Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Brand New DTT transmission. Temps too high?

[SMcGrady]

So,I got my new DTT transmission installed and picked up the truck last Wednesday. They filled it with Amsoil. I drove the truck home and to work the next morning and thought I smelled hot/burned ATF. I figured it was just spilled fluid or greasy hand prints, etc. I spoke with Bill from DTT later that day to ask about the different shift points and firmer shifting. He explained all was normal. Saturday I drove about 180 miles round trip to deliver my old transmission and tc cores to DTTs warehouse in Blaine, WA. I get home and still smell the burned ATF smell. I pulled the dipstick and levels look good, color seems ok, but not sure about the smell... So today I get busy and install my new temp gauge. I want to use the '95 transmission output line with the port for the temp sensor, but until I find one I opted to use the acu-temp from Geno's. I installed the temp probe with heat sink compound (radio shack). I wrapped everything with metallic tape to keep it clean and enhance the heat transfer/accuracy. When I took it out for a test drive the temps were as follows:
35-45 mph 160-170 deg
55-65 mph 140-145 deg
Stopped in traffic, idling in drive for 10 minutes 230 deg. (Seemed like it might have continued to climb if I hadn't started driving again, which brought it back down to 170 by the time I got home).
The ambient temp was in low 70's at the most. No load, not towing anything.
I will be calling Bill at DTT tomorrow to see if he feels like this is within expectations.
I am concerned as the temps seem very high to me. Should I be?

 

[jtwcummins]

If you are measuring the temp at the output line from tans to the cooler the temps will go high as hell fast at idle. Should measure in the pan. As a test let idle in a parking lot and when the temp hits 200+shut off engine and restart in neutral the temp should magically go back to normal. I had my sensor in the 97 on the output line from transmission and had temps to 230 at idle all the time. Scary until I found out it was normal. When moving never saw temps above 160 either stock or with DTT transmission. Not much flow in gear at idle, if I was at a long light would shift to neautral

 

[JR]

I have to disagree with the sender in the pan idea but thats just personal preference maybe. If it's in the output line you see what's happenning with your trans much quicker than in the pan where you have fluid that's already been through the cooler.
I think there may be a variance in the accutemp sender, I. E. you need to add X amt of degrees to it's reading, but I'm not 100% sure on that.

 

[DavidC]

Mine climbs at idle with the 89% TC. When I get stuck in that situation I put it in neutral and everything cools down.

Dave

 

[SMcGrady]

Thanks for the replies, I am so totally aware of all of the arguments about probe placement. I considered every one. From the "put it in the flow of the output line because Forewarned is Forearmed" camp, to the "put it in the pan because Ignorance is Bliss and no sense in alarming yourself" guys... So I made my decision. I don't want to start another probe placement war post. I put the probe where I put it, and I got the temperatures I reported. Moving the probe to the pan at this point will not lower my temps... it will just make me unaware of those temps.
My question was (and still is), with the set up I have, should I be alarmed about the temps I am seeing? I thought I remembered reading here that Amsoil won't break down or burn until upwards of 300 deg. Does anyone know where I should start to be concerned temperature wise, considering the setup I have?
Thanks again
Scott

 

[cerberusiam]

If you are running a TC that has been modified the temps are normal. The tighter the TC the higher the temps you will sittting still again the against the converter. I typically see 220 in those conditions in the cooler hot line with a tighter TC. As long as ti comes back down when you start driving, or, does climb so high if you kick it into neutral it is normal.

 

[Regcabguy]

Mine would hit 260* sometimes waiting in line at the International border if I didn't constantly shift into neutral. Try pulling it in and out of drive for 2 hrs. The u-joints were screaming for mercy.
Once on the road though ran nice and cool always. I had the DTT w/89% converter.

 

[ed9824v]

I have a DTT trans that came with the truck so I was not involved with the install. and have temps that start to approach 230 when setting my 5th wheel in place. I did at a cooler with a fan helped a little. not sure of the where it is sensing but look like it is above the pan. I have a strange issue with the temps going up on real long down hill grades with the exhaust brake on that is with my DTT 1998. 5 Dodge Ram. Going to have it service soon before my next big trip to the Sierras. Any suggestions on the type of fluid to add when serviced??

 

[SMcGrady]

Thanks all.
*ed9, I don't know what is best. I went with Amsoil as that is what the instal shop recommended.

One other thing happened, due to lack of communication. when I spoke to DTT the day after I picked the truck up, they said "Just service it after the first 1000 miles. ugh...
I wish I had known that was what DTT recommended. Even though the instal shop has worked with DTT before, and was recommended by DTT, they were not aware of DTT's recommendation of servicing the new transmission after 1000 miles. I don't want to jeopardize my warrantee, but I hate to dump $250 worth of Amsoil so soon... maybe I should save it and run it thru a paint filter??

I don't see the 89% controller on DTT's website. What is it?

