Camper upgrade to 19.5" wheels and G rated tires

[Wertles]

From personal experience, having both a SRW 3500 with 19.5's and air bags and my current stock 3500 dually, I prefer the dually. HOWEVER, I didn't trade my truck in because it wasn't up to the task of pulling my 18,000 pound trailer. If my truck didn't start giving me issues, it would still be in my garage. I looked into buying a new dually when I got the bigger trailer. They wanted my truck and another 30,000 basically for another set of wheels in the back. In 2010, there just wasn't much difference to justify $30,000.

I'm not into debating which is better or safer, just laying out my experience going from a slightly modified 06 to a stock 13. Here is a thread I started about a year ago when I had both trucks fresh in my mind and giving an honest opinion on both of them, what was better on each and worse on each.

https://www.turbodieselregister.com/threads/243760-Real-comparison-stock-2013-vs-modded-2006

 

[SnoKing]

From personal experience, having both a SRW 3500 with 19.5's and air bags and my current stock 3500 dually, I prefer the dually. HOWEVER, I didn't trade my truck in because it wasn't up to the task of pulling my 18,000 pound trailer. If my truck didn't start giving me issues, it would still be in my garage. I looked into buying a new dually when I got the bigger trailer. They wanted my truck and another 30,000 basically for another set of wheels in the back. In 2010, there just wasn't much difference to justify $30,000.

I'm not into debating which is better or safer, just laying out my experience going from a slightly modified 06 to a stock 13. Here is a thread I started about a year ago when I had both trucks fresh in my mind and giving an honest opinion on both of them, what was better on each and worse on each.

https://www.turbodieselregister.com/threads/243760-Real-comparison-stock-2013-vs-modded-2006

With a 13 Aisian dually with 4.10's you would throw rocks at any 06 including a dually!!!! SNOKING

 

[AH64ID]

I was looking through my copy of the differentials manual from Randy's ring and pinion and found some interesting numbers.
The book is copyrighted in 2010 but he does mention some 2011 diffs. The srw 2500 axle tube is 3.5 inches in diameter and the axle tube wall thickness is .212 inches thick. The 3500 drw axle tube is 4.0 inches in diameter and the axle tube wall thickness is .559 inches thick.
These numbers are on the aam 11.5. I went out and measured the axle tube diameter on my drw and it read 4.159 inches in diameter.
In this book he states that all listed specs are from the manufacturer.


Hope this helps.

They may list it as a AAM 11.5" with a 3.5" axle tube, but that is not a AAM 11.5 but the 10.5" found behind the gas 2500's (and some 03 diesel 2500's). The AAM 11.5" axle used on diesel applications has a 4" tube, 2500 thru 3500 DRW.

I just went and measured 2 2500's and 1 3500 SRW in the parking lot, all have the 4" tube.

As I mentioned I have spoken directly with AAM about the 11.5" axle used in the Dodge.

 

[algonaman]

I've learned a lot, and thankful for wisdom and opinions in this thread. I use my '06 2500 4x4 to haul a 2800 lb. camper, and have a huge bumper and winch on this thing. at the scales, I am over the door tag weight rating by 1k lbs easily. Now, if I haul this camper, and put my jeep on a flatbed trailer behind me, am I too dangerous? No really, I am asking? I feel like I would still be within the limits of this truck, just thinking about plow type coils now as these progressive KORE's don;t work with my RV and towing I want to use this truck for what it was built, after all.
Thanks in advance.

 

[AH64ID]

I've learned a lot, and thankful for wisdom and opinions in this thread. I use my '06 2500 4x4 to haul a 2800 lb. camper, and have a huge bumper and winch on this thing. at the scales, I am over the door tag weight rating by 1k lbs easily. Now, if I haul this camper, and put my jeep on a flatbed trailer behind me, am I too dangerous? No really, I am asking? I feel like I would still be within the limits of this truck, just thinking about plow type coils now as these progressive KORE's don;t work with my RV and towing I want to use this truck for what it was built, after all.
Thanks in advance.

What are your weights? Axles and Total?

What are your wheels/tires rated for?

 

[algonaman]

sorry I think I replied via PM, and now I can only recall total wight adding front and rear together I'm just at 12,800 lbs. with 6400 being on the rear IIRC.

