Why I cannot drive my diesel like my mother's car

[Newsa]

Is the 7.3 power stroke the only (somewhat recent) naturally aspirated diesel in a consumer (non comercial) pick-up?

By somewhat recent, I mean since 1990 ish

 

[SnoKing]

71 series never made great power until people like Johnson Tower did it with the marine engines. Stock it was add cylinders to increase power. When I was a teenager with got a government surplus 6-71 for our Sea Scout ship, which was an old 38' USCG Picket Boat.

Well the 90 injectors when ran in battle mode on the governor cut holes in top of two pistons. Local guy to serviced logging trucks trade us some high lift 70's for the 90's and we jacked up the front of the engine in the boat and replace two liners and pistons. We no longer could out run the local USCG 40'er, but stack no longer loaded up with un-burnt fuel when we fished off of it at low RPMs.

The 350 8v71 in my Titan 90 class 8 got run over by every 350 Cummins of the day(late 70's)

The 92 series made more honest power.

#ad


SnoKing

 

[NIsaacs]

And that's proof that the blower on the driprtroit isn't a power adder. It needs it there just to run. Add a turbo, and you'll increase the rise. I agree that all engines have torque rise, but in a NA application, it's so slight.
We know that air flows in only one direction in a 2 stroke Detroit head right?
Z Wango Z Tango!

Yes, no intake valves so air flows one way.

Yes, the blower is needed just to run, however, at high elevation it can become added performance v/s NA.

I also think there is more torque rise than you might think in a NA engine, here is a dyno sheet on my gasser sled puller: Note the torque at 5800 rpm v/s 4k rpm, if that is considered torque rise.... I think it is

Nick

 

[Dasmoeturhead]

GM's 1982-2000. 6.2 and 6.5 v8 non aspirated diesels.

 

[Minnow101]

I see a lot of you are still snowbound and trapped in your homes.

 

[Wayne M.]

In 2000, the GM 6.5 was turbo'd. I think all 6.5's were and 6.2's were NA. I'm not sure when the switch happened. I think the Ford was the last NA pickup diesel.

Nick nice moves!
I never had the chance to play around on a dyno, but I'd love to set that engine at a certain point in its range- no load- and put the brake on, see what happens. I think that proves torque rise.

 

[photowrite]

The original poster was just using the tractor puller as an example of turbo lag. Not the best example to make his point, and this forum/ site's readers don't need a basic explanation on the operation of diesels.

However, I think it was all in good fun, and mostly humor.

 

[SnoKing]

My bomb'd 2001.5 that weighed 7K was a lively driver. The people that I sold it to have a son that is a Washington State Trooper. His was driving it and got on it to hard in a corner and had it start to come around on them, however he was able to save it!

 

[Wayne M.]

this forum/ site's readers don't need a basic explanation on the operation of diesels.

Please clarify.

 

[photowrite]

Please clarify.

What I was/am saying is... This is a mostly very knowledgeable group here, and most don't need to be told what the original poster was saying in his original post (..."drive my diesel like my mother's car).

In his defense, seemed like it was an attempt at humor, but was possibly not well received, hence the comments that followed the OP.

James

 

[Missouri Mule]

The basics were right but blowing black smoke out of your tail pipe is not going to get you down the road. Your just waiting diesel/ power. As far as gassers you have the timing advanced, more fuel,more air/ oxygen and be able to get the exhaust out out guicker. Plus with carbs you have the accelerstor ( rod / plunger lubricated so when you pushed down on the go pedal it take off , if you did not you have guite a large hesitation before you actually started to move.
Fortunately the turbo was for emissions and did not hurt performance The power stroke 7.3 was the same 7.3 that ford was using they just had to add (international) a turbo to it.
Gradual depression on the go pedal will get you moving guicker than pushing the go pedal to the floor.

 

[JR]

Who can forget the Mitsubishi 6dr50A 4.0 liter in the late 70's D series

Or the earlier 6.9 IDI engines.

I've seen countless NA Cummins 4b and 6b engines in construction equipment. Some ag also, mostly older water and manure pumps. One 6b I remember working on was rated at 80hp.
Cummins still offers NA 4b engines for repower. I think they call it the b3.3 now.

