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You guys with aftermarket wheels
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I wanna say they are the same as any Weld hi-end wheel. Probably in the $500 range. I have seen them on the T-rex truck and they are very very nice..... Well worth the money.
700rmk
I see that you have the leveling kit, but do the tires rub at all?
How wide are your wheels? Do you happen to know the offset of the wheel?
I see that you have the leveling kit, but do the tires rub at all?
How wide are your wheels? Do you happen to know the offset of the wheel?
Gents,
Not only is our wheel of the correct offset for the new Rams - so the tires don't stick out of the fendewells, it's also "hubcentric" - meaning the centerbore is an exact size match for the Dodge hub. This is done so that the lugs don't bear weight, the hub does - exactly the way Dodge designed it. It will be the only wheel on the market with this feature. All other wheels (to our knowledge) have a centerbore several hundred thousandths larger than the Dodge hub. Not good. Dangerous.
Our T. Rex Weld Cheyenne 8 carries a lifetime structural warranty and a 5 year chrome warranty. These wheels are forged and then machined from solid billet - like all our aluminum parts - made the correct way. Casting alloys must have a high silica content to flow into a mold. The glass doesn't hold chrome and will break instead of bend because it's brittle. Our Weld wheels are of 6061 and have a T-6 temper - exactly the same strength and ductility of our racing shock mounts - because it's exactly the same material. The best stuff you can buy.
We currently have a waiting list for this wheel. An 18" EVO wheel like this retails for $575. When it comes, we will sell them to TDR members for $435 each. For this price, just mention TDR when you call T. Rex.
Kent
Not only is our wheel of the correct offset for the new Rams - so the tires don't stick out of the fendewells, it's also "hubcentric" - meaning the centerbore is an exact size match for the Dodge hub. This is done so that the lugs don't bear weight, the hub does - exactly the way Dodge designed it. It will be the only wheel on the market with this feature. All other wheels (to our knowledge) have a centerbore several hundred thousandths larger than the Dodge hub. Not good. Dangerous.
Our T. Rex Weld Cheyenne 8 carries a lifetime structural warranty and a 5 year chrome warranty. These wheels are forged and then machined from solid billet - like all our aluminum parts - made the correct way. Casting alloys must have a high silica content to flow into a mold. The glass doesn't hold chrome and will break instead of bend because it's brittle. Our Weld wheels are of 6061 and have a T-6 temper - exactly the same strength and ductility of our racing shock mounts - because it's exactly the same material. The best stuff you can buy.
We currently have a waiting list for this wheel. An 18" EVO wheel like this retails for $575. When it comes, we will sell them to TDR members for $435 each. For this price, just mention TDR when you call T. Rex.
Kent
The center bore does not bear the weight on a hubcenteric or lugcentric wheel, the clampling force of the wheels bolted against the hub does. That is one of the reasons torquing the wheels is so important. Also the lug nuts on the Dodge are convex and the area around the lug hole on the wheel is concave, as the lug nuts are tightened this centers the stud in the center of the hole and consiquently centers the wheel on the hub. I do not think are you accurate when you say the other wheels are dangerous.
Bertram65
I've been wondering about this for a while now.
The way I understand it is that the wheel fits the center raised portion of the mounting surface perfectly. If you could hold the wheel onto the truck without lug nuts , the weight of the truck would be held up by the center of the wheel and the raised mounting area in the center. The wheel becomes perfectly centered on the hub.
With lug-centric, the weight of the truck is held up by the lug nuts. You could technically shave the raised portion of the hub because the lug nuts hold all of the weight of the truck.
My concern is that the designers of the hub-centric system meant for the weight of the truck to be held by the center of the hub and wheel and not the lug nuts.
If you switch to lug-centric, are the lugs designed to hold the weight of the truck if you use a lug-centric wheel?
Is this whole hub-centric just to get a "truer" wheel as it is perfectly centered when mounted?
I've been wondering about this for a while now.
The way I understand it is that the wheel fits the center raised portion of the mounting surface perfectly. If you could hold the wheel onto the truck without lug nuts , the weight of the truck would be held up by the center of the wheel and the raised mounting area in the center. The wheel becomes perfectly centered on the hub.
