2002 T style steering upgrade.

[blue2002]

Is the Moog DS800981A steering linkage kit a direct bolt in replacement for my 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 with stock suspension? Will I need to grind off any of the passenger side bolt head inside the wheel area (How much)?
Thanks in Advance! George

 

[blue2002]

I finally found what I was originally looking for in the archives. So it looks like there maybe two choices for the 2002 and 2001?) 2nd gen upgrade or using the 3rd gen kit. Go with the 99 style T steering using the following parts provided by Whitney in the following link - https://www.turbodieselregister.com/threads/2002-steering-upgrade-y-to-t.208892/#post-2014968

Napa Part Numbers
269-6096 Drag Link
ES-3496 L Outer T rod end
269-6095 Right Out T Rod end
269-3179 Right Inn T Rod end
269-6099 Right Out T Rod
ES-2012-S Adj Sleve

OR use the 3rd gen Moog DS800981A steering linkage kit.

I held off doing this 10 years ago, but the looseness and wandering it has finally got bad enough to motivate me to make the change. Right now I am leaning to the solution using the 99 style parts with the linkage to fit the 2002 pitman arm over the 3rd gen steering solution.. Just wondering if anyone has more input before I finally make the switch?

 

[JMcCoy]

I have gone through many steering components in the 21 years I have owned my truck. I finally bit the bullet and bought the Synergy steering with the Fox steering stabilizer, and it us awesome. Practically zero axle flop due to the way the links are made. Expensive, but worth every penny if you plan to keep your truck.

 

[blue2002]

I could see spending maybe $400-450 for a really good solution. The Synergy solution looks nice, but $900 is too expensive of a solution for my tastes. That would be more than 3 times the cost of using either the 3rd gen or the 2nd gen solution at NAPA retail pricing.

 

[Ozymandias]

Go with the Gen3 T-Style, i use that for years now and it is really a rock solid solution from Ram.
Its affordable and comes with OEM warranty.

 

[JMcCoy]

I could see spending maybe $400-450 for a really good solution. The Synergy solution looks nice, but $900 is too expensive of a solution for my tastes. That would be more than 3 times the cost of using either the 3rd gen or the 2nd gen solution at NAPA retail pricing.

Without the Fox stabilizer, it's $750. Still pricey though. Believe me, I completely understand the cost thing.

I've replaced steering components many times, just to be disappointed. I would have saved thousands, if the Synergy parts had been available years ago. Still, I understand it's hard to swallow that nut all at once.

The main problem with the T style steering is that it naturally flips forward and backward when you steer right and left causing the famous dead spot in the middle. It is usually not as pronounced when first installed because the tie rod ends are stiff and breaking in. After a few hundred miles, it shows it's ugly head. I had Luke's links for quite a while. Like the Synergy tie rod ends, they keep the tie rod from rolling forward and backward, and was the cheapest option. Anything is better than a worn out Y setup.

Keep in mind when buying parts, 2nd and 3rd gen tie rod ends / knuckles have different tapers.
94-99: 7.125 (7 1/8) taper
00-13: 9.5 (9 1/2) taper
Not a big deal, just don't let the parts guys tell you they're the same.

Hope you get the results you are looking for.

 

[Ozymandias]

The main problem with the T style steering is that it naturally flips forward and backward when you steer right and left causing the famous dead spot in the middle.

For the Gen3 2008.5 Upgrade that is not true, because the right tie rod end has a fixed end that can only move in one plane.
Thats what synergy does with that big spacer in between knuckle and tie rod end.

 

[blue2002]

So other options would be???
1. Install the Lukes Kit with the Y steering..(Would an advantage be using the same taper ball studs on the ends?)
OR
2. Install the 2nd or 3rd gen T steering and upgrade to the Lukes if I start feeling rollover from the joints rotating. Does the 2nd gen T style upgrade use a different taper ball stud ((ES-3496 L Outer T rod end and 269-6095 Right Out T Rod end))from the 2002 Y setup?

 

[JMcCoy]

I have not read many positive reviews on yhe 08+ steering. It is my understanding they use strong heavy bars, but the ball joints themselves are small and dont last long.

Years ago, I purchased brand new cheap joints and cut them up for Luke links. I have Ford knuckles and was trying something. Well, I found not all joints are created equal.

The crappy parts store brand half ball joint could not be used with the Lukes Link. No wonder they don't last long.

Moog joints are a little bigger, so the Lukes Links won't work with them either.