 

[cerberusiam]

The 89% converter is how DTT rates their TQ converters for efficiency. An 89% tc is pretty tigth and will build heat quickly. Pulls like crazy on a TQ engine but you give up some idling in gear ease.

If you service these transmisisons on a regular schedule then Amsoil is way expensive ans imply does not buy you anything. Better off using ATF+4. The reason for the change at 100 miles is pull out any fine marticles and contmainants left over from the build. In reality it is probably not needed but if they require that for warranty you have thin line to walk. The least expensive route is just drian the pan and change what you can.

 

[RustyJC]

I have a strange issue with the temps going up on real long down hill grades with the exhaust brake on that is with my DTT 1998. 5 Dodge Ram. Going to have it service soon before my next big trip to the Sierras. Any suggestions on the type of fluid to add when serviced??

It's not a strange issue at all. If you don't have a torque converter controller to lock up the torque converter when the exhaust brake is being used, then the "slip" (fluid shear) in the unlocked converter is generating more heat than it is engine braking. It won't get any better until you address the torque converter lockup issue.



Rusty

 

[BarryG]

My DTT trans now has approx 160k on it and I have no complaints. It has the 89% converter. Idling in traffic slow stop and go the temp will rise faster than I would like but when in that situation I just start shifting into neutral as a previous poster mentioned. The only other time for me that heat has been a problem is backing a trailer around (however that is problem whether your trans has been upgraded or not). I put in a 2 wheel low kit and that solved that problem.

 

[Regcabguy]

It's not a strange issue at all. If you don't have a torque converter controller to lock up the torque converter when the exhaust brake is being used, then the "slip" (fluid shear) in the unlocked converter is generating more heat than it is engine braking. It won't get any better until you address the torque converter lockup issue.

Rusty

Yeah, I had the Smart Controller with mine and the Pacbrake. Worked super.

 

[cerberusiam]

He is listing a lockup controller in his signature, think he has that covered. The usual culprit that only shows on a long down hill run is the lack of fan pulling air thru the radiator.

 

[SMcGrady]

The 89% converter is how DTT rates their TQ converters for efficiency. An 89% tc is pretty tigth and will build heat quickly. Pulls like crazy on a TQ engine but you give up some idling in gear ease.

If you service these transmisisons on a regular schedule then Amsoil is way expensive ans imply does not buy you anything. Better off using ATF+4. The reason for the change at 100 miles is pull out any fine marticles and contmainants left over from the build. In reality it is probably not needed but if they require that for warranty you have thin line to walk. The least expensive route is just drian the pan and change what you can.

So I got the triple disc TC from DPC (Through DTT). I didn't see a reference to the 89% on the website for either outfit. I am really happy with the new transmission so far. it shifts kinda hard and a little later than the original, but Bill K says its all good, and I am looking forward to many years of trouble free use now. I think I may go with the more frequent service with ATF+4 vs Amsoil from here on out, but on the other hand, the truck will be sitting up here in the Northwest for up to 8 months a year when I am down in Mexico. I would be curious to get some input about leaving the truck in storage for this period every year and what fluids are recommended, and other steps I should take to preserve the truck when I am away...
Finally, I am not sure if I will add an additional transmission cooler and/or extra deep pan. It seems like the gains from either are marginal considering the reports from guys that actually measured before/after cooling performance.

Thanks!

 

[ed9824v]

He is listing a lockup controller in his signature, think he has that covered. The usual culprit that only shows on a long down hill run is the lack of fan pulling air thru the radiator.

Just changed out what I think is a weak Fan Clutch and have not yet tried it with the trailer so that may have been some or all the issue I have and extra dodge with a DTT trans and engine that was wrecked and took the fan clutch off and it was noticeably tighter. The converter locks up when I flip the switch for the pacbrake vacuum actuated exhaust brake. Will see if that issue is resolved on the next trip.

 

[cerberusiam]

The converter locks up when I flip the switch for the pacbrake vacuum actuated exhaust brake. Will see if that issue is resolved on the next trip.

Are you using a PowerLoc to ramp TV pressure when you are off throttle and EB engaged? That could limit the amout of fludi routed thru the cooler on a long down hill slope also.

 

[ed9824v]

Are you using a PowerLoc to ramp TV pressure when you are off throttle and EB engaged? That could limit the amout of fludi routed thru the cooler on a long down hill slope also.

I do not know anything about how the lock up works when I let off the throttle the pack brake engages and when I touch the gas pedal it unlocks the packbrake with a micro switch at the gas pedal.

 

[cerberusiam]

Sorry used the wrong term here, it should be PressureLoc. Look here for what I am referencing http://www.dieselperformance.com/index.php/product/index/29P.

 

[ed9824v]

Sorry used the wrong term here, it should be PressureLoc. Look here for what I am referencing http://www.dieselperformance.com/index.php/product/index/29P.

I would thing that since this is a built up trans by DTT that would not be needed since the valve body and torque convert all have been upgrades. I will admit I now little about tran internals.