With lug-centric, the weight of the truck is held up by the lug nuts. You could technically shave the raised portion of the hub because the lug nuts hold all of the weight of the truck.
My concern is that the designers of the hub-centric system meant for the weight of the truck to be held by the center of the hub and wheel and not the lug nuts.
If you switch to lug-centric, are the lugs designed to hold the weight of the truck if you use a lug-centric wheel?
Is this whole hub-centric just to get a "truer" wheel as it is perfectly centered when mounted?
My understanding is the hub never bears the weight, but the lugs will spread the load. If the hub was bearing the load why would there be more lugs for heavy duty truck , why not just 4? the hub is used to center the wheel perfectly on the hub. It is true that most aftermarket wheels have a one size fits all hub dimeter, but you can buy hub wheel spacer to align it to the hub. Again this is what little i know about that. 
On the Dodge truck the center bore seems to have little relivence in the wheels placement on the hub once the lugs are tightened up. If the lug nuts were not convex and the area around the holes in the wheels were the lugs go concave it would make a difference. I used to have a GMC and the lugs had a built in washer on them, when you put the wheel on the truck the center bore fit snugly over the protrusion on the hub and centerered the wheel. The area around the hole in the wheel were the lug holes was was flat, these were definetly hub centric. The Dodge may be a combination of both hub centric and lug centric but once the wheel is bolted up the load is suported by the clamping force of the wheel against the hub. Hub centric and lug centric only refers to what method is used to center the wheel, it has nothing to do with actually suporting the weight of the truck. If there was a problem using a wheel that did not have a center bore that matched the hub protrusion the result would the wheel would not be centered on the hub and produce vibration, the load carrying capacity would not be effected. I have not heard of anyone having this problem with wheels that did not center on the hubs on a Dodge truck.
Isn't that the exact same thing? The lugs hold on the wheel. The wheels are "hub centric" which means the "hub" "Centers" the wheel. The DRW trucks use the same hubs. They have flat washers not cone shaped. The wheel centers on the hub and bares the "weight and load" The lug nuts hold the wheel on the truck. Period. There shouldn't be any further discussion on this. What I have just stated is a FACT!!!!! Prove me wrong, don't guess!!!!!
So my understanding from reading this thread is that hub and lug-centric has nothing to do with the weight-bearing job of the wheel. It is only to center the wheel and get it exactly aligned with the centerline of the axle.
Originally posted by Greg Boardman
Isn't that the exact same thing? The lugs hold on the wheel. The wheels are "hub centric" which means the "hub" "Centers" the wheel. The DRW trucks use the same hubs. They have flat washers not cone shaped. The wheel centers on the hub and bares the "weight and load" The lug nuts hold the wheel on the truck. Period. There shouldn't be any further discussion on this. What I have just stated is a FACT!!!!! Prove me wrong, don't guess!!!!!
Sorry I was referring to the dealer with the welds and his post. His remarks make it sound like all the weight is on the center of the wheel not where the lug nuts are attaching the wheel, so no that is not the same thing.
You need to call Dodge for me because they screwed up and put "acorn" lugnuts on my truck.
The welds are for SRW trucks if I am not mistaken, so I can't tell you the FACTS about the DRW.
BTW, I know I am new to this board and all, but I am not your B****, so please don't tell me what should and should not be discussed.
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Originally posted by Spooled-up
So my understanding from reading this thread is that hub and lug-centric has nothing to do with the weight-bearing job of the wheel. It is only to center the wheel and get it exactly aligned with the centerline of the axle.
That's the way I understand it. The post from T-Rex made it sound like the Welds bear all the weight on the center of the hub and I just have not heard of that. i can't imagine that would be to good for the wheel.
Sheesh! Let's get emotional over this! hahah! We're talking about car wheels here fellas!
The centerbore of the OE and the T. Rex Weld wheel both fit snugly around the hub.
If the centerbore of the wheel fits snugly around the hub, will the wheel be more correctly aligned or less correctly aligned with the axle's center of rotation?
