ZF Powerline for 2025 RAM HD Diesel

[Diesel85]

This is perfect timing...!

I want to get my new RAM Cummins in 2026-2027 after my warranty expires on the EcoD. So the new style truck will be out for a few years before me digging into it.

https://moparinsiders.com/updated-ram-heavy-duty-coming-later-this-year/

Really will be nice to have a ZF 8 speed behind a Cummins. Rather that than a 10 speed.

After driving the EcoD for an entire year, the ZF 8 speed is a fantastic transmission for diesel engines. I notice it uses gears 1-6 for all of the power, and for coasting along 7-8 act like double overdrives for great fuel economy.

Comparing it to the AISIN for logic, it acts similar to it (albeit much smoother!), but it's like having two extra gears for just cruising on the highway. Is probably the best way I can explain it.

I hope with this change that RAM puts the HO 6.7l behind the 2500, along with removal of the hump in the floor, and I will be sold if that happens. (Not much to ask for, LOL!)

I do wonder if they are putting the newly redesigned CP4 in as well, since they supposedly fixed the problems and are using the EcoD as a test mule?

 

[Ozymandias]

I guess they stick to the CP3 now after that desaster.

 

[Diesel85]

I guess they stick to the CP3 now after that desaster.

Not sure.

I got a feeling after the last debacle with the CARB/EPA, they may not want to take chances.

The whole point of the CP4 was for the higher rail pressures, even though it has less flow. I think the CP3 is 26,000 PSI and the CP4 could deliver 29,000 PSI (actually more like 39,000 PSI on certain designs). 3,000+ PSI is a lot in the grand scheme of things for atomization of fuel for tighter emissions.

My thoughts are Cummins/RAM is prepping themselves for EPA2027 tightened emissions. More so, if it's like anything else we learned in history with Cummins.

I'm perfectly fine if they stick with the CP3.

I'm sitting back watching with my bag of popcorn.

 

[06 Dodge]

This is perfect timing...!

I want to get my new RAM Cummins in 2026-2027 after my warranty expires on the EcoD. So the new style truck will be out for a few years before me digging into it.

https://moparinsiders.com/updated-ram-heavy-duty-coming-later-this-year/

Really will be nice to have a ZF 8 speed behind a Cummins. Rather that than a 10 speed.

After driving the EcoD for an entire year, the ZF 8 speed is a fantastic transmission for diesel engines. I notice it uses gears 1-6 for all of the power, and for coasting along 7-8 act like double overdrives for great fuel economy.

Comparing it to the AISIN for logic, it acts similar to it (albeit much smoother!), but it's like having two extra gears for just cruising on the highway. Is probably the best way I can explain it.

I hope with this change that RAM puts the HO 6.7l behind the 2500, along with removal of the hump in the floor, and I will be sold if that happens. (Not much to ask for, LOL!)

I do wonder if they are putting the newly redesigned CP4 in as well, since they supposedly fixed the problems and are using the EcoD as a test mule?

Well I hope its a better one than the ZF-8 in the 1500's that takes $30. qt AFT when you change trans filter its built into the trans pan so to change the filter you also buy a new trans pan an if you can get a dealer to service it being the trans it has to be level, it comes with no dip stick your looking to spend $900

 

[Diesel85]

Well I hope its a better one than the ZF-8 in the 1500's that takes $30. qt AFT when you change trans filter its built into the trans pan so to change the filter you also buy a new trans pan an if you can get a dealer to service it being the trans it has to be level, it comes with no dip stick your looking to spend $900

I did my ZF on my EcoD at 52K miles last summer, and it wasn't that bad. Not as easy as an AISIN or 68RFE or most other transmissions I've done routine service on.

Key piece is keeping it level, 90F fluid temperature, and running it through them gears. I was a nervous wreck doing it the first time