2021 RAM 3500 purchase on hold.

[DonFitzwater]

I'm going to Valdez on Sunday to tow a 14k pound boat back with my 2019.......I'm sooooo scared the pump will fail I've piddled all over town........NOT! Now if it grenades on the way back I'll cry like a little school girl and wait for the doomsday crew to let me have it on here!

 

[R.Taylor]

Thanks Don..... I just spit coffee all over my computer! Best CP4 comment ever, TDR Gold!

 

[SnoKing]

I'm going to Valdez on Sunday to tow a 14k pound boat back with my 2019.......I'm sooooo scared the pump will fail I've piddled all over town........NOT! Now if it grenades on the way back I'll cry like a little school girl and wait for the doomsday crew to let me have it on here!

Isn't this place in route?

 

[dieselshadow]

If Ram/Cummins doesn't work, maybe Ford or Chevy will. Something has to be problem free, right?

Um, nope. I don’t think there will ever be a utopian truck right from the factory. It’s engineered, built, and used by humans. We’re guaranteed to find a fault because we are faulty as a whole. We make mistakes. Our bosses tell us to cut a corner, don’t worry about this or that. Perhaps something “fell through the cracks.”

Life is too short to worry about small stuff. And it all seems like small stuff. I’m gonna go have a barley pop or two this evening and enjoy life.

 

[endoscott]

I like to drive my vehicles for a long time and a lot of miles. I wonder what % of CP4s are going to fail by 150,000 miles. Most of them? "only" 50%? Most of them by 200,000? I just don't want a truck with the potential of catastrophic failure going down the road,towing a big trailer. Plus the resale on these will probably suck past 100,000 miles. My old 2003 that my son drives has actually appreciated over the last few years. And its not just a catastrophic failure of the truck, its a giant failure of FCA customer service and parts supply. I had to wait several weeks just to get radio unit replaced (refurb at that) but at least I could drive it. Personally I am waiting on a new truck until we see how this CP4 debacle shakes out. Maybe I can get 300K out of the '14. I mean the 4runners can do that easily! The "new" '97 we got has 185K and when I put the Bilsteins on the original shocks didnt even look all that bad. If Toyota made a diesel truck I would buy one in a heartbeat.

 

[Minnow101]

Everyone’s quick to poo poo a known issue and defend Ram , right up until the point that its their truck alongside the interstate with the hood up.

 

[Ozymandias]

With Cummins it's not a known issue till today and you can be sure that BOSCH went over this pump after the failures in the DM application. R&D is an ongoing process.

 

[SnoKing]

With Cummins it's not a known issue till today and you can be sure that BOSCH went over this pump after the failures in the DM application. R&D is an ongoing process.

The problem in the US started with VW and the CP4.1 and a government investigation. Along the line they added Ford and the CP4.2 to the investigation. Then the class action lawsuits started. Why would RAM be so stupid to install the CP4.2? GM could not take the pain and switched to the Denso HP4, while Ford continued to blame the user and the fuel they put in the truck. Which brings us to the issue that America diesel does not meet Bosch's specs. A 70 to 80K truck deserves better.

 

[endoscott]

Ozzy,when Bosch went over it they kicked the engineers out of the room and went with the forkin' bean counters. Some of the failure posts on diesel forums are on brand new trucks with very low mileage. These would be newer pumps. Why does it seem impossible to get an actual % of failure from Bosch or FCA? They aren't hiding anything are they? Maybe these bean counters say they can take 7% (5%? make up a number) failure up to 100,000 miles. After that its all on the owner with an increasing likelihood of failure. Heck it could even be an exponential increase in rate of failure at some point. Maybe even likely. Somebody good at math could figure that out if data was actually available. The Bosch fallback position "You Americans need to make better fuel, it's not the poorly engineered pump to blame". Personally, if there was an OPTION for an upgraded pump, say a CP3-like design that could handle the pressure, I would pay an extra $500 or $1000...will be interesting to follow the Denso pumps for a few years and see how those fare.