I know, not pickups but NA diesels were/are more common than many people realize.

 

[Wayne M.]

What I was/am saying is... This is a mostly very knowledgeable group here, and most don't need to be told what the original poster was saying in his original post (..."drive my diesel like my mother's car).

In his defense, seemed like it was an attempt at humor, but was possibly not well received, hence the comments that followed the OP.

James

James, you’re mostly correct. I agree that the core TDR group knows Diesel. However we haven’t heard from the OP, and I’m afraid that we shut him down. I don’t like that, I do like to engage people to see what they’ve got in their head, and perhaps new members who might be new to Diesel and bring them into a discussion.
If I can get one “consumer” to think more of their vehicle than it being an appliance, then I did good that day.

Instead I got to tango with Nick :-laf

JR, years ago we had a Vactor that used a 6B round pump for power, I think it was 90 hp. I used to PM it and think about the wasted potential sitting there.

 

[JR]

JR, years ago we had a Vactor that used a 6B round pump for power, I think it was 90 hp. I used to PM it and think about the wasted potential sitting there.

For sure I can think of many examples where adding a turbo and I/C would do wonders. The most current example that I deal with is my old f700 dump NA Detroit 8.2. Probably the most gutless underpowered truck I've ever owned...and that is cutting it some slack :-laf I do not know what gear ratio is in it but it is so low to compensate for the lack of power that at 60mph in top gear it's just shy of redline at about 2800 rpm. Definitely not a highway truck!
But, for many applications where na diesel is used it's mostly a non factor. Many older pumps seem to do ok, fork lifts, man lifts, skid steers to name a few. We've got an ancient Cornwell manure pump on the farm that my grandfather bought many decades ago. It's got an NA oil cooled Deutz engine (name plate actually says Magirus Deutz). It's undersized for the farm now as they have expanded their pump lines 4 or 5 times over what the pump was originally bought for but it still gets used on the fields around the farm. Mainly to free up the big tractor that is required to run the new pump, but my cousin who runs the farm is extremely nostalgic like me and makes it a point to keep as much of grand dad's old equipment running as possible.

Ok, now I've officially derailed this thread again . My apologies Chop suey.

 

[Badunit]

What I got out of it is that mothers should be aware that the car is going to be abused by their kid(s). Seriously, who of us didn't try to find out just what just what Mom's car would do? Can it do a burn out? A donut (in the snow at least)? Is it faster off the line than your friend's mom's car?

 

[ncalb55]

Tell me how they can sit there and spool up with out moving. Are they straight drives with a clutch.

 

[fest3er]

Diesels and gassers must be driven differently. Because where their torque is is different.

And it is torque that moves a vehicle, torque that does the work. Gassers usually have little torque; they depend on HP (and, thus, RPM). Wind out a gasser and it'll be moving right quickly. But wind out a diesel and it's a dog. Because there's no torque up at 4000 RPM. With a diesel, upshift somewhat above peak torque so the next gear is just below peak torque. For most smaller diesels, that'll be down around 1600-2200 RPM.

A diesel Bug driver like a gasser was an absolute dog; couldn't get out of its own way. But kept in its torque band, it kept up with other vehicles very smartly.

So, yes, diesel and gassers must be driven differently if one wants to maximize performance from each.

 

[jackvz]

Most kids today by a Diesel for the cool factor, then they notice they are a dog off the line. Then the want go fast parts and blow black smoke all over the place. Key is to educate them that black smoke is not power or speed, but we can make the engine get up and go a lot sooner then a stock diesel.

What makes you say that diesels are a dog off the line? Some of the diesel engines in cars are actually faster off the line then their gas equivalent!

 

[p-Bar]

Hey guys Chopsuey posted on this battery thread gotta read it.

https://www.turbodieselregister.com/threads/260643-Maintaining-battery-life

 

[Newsa]

Hey guys Chopsuey potsed on this battery thread gotta read it.

https://www.turbodieselregister.com/threads/260643-Maintaining-battery-life

President Truman dropped a Mopar Battery on Nagasaki? :-laf