 2) Better products at competitive prices.



If superior design and quality were to be always way above competition Duesnberg, Marmon, and Packard along with many others would still be alive and well!

 

[kscheuerman]

Look for a Cat Diesel

Just at the Toy dealer for a filter for my Land Cruiser. Started busting the sales guys chops about the ongoing rumor of slapping a diesel into a Tundra and started a 20 min diatribe on how the new Tundra will be great. 31 different configurations, more interior space than a mega cab, better agility than any of the big trucks and oh yeah, Caterpillar is providing the diesel powerplant in 08. They're entering a Camry in Nascar and look out for the big Cat decal for sponsorship on it.

Yota might not be as bomber as they used to be but they are very, very, reliable. I've owned 3 Dodge CTDs, an 85 Toyota Longbed 4x4, a 77 Toy

FJ 40 Land Cruiser, 97 Toy FZJ80 Cruiser, Chev 3/4 ton 6. 2 diesel suburban, nissans and an Isuzu Trooper (w a 4. 3 gm V6. ) The toyotas never failed to start.

 

[cojhl2]

Just at the Toy dealer for a filter for my Land Cruiser. Started busting the sales guys chops about the ongoing rumor of slapping a diesel into a Tundra and started a 20 min diatribe on how the new Tundra will be great. 31 different configurations, more interior space than a mega cab, better agility than any of the big trucks and oh yeah, Caterpillar is providing the diesel powerplant in 08. They're entering a Camry in Nascar and look out for the big Cat decal for sponsorship on it.

Yota might not be as bomber as they used to be but they are very, very, reliable. I've owned 3 Dodge CTDs, an 85 Toyota Longbed 4x4, a 77 Toy

FJ 40 Land Cruiser, 97 Toy FZJ80 Cruiser, Chev 3/4 ton 6. 2 diesel suburban, nissans and an Isuzu Trooper (w a 4. 3 gm V6. ) The toyotas never failed to start.

Sales guys at a dealer usually runwith the same rumor mill as the rest of us. They are not privy to any confidential information,, they just like to think they are!!!!!



All this might be true as can be,, but I will not make any decisions on the info thats for sure!

 

[J&LRam]

[snip] My Toyota truck was built in California with parts from USA and Japan, my Dodge was built in Mexico with parts from USA and Japan, can you guess which one I'd consider more American?





Who own's Dailmer Chrysler? LOL







Adam

thats a no brainer. With 93. 7 percent of the parts being manufactored in the USA our Dodge truck is the leader in biggest percent of parts made here according to Detroit News .com article when Nissen introduced their biggest truck. Nissen was pounding their made in the usa drum as you are and DET.com shed a little light on how much of these trucks are actually manufactored in the good ol' USA. GM trucks were 89. 8 percent and Ford trucks were 91. 3 percent. Toyoto and Nissen trucks were both less than 30 percent manufactored parts here but are assembled here. Assembled/manufactored/made in/built in all have a different meaning.

I lost two uncles in the Pacific war with the Japs and my dad came back crippled till he died.

It hard sometimes to hear other Americans pounding the drum for Jap trucks/cars. Its even tougher watchin' a Jap made TV knowing what the Japs did to my dad and other POWs.