If the centerbore of the wheel fits snugly around the hub, will there be more surface area to distribute various shocks and loads or less surface area to distribute shocks and loads?
Is more surface area stronger or weaker than less surface area?
Are vertical loads the only forces a wheel sees? When you turn a corner in your 8000 lb. truck you've got to have more clamping force than four 9/16" lugs could provide, even though the hub is supporting some weight.
Also, let me clarify something - a lugcentric wheel on a Dodge truck that came with hubcentric wheels may not be "dangerous" as I stated in a previous post. Most consumers will never put enough load on their aftermarket wheels to damage anything. Towing a 15000 lb. fifth wheel toy hauler down a ten mile dirt road in Lucern Valley with aftermarket lugcentric wheels hanging out of your fenderwells by two inches, magnifying leverage forces on everything could cause problems.
Or it may not.
Some racers use lugcentric wheels. Some have been towing and hauling for years with no problems from lugcentric wheels. Personally I think that hubcentricity on an eight lug truck is much less important than the correct offset.
Incorrect offset causes bump steer like you read about, not to mention accelerated component wear. Off road, stuff like steering boxes, ball joints, and rod ends get destroyed by the increased leverage - especially when combined with greater traction offered by the large tread on oversized off-road tires. For normal street use, it's probably a non-issue - the average commuter probably won't notice any accelerated wear. He or she just bought the wheels for aesthetic purposes anyway. For them "performance optimization" means every time they look at their truck, they like what they see. A very real consideration. Everyone wants their truck to look cool.
In all our design we seek optimized performance in _all_ realms, meaning towing, cornering, off-road, longevity, service interval, braking, road feedback - the list is endless. And all of this is very broad for a truck that does many things. A truck is a jack of all trades, so it can't master any one thing. Everything has to be a compromise. Example - we're using an 18" wheel with a 35" tire for off-road racing. Optimal for off-road is a 17" wheel with a 37" tire. Why? The aspect ratio is greater on the latter example - better for absorbing bumps and the larger diameter provides slightly more ground clearance. Can we go faster with the 37" rubber - yes. Much faster - no - because we can corner faster, brake harder and accelerate more quickly with the 35" tires. In addition the Toyo Mud Terrain tires we're using offer a smoother and quieter street ride and greater tread life expectancy than any other aggressive off-road tire we've tested. Important for racing? No. Important for optimized all-around performance - yes.
Hubcentric? Lugcentric? Positive offset? Negative offset?
Who cares? It's just up to the consumer - some love the way a truck looks with the tires poking way out of the fenderwells. Anyway, for years the lift kit companies have been saying "go out as much as you go up" - meaning, use wide wheels to increase track as much as you lift the truck in order to offset the raised CG. I suppose this makes sense to their insurance companies.
In sum, we just feel it's always best to engineer something as closely as we can to the OE design. The only functional deviations we are willing to take are very slight dimensions and immensely upgraded component quality. The factory has good reasons for what they do - reasons we may not even know about. When one starts straying from the original design, one gets into a philosophical "no mans land" where the possibility of failure is multiplied exponentially. The slightest change can have catastrophic results that can't be foreseen by computer analysis or even "real-world" testing. I mean, our "real-world" testing - hundreds of thousands of miles data gathering (much of it concentrated by doing stuff off-road that nobody sane would do) just can't compare to the factory's hundreds of millions of miles of data gathering in all possible world wide conditions.
That's why, no matter what we know, or think we know, we don't try to out think the factory. We stick with the design principles and numbers _they_ generate. We don't like the "one size fits all" mentality used by many aftermarket companies. One size may _fit_ but that doesn't mean it's going to be optimal.
I mean, were not trying to reengineer the wheel here, fellas!
hahahahahah!
Cheers,
Kent
The centerbore of the OE and the T. Rex Weld wheel both fit snugly around the hub.
If the centerbore of the wheel fits snugly around the hub, will the wheel be more correctly aligned or less correctly aligned with the axle's center of rotation?
If the centerbore of the wheel fits snugly around the hub, will there be more surface area to distribute various shocks and loads or less surface area to distribute shocks and loads?
Is more surface area stronger or weaker than less surface area?
