WOW - the testimony of a Woman and her TOYOTA NIOGHTMARE....

[hammersley]

I thought all you had to do was put the car in nuetral - BIT NO - Read the article..... I saw her testimony..... people were speechless... . This problem they have not yet addressed.

Watch the Video here - A MUST SEE!!!!!

Sevierville woman testifies to Congress on Toyota concerns

Lawmakers heard a brief, but riveting, description of the problem from Smith, the Tennessee woman whose Toyota-made Lexus suddenly zoomed to 100 miles per hour as she tried to get it to stop - shifting to neutral, trying to throw the car into reverse and hitting the emergency brake. Finally, her car slowed down before she crashed into trees.

She told described her nightmare ride in October 2006, calling it "a near death experience. " Fighting back tears, Smith told the panel "I prayed to God to help me. "

"After six miles, God intervened" and slowed the car, she said. She said that nothing she had tried had worked. She said it took a long time for Toyota to respond to her complaints.

 

[champspa]

that's what I like about my truck it's connected by cables not electric wires

 

[WOT]

Yet another reason to drive a standard - keep the brains where its supposed to be.

 

[fox]

Has anyone asked why these people don't just TURN THE KEY OFF????

 

[rscurtis]

Many of these vehicles don't have an ignition switch so to speak, and transmissions are activated electronically (no more cable or linkage), so shifting into neutral is not as simple as one would think. Many of today's vehicles are so overpowered they can easily overcome the braking system, espescially with a head start. One of the good things to come out of this debacle could be the eventual de-contenting of all the unnecessary electronics that vehicles have today. Makes my 27 year old Mercedes look better every day.

 

[champspa]

doesn't turning the key of lock the steering wheel ?

 

[rscurtis]

It shouldn't. The "off" position still allows the wheel to turn. The "lock" position allows the key to be removed.

 

[JLEONARD]

A guy that works same place as my wife had a runaway Toyota. He was going downhill on a pretty heavily travelled road with lots of stop lights when it happened. Luckily it was off peak traffic and he was able to swerve into the opposite lane several times to go around other cars.

He finally stopped after totally burning up his brakes ($1700 worth of repairs) but he ddn't hit anyone.

I asked the same question about neutral or turning it off.

Said he was concentrating so hard on hammering the brakes and avoiding cars that he just didn't think of shifting to neutral or turning off the key.

The guy is no dummy but under extreme stress people don't always think logically.

 

[MVenditti]

Has anyone asked why these people don't just TURN THE KEY OFF????

I was thinking the same thing. This and other things should be in driver training before license is given. People are to preoccupied with phones and everything else they forget their responsibility as a driver.

 

[Regcabguy]

Has anyone asked why these people don't just TURN THE KEY OFF????

The Lexus ignition "button" apparently requires a three second depress under speed to keep your kid from accidentally stalling the car,losing ps and brakes instantly. The CHP driver probably couldn't imagine why the vehicle wouldn't shut off. Cables do rule.

 

[fox]

I will keep my 02 dodge and 98 durango, thank you.

 

[Wygate]

Has anyone asked why these people don't just TURN THE KEY OFF????

Blame the driver????? The car shouldn't have done that to start with, and who is to say that would have stopped the car anyway - the brakes and the transmission in reverse didn't do it!!!!!! This woman was terrified and thought she was going to die, and you ask why she didn't try to turn off the car while avoiding hitting other cars, shifting the transmission, braking, and pulling the emergency brake?



Melissa

 

[UAV]

Many of these vehicles don't have an ignition switch so to speak, and transmissions are activated electronically (no more cable or linkage), so shifting into neutral is not as simple as one would think. Many of today's vehicles are so overpowered they can easily overcome the braking system, espescially with a head start. One of the good things to come out of this debacle could be the eventual de-contenting of all the unnecessary electronics that vehicles have today. Makes my 27 year old Mercedes look better every day.

Exactly. Drive by wire, electronically controlled transmission, electric push button ignition, etc. the driver has little mechanical connection to most modern vehicles. What could you do if the module(s) won't allow a shift into neutral or for the button to shut off the engine while the brakes can't stop the accelerating vehicle?



I understand much of the electronic controls have been added for emissions and efficiency reasons, but things like push button ignition aren't necessary. They've gone overboard dummy-proofing these vehicles.

 

[hammersley]

I agree completely.......

Blame the driver????? The car shouldn't have done that to start with, and who is to say that would have stopped the car anyway - the brakes and the transmission in reverse didn't do it!!!!!! This woman was terrified and thought she was going to die, and you ask why she didn't try to turn off the car while avoiding hitting other cars, shifting the transmission, braking, and pulling the emergency brake?



Melissa

That was as sincere a testimony as I've ever heard... . and many think CORPORATIONS should have NO Regulations at all!!!!

 

[PC12Driver]

Consider this article from Car and Driver: Link

And this one from AOL Autos (the second half in particular): Link



Essentially, C&D proved that brakes will override the engine and there is no reason that an automatic-equipped car won't shift into neutral, even under power. Modern transmissions only control the forward automatic gear selection electronically (i. e. the 1-2-3-4 etc. shifts). There is still a mechanical link between the shifter and the transmission that controls P, R, N, and D with no interlock between D and N. You won't find a car that locks itself into drive because of the need to disengage the engine in the event of a throttle runaway. Drive-by-wire transmissions aren't an issue, since none of the cars in question have them.