 

[AH64ID]

sorry I think I replied via PM, and now I can only recall total wight adding front and rear together I'm just at 12,800 lbs. with 6400 being on the rear IIRC.

6400lbs on the front axle?? EEEEKKKKK!! It's a 5200lb rated axle, and even at that weight the bearings and BJ's are not known for longevity.

Depending on your wheel/tire combo you could be above the rating (OEM tires are good for 6390lbs).

Adding a trailer will decrease the front axle weigh, a GOOD thing, but it will increase the rear by more than the TW.

Your wheels and tires will play a HUGE factor in your safety and driving experience.

The highest GVWR your frame ever received was 12,200lbs and that was the DRW. I know many people with DRW's ignore GVWR and just use FAWR/RAWR and I don't hear about too many frame issues, but your brakes are only going to be designed to stop 12,200lbs plus the 2,000lbs that you can tow without brakes.... so you are at the upper edge of the frame and brake design limit.

 

[algonaman]

Thanks John.
That's what I Was afraid of, and us camper guys are always hi center of gravity top heavy. Definitely time for 19.5" and some stiffer springs, I am going across the scale again today, minus camper, but this winch and bumper is what's killing my front weight right now. my camper tag shows it 2800 lbs dry, and air bags and sway bar on top of superstrings keep it manageable, while not yet towing anything anyway. Thanks for the input. I may be considering a heavier truck, as I feel unsafe as it is configured now at this weight.

 

[algonaman]

Scale today, front end right at 5060, with me not in it. The rear was 3420 lbs. 56 gallons fuel and dog on board, minus me (200 lbs).

 

[AH64ID]

That's not too bad, but I am guessing the camper is putting a bit more than 3K on the rear axle.

 

[algonaman]

John, camper shows 2800 but I will have to get an actual at the scale next timeI load it, but adding the tag of the camper (2800) weight to my truck, (8480 lbs) puts me about 11,280, before I get in it. Is that so bad? Should I not add any trailer tongue to that? Thanks, I've read a lot of your posts and value your input.

 

[AH64ID]

I would get the scaled weight with the camper on the truck and loaded for camping and see where you are at.

My dad's camper has a sticker around 2600 and weighs around 3800-4000 loaded for a week of camping, and he will tow a trailer (heavy sometimes). He is setup for it, so chances are you can do the same.

Your already doing better than 90% of the people out there who are doing what you do by looking into it.

My truck will push 12K when loaded for camping with 2 quads, plus about 8K on the trailer axles. It does GREAT and I really don't feel the weight relative to a truck at 9K and a 6K lb trailer. It's all about setting things up for what you are doing.

 

[algonaman]

Well at one point I considered a Dynatrac 80 front axle swap but it would cost more than throwing money into the factory 9.5", which I've only done a hub conversion on, still factory ball joints and TRE at this point.

 

[Sloan]

Interesting thread. I have recently picked up a 03 3500 with a 11.5 foot Bigfoot slide in camper. Just did the first trip for a week with the family and hit a weigh station to see where I was at. My door sticker has GVWR of 10100 and I was 10900, GAWR front is 5200 and I was at 4800, rear is 6200 and I was 6100. I believe the truck has overload springs but I was not keen on being at the limit. I do plan on pulling a trailer as well but it is light but still more load.

I will look into the 19.5 inch tire as that sounds like a good option. Is that just for the rear? Besides addressing the suspension load carrying ability, is this tire change the best way to increase safety margin?

 

[Bill Stockard]

Interesting thread. I have recently picked up a 03 3500 with a 11.5 foot Bigfoot slide in camper. Just did the first trip for a week with the family and hit a weigh station to see where I was at. My door sticker has GVWR of 10100 and I was 10900, GAWR front is 5200 and I was at 4800, rear is 6200 and I was 6100. I believe the truck has overload springs but I was not keen on being at the limit. I do plan on pulling a trailer as well but it is light but still more load.

I will look into the 19.5 inch tire as that sounds like a good option. Is that just for the rear? Besides addressing the suspension load carrying ability, is this tire change the best way to increase safety margin?

I haul a 11.5' Lance fully optioned truck camper with a slide-out on a '03 dually and my weight on the scales loaded for travel is 11,200 lbs., but is under the truck's GAWR. I've installed a Hellwig anti-sway bar, upper Stableloads, and Timbren suspension upgrade. The truck/camper combination is rock solid without any sway from crosswinds and passing 18-wheelers. I've not changed the wheels and tires, but do keep a good set of Michelin tires on the truck aired to 80psi. I've not had a problem hauling the camper for over 40k miles.