 

[Wiredawg]

The problem in the US started with VW and the CP4.1 and a government investigation. Along the line they added Ford and the CP4.2 to the investigation. Then the class action lawsuits started. Why would RAM be so stupid to install the CP4.2? GM could not take the pain and switched to the Denso HP4, while Ford continued to blame the user and the fuel they put in the truck. Which brings us to the issue that America diesel does not meet Bosch's specs. A 70 to 80K truck deserves better.

Sno,

I know its nitpicking, but its Cummins, not Ram choosing and installing CP4S on the engines. It becomes Ram as a matter of warranty due to the engine purchase agreement with Cummins. After that, it's likely a team effort unless there's a divorce, like Ford and NAVSTAR.

It will be interesting to see how it plays out, especially if folks stop buying AND its attributable to CP4.

Cheers, Ron

 

[SnoKing]

Sno,

I know its nitpicking, but its Cummins, not Ram choosing and installing CP4S on the engines. It becomes Ram as a matter of warranty due to the engine purchase agreement with Cummins. After that, it's likely a team effort unless there's a divorce, like Ford and NAVSTAR.

It will be interesting to see how it plays out, especially if folks stop buying AND its attributable to CP4.

Cheers, Ron

All I know it that my "OLD" weak 385/865 2015 looks awful nice with just 70K on the clock and 3 more years on Max Care warrany! To boot, it was paid for before we got on the Airplane to Colorado to drive it back to Washington in 2015.

 

[TFucili]

 

[Wiredawg]

View attachment 124490

Tom/All,

Has anyone noticed anything shiney in your fuel filters? I know the gallery is going jump on that like a cat on a bird, BUT, I think this injection pump is still fuel lubed (the problem?) and cooled, therefore, some fuel goes back to the tank AND maybe some very small particles iback through the filters.

It would be interesting to get more info about all the components in the system... Does the fuel tank require draining and cleaning after a CP4 grenades? Is there some gradual degradation over time (increased wear and tear), (seals issues?) or does it have an instantaneous catostrphic failure? Any symptoms whatsoever?

Since I don't have a dawg in this fight, I don't have the interest to do lots of research, but would be interesting to see more details from the interested parties, maybe even some aftermarket companies offering alternative CP3 kits or FASS (see earlier post in this thread).

Hope all you 2019+ owners make it through this fine without any problems.

Cheers, Ron

 

[TFucili]

Ron, it is my understanding the fuel tank would need to be drained, dropped, and swabbed out. I have read of instances where dealers insisted on a new tank, but I personally don't see the need. As far as shiners making it back through to the filters, I don't know, but it seems like once the destruction starts it goes from running to zero pretty quickly. The FCA seems to be where to inspect for debris. I have not had mine out.

I hope mine goes a good long time.

 

[Signal73]

For the paranoid II and S&S both have “no tune required” CP3 conversion kits available. I will follow the pages through my warranty period and if it’s looking like a time bomb I will pony up for the kit. It beats going to buy a new truck if that’s the only weak link!

 

[DonFitzwater]

Somehow my 2019 3500 that I’ve nicknamed “The piddler” has managed to make it all the way to Valdez and back to Fairbanks under its own power.....towing a rather large boat too....i was so scared!

 

[SnoKing]

Somehow my 2019 3500 that I’ve nicknamed “The piddler” has managed to make it all the way to Valdez and back to Fairbanks under its own power.....towing a rather large boat too....i was so scared!

The question is, did you stop at Lucky's Grille and Sports Pub?

 

[dieselshadow]

The question is, did you stop at Lucky's Grille and Sports Pub?

I’m surprised your truck hasn’t spontaneously combusted sitting in the yard..... It’s happened to vehicles before. Are you prepared?

Seriously, can we all not have different opinions and perceptions on how serious this CP4 issue is on Rams? No need to constantly poke folks.

 

[DonFitzwater]

The question is, did you stop at Lucky's Grille and Sports Pub?

Absolutely not sir....made a 12.5 hour round trip....and that’s including passing some seriously oversized military accoutrements that were being transported between Valdez and Fort Greely.

 

[Herman8r]

Do all 2021 models have the CP4 or just the 3500 models?
Just left the dealer ---did a mock up purchase of a 2021 Big Horn 2500, 8ft bed (they are hard to find to find in a 2020 model) and delivery time is 8 to 10 weeks.
Just wondering.
HJR