Are vertical loads the only forces a wheel sees? When you turn a corner in your 8000 lb. truck you've got to have more clamping force than four 9/16" lugs could provide, even though the hub is supporting some weight.
Also, let me clarify something - a lugcentric wheel on a Dodge truck that came with hubcentric wheels may not be "dangerous" as I stated in a previous post. Most consumers will never put enough load on their aftermarket wheels to damage anything. Towing a 15000 lb. fifth wheel toy hauler down a ten mile dirt road in Lucern Valley with aftermarket lugcentric wheels hanging out of your fenderwells by two inches, magnifying leverage forces on everything could cause problems.
Or it may not.
Some racers use lugcentric wheels. Some have been towing and hauling for years with no problems from lugcentric wheels. Personally I think that hubcentricity on an eight lug truck is much less important than the correct offset.
Incorrect offset causes bump steer like you read about, not to mention accelerated component wear. Off road, stuff like steering boxes, ball joints, and rod ends get destroyed by the increased leverage - especially when combined with greater traction offered by the large tread on oversized off-road tires. For normal street use, it's probably a non-issue - the average commuter probably won't notice any accelerated wear. He or she just bought the wheels for aesthetic purposes anyway. For them "performance optimization" means every time they look at their truck, they like what they see. A very real consideration. Everyone wants their truck to look cool.
In all our design we seek optimized performance in _all_ realms, meaning towing, cornering, off-road, longevity, service interval, braking, road feedback - the list is endless. And all of this is very broad for a truck that does many things. A truck is a jack of all trades, so it can't master any one thing. Everything has to be a compromise. Example - we're using an 18" wheel with a 35" tire for off-road racing. Optimal for off-road is a 17" wheel with a 37" tire. Why? The aspect ratio is greater on the latter example - better for absorbing bumps and the larger diameter provides slightly more ground clearance. Can we go faster with the 37" rubber - yes. Much faster - no - because we can corner faster, brake harder and accelerate more quickly with the 35" tires. In addition the Toyo Mud Terrain tires we're using offer a smoother and quieter street ride and greater tread life expectancy than any other aggressive off-road tire we've tested. Important for racing? No. Important for optimized all-around performance - yes.
Hubcentric? Lugcentric? Positive offset? Negative offset?
Who cares? It's just up to the consumer - some love the way a truck looks with the tires poking way out of the fenderwells. Anyway, for years the lift kit companies have been saying "go out as much as you go up" - meaning, use wide wheels to increase track as much as you lift the truck in order to offset the raised CG. I suppose this makes sense to their insurance companies.
In sum, we just feel it's always best to engineer something as closely as we can to the OE design. The only functional deviations we are willing to take are very slight dimensions and immensely upgraded component quality. The factory has good reasons for what they do - reasons we may not even know about. When one starts straying from the original design, one gets into a philosophical "no mans land" where the possibility of failure is multiplied exponentially. The slightest change can have catastrophic results that can't be foreseen by computer analysis or even "real-world" testing. I mean, our "real-world" testing - hundreds of thousands of miles data gathering (much of it concentrated by doing stuff off-road that nobody sane would do) just can't compare to the factory's hundreds of millions of miles of data gathering in all possible world wide conditions.
That's why, no matter what we know, or think we know, we don't try to out think the factory. We stick with the design principles and numbers _they_ generate. We don't like the "one size fits all" mentality used by many aftermarket companies. One size may _fit_ but that doesn't mean it's going to be optimal.
I mean, were not trying to reengineer the wheel here, fellas!
hahahahahah!
Cheers,
Kent
Last edited:
Ya - Usually cost motivated and not necessarily in the best interests of the consumer.
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Issue 128 – Digital Version
Digital Magazines
FREE!
TDR Test Drive - Digital Edition
Renew
Subscribe
Gift Subscriptions
Back Issues
Subscription Status
Address Change Form
Buyer's Guides
Ram Diagnostic Trouble Codes
The Perfect Collection
The Perfect Collection Vol. II
TSB Updates
Dodge/Cummins Historical Overview
Cameron Collection
What Makes Us Tick?
Product Showcase
Advertising