The AOL article reveals that the exact Lexus that the CHP Trooper was driving had a similar runaway earlier in the week. That driver successfully stopped the car by hitting the brakes and shifting into neutral. Once stopped, he saw the floormat had snagged the gas pedal, removed the mat, and continued on.



This really wouldn't be such a big issue if the media would report all the facts. But feeling safe doesn't sell news...



Anyway, back to the woman's testimony. In my line of work (pilot/instructor), I get to see folks perform tasks under stressful situations quite frequently. It is almost funny at times to compare notes after a training flight to see what the student thinks they percieved or did and what actually took place. For example, after one rough weather flight, the left seater (I was babysitting an owner in his airplane) thanked me for turning the autopilot back on so quickly after it bumped off on a rough approach (g-switch). Funny thing was, I didn't. His mental capacity was maxed out and his brain was load shedding. He couldn't remember flying the plane to the landing.



I'm guessing she didn't do half the things she thinks she did. Maybe she did put it in neutral, heard the engine race and perceived it as the car speeding up. We won't know. But the facts are 1) her car would have gone into neutral, 2) her brakes would have stopped the car even at full throttle, and 3) cutting the ignition would have stopped the car as well.



I'm not denying that sticky gas pedals are a hazard and need to be fixed. There is a problem, and the numbers show it. But this Lady's testimony means nothing to me. She just became a mascot for the cause, and the public's general ignorance on how their vehicle works will let it slide. More focus needs to be on the guy that had the sticky pedal in the Lexus before the CHP officer killed himself and his family. As in educate the public and give them confidence that they can save themselves if it happens to them, instead of reaching for the cell phone first.

 

[rscurtis]

While CD is a technically accurate publication, I question several of their statements. First, the brakes can overcome the engine- until a- they fade from heat, or b- you lose your vacuum assist from pumping the pedal several times- with a W/O throttle, there is no vacuum. Second, the claim is made that turning off the engine will cost you power steering and brakes- not true if the transmission is still in gear- the engine should continue to turn until the car is almost stopped. And if the throttle is stuck open, you lost your brake assist anyway, unless the brakes are hydraulically boosted. I lost the vacuum booster on a '69 Dodge Dart that I used to have, and the car was virtually impossible to stop with the engine idling in neutral, much less fighting its 230 HP.

 

[Wingate]

I guess this proves that even the mighty Toyota can have issues. . personally, ive never been impressed with them.....

My wife asked what to do if this ever happened to her, I told her to push the shifter up as far as it will go and then move over to the side of the road. I then told her that when it stops, LEAVE it in neutral and just set the parking brake!...

Hopefully, by the time the tow truck arrives, he can use a broom and shovel to sweep the connecting rods off the pavement!

Talking throttle by wire, I've been around thousands of throttle by wire engines and have never seen one "go out of control"... To be honest, I can't believe that Toyota would not have a safety default in the software that, in the event of a fault, would default desired engine speed to programmed low idle!!. . Thats not rocket science..... Sounds like they are/were so full of their own superiority, that "it couldnt possibly happen to us!!"...

There was an ocean liner company back in April of 1912 that said the same thing... and we know how that turned out.

 

[surfbeetle]

The Lexus ignition "button" apparently requires a three second depress under speed to keep your kid from accidentally stalling the car,losing ps and brakes instantly. The CHP driver probably couldn't imagine why the vehicle wouldn't shut off. Cables do rule.

I didn't see this mentioned anywhere else, but CHP that Regcabguy is referring to is an off duty CA Highway Patrolmen who was driving a Lexus that was a rental from Bob Baker Lexus in El Cajon, Ca. He had his wife, kid and brother in law in the car when it when WOT. He drove several miles until the end of the freeway and had a fatal crash for all onboard. Occupants in the car called 911 in the process. Investigators originally blamed it on floormats but also state that the button had to be pushed long enough to turn off the motor and since it wasn't their normal car, maybe they didn't know this. It is truly a tragedy no matter what caused it.

 

[Moose Truck]

Throttle by wire

I will keep my 02 dodge and 98 durango, thank you.

Fox, your '02 is Throttle by Wire. Your VP44 IP is controlled by the APPS via the PCM and ECU. Wow thats a lot of "Alphabet Soup":-laf! The good news is A; I've never heard of a Cummins Electronic engine running away due to a glitch. B; The APPS has an idle switch in it, that tells the ECU "Low Idle" whenever the your foot is off the gas.

 

[UAV]

Toyota has many issues most people never hear about. Though not as serious as current allegations, they include things such as:



Tailgates on the 2007+ Tundras buckling from things like the weight of loading an atv. Toyota's response is that the tailgate is a door not a weight bearing component therefor owners should remove the tailgate while loading.



FJ Cruisers are prone to cracking the sheet metal on the engine bay side of the fenders a few inches from the cowl. Toyota denied it was a design problem and blamed the customers even though it was happening on trucks with a few thousand miles.



2005+ model Tacomas are prone to a large driveline vibration due to the driveshaft center carrier bearing support design. Toyota denied the problem calling it a characteristic of the vehicle.



A few months ago I did a diff install in the front of my work's 2009 4Runner, it was purchased new off the lot and we put 6k easy miles on it. When I got into the front diff one of the carrier bearing races wasn't fully driven into its seat and both carrier bearings were shot.



I've always been an enthusiast for the older Trucks (I own several) and it's obvious Toyota has been moving away from their legendary quality and durability for the last 15 or so years. With that said they have some platforms that don't seem to have any major inherent issues.