I really dont have a good answer for you. You are obviously better off getting away from the Y steering. I wouldn't purchase a good T setup, just to cut it up and put Lukes Links in. Besides, you'll probably spend a pile of money. Since you have an '02, my guess would be a quality 08+. I was never happy with any oem options.

Btw, don't forget the 3rd gen track bar and bracket conversion. Sorry I don't have a clear answer. Hope this helps some.

 

[blue2002]

I do appreciate the input JMcCoy! Are you running stock aluminum wheels with your Synergy setup?

 

[JMcCoy]

My pleasure. The wheels are not stock. I am running 17's. I cannot remember if there would be clearance issues with stock 16" wheels. I can take some measurements tomorrow and advise on clearances.

 

[blue2002]

I do want to stick with he stock aluminum wheels for sure.

 

[rebar]

I'm also wondering what to start replacing on my stock 97 front end, and a buddy told me Moog Steering Linkage DS800981A which I believe is what people are calling the 3rd gen front end upgrade? But he's also installing TTB outers for the free spin and bearings instead of unit etc.. 2 mpg gain supposedly.

Does anyone offer a solution to address all the dodge front end problems, in one kit please?

 

[JMcCoy]

Short answer, no.

 

[JMcCoy]

The closest thing to it would be the Synergy tie rods, drag link, steering stabilizer kit + 3rd gen track bar conversion (permanent fix but $$$)

Next would be the the moog t-style kit with + a 3rs gen track bar conversion.

Either way, you have to make sure your your ball joints and control arm bushings are good and put in a little extra caster.

If your steering box is loose, and it probably is, you may be able to adjust the slack out of it and do a steering box stabilizer.

If not, then I would replace it with a beefy aftermarket one. I have a Borgenson, and its OK. I would try the new monster PSE box.

All these things can be done in your driveway. Even the alignment with the right camber/caster gauge and tape measure. May be worth taking it somewhere "competent" though. Especially if you need to bang out ball joint eccentrics to get where you need to be.

Probably not what you wanted to hear, but I hope this helps a little.

 

[Joe Mc]

Other than replacing every steering component on my 99 (control arms, drag link, rod ends, couplers, track bar (2 within 3 years) upper/lower ball joints, steering knuckle u-joints, steering stabilizer, 3rd gen track-bar conversion (adjustable), rock solid steering column bushing and just last year a PSC steering box, which due to the larger diameter of the PSC box over the stock one the steering stabilizer couldn't be used) the 3rd gen track-bar conversion was one of the best, only outshined by the new steering box.
Here's an affordable option at $185. The conversion to 3rd gen track-bar bracket.
https://puredieselpower.com/?subcats=Y&status=A&pshort=Y&pfull=Y&pname=Y&pkeywords=Y&search_performed=Y&q=2nd+to+3rd+gen+dodge+2500/3500+trackbar+kit&dispatch=products.search

Unfortunately you'd still have to get the 3rd gen track-bar @ $340 (185+340=525)
https://puredieselpower.com/dodge-p...td-3rd-gen-adjustable-trackbar-03-07-4x4.html

Geno's sells the whole kit @ $585
https://www.genosgarage.com/product/bd-1032011/trackbar-rebuild

The 3rd gen track-bar conversion eliminates the weak link (ball joint type bar to frame mount) and the adjustable track-bar provides correct centering of the diff between the frame rails versus DC's early 2nd gen fix = placing an 8mm shim between the right front hub and wheel.

Not cheap, but as mentioned above if you plan on keeping your truck it's the way to go.
Note: I bought my 99 in 01 with 75k and plan on keeping it until I can no longer get into it.

 

[Ozymandias]

Never he will gain 2mpg with that hubs because he already has an axle disconnect at the Truck.

 

[JMcCoy]

Maybe .25 mpg

 

[rebar]

Never he will gain 2mpg with that hubs because he already has an axle disconnect at the Truck.

It might depend on the oil and temperature, but unlocking manual hubs would prevent allot of bearing and u joint wear as cad, your entire front end is still rotating.
That's several hundred pounds of rotating mass that I would guess costs at least 1 mpg because of mpg reports from 2wd owners. I'm just guessing though..

 

[DonFitzwater]

Can I do the 3rd gen upgrade on my 1995 2500? I'd like to keep my stock steering box as I have the DSS installed.........I WILL be installing a 3rd gen track bar that is adjustable.