Bill

 

[Regcabguy]

There's no substitute for the wider track of a drw. Stronger tires,rims,swaybars and much better shock dampening can greatly improve a srw but the dually's really handle a camper safer.
My wife and I were traveling south of Vegas on I-15 with a very strong crosswind coming off the dry lake to the east. The srw with hard sided campers were in the right lane maybe doing 45 mph with their flashers on. I fared better with the popup but had the death grip on the wheel. The drw guys were the least affected and passed us all.
In the event of a collision avoidance situation,the dually's going to stand a much better chance of avoiding a rollover. Add some King 2.5's,a Big Wig swaybar and 19.5's and you have the rock of Gibraltar.
There's a guy on another site who utilitizes super singles on the rear of a srw in order to improve stability and fare better in soft sand. That necessitates carrying another super single.

 

[Bill Stockard]

There's no substitute for the wider track of a drw. Stronger tires,rims,swaybars and much better shock dampening can greatly improve a srw but the dually's really handle a camper safer.
My wife and I were traveling south of Vegas on I-15 with a very strong crosswind coming off the dry lake to the east. The srw with hard sided campers were in the right lane maybe doing 45 mph with their flashers on. I fared better with the popup but had the death grip on the wheel. The drw guys were the least affected and passed us all.
In the event of a collision avoidance situation,the dually's going to stand a much better chance of avoiding a rollover. Add some King 2.5's,a Big Wig swaybar and 19.5's and you have the rock of Gibraltar.
There's a guy on another site who utilitizes super singles on the rear of a srw in order to improve stability and fare better in soft sand. That necessitates carrying another super single.

Yep, I've passed SRW trucks hauling campers "creeping along" in west TX, NM, CO, and WY when a strong crosswind is blowing. What's really fun is drive on a two lane road with a strong cross wind coming in from the driver's side and meet 18-wheelers passing in the opposite direction. As they pass, they temporarily block the crosswind which "pulls" the truck/camper towards the 18-wheeler and then the truck/camper hits that blast of air turbulence that occurs behind the trailer that "pushes" the truck/camper toward the side of the road and that's when I want a solid no-sway suspension system on dual rear wheels! I hauled a 9' Lance on a Ford SRW in the mid-80s We loved the truck camper and freedom and versatility of traveling with it, but I sold both the truck and camper and swore never again without a dually.

Bill

 

[AH64ID]

DRW are certainly the more stable trucks, but I really don't think it has to do as much with the width but rather the added set of sidewalls and suspension.

If the axle was hard mounted to the frame then yes the width would come into play, but with the suspension at the same width as the SRW trucks you won't gain much out of track width under normal driving. Accident rollover would be more stable, but that's not normal driving.

A 3500 DRW that has 6K RAW or higher has approx 145% higher spring rate than a SRW (4th gen where SRW and DRW use same base pack, but DRW has overloads that need about 6K on the rear axle to engage). The 2 extra sidewalls and additional 2977lbs of tire rating per side is going to have a bigger effect than the width with the springs being equal.

If it was possible to keep the springs at the same width but make the track width of the DRW match the SRW I doubt many folks would notice the decreased width.

 

[SnoKing]

If I by a new 3500 it will be a SRW. If I start loading beyond 7K on the rear axle it will be 19.5 LRG's. I just do not WANT a dually as my daily driver!!!!!! If it was not for the fact that I like 8" bed and have a truck trunk and V-Box for a long bed truck I might even consider a sawed off bed!!!!! SNOKING

 

[AH64ID]

I got out camping this last weekend. GCW was 19,500, GVW was 11,900, RAW was 7100.

There were 2 ATV's above the bed rails, so some tall to go with the weight.

Between the Hellwig standard sway bar, airbags at 40 psi, and the LRG 19.5's at 85 psi there was no sway. The truck was as stable as it is empty on windy mountain roads at 50-65 mph, which was dictated by the road and not the truck. If a DRW isn't going to work then it's very impressive what a modded SRW will do. I couldn't have driven like I did on a stock SRW, even with the new 7K RAWR on the 3500 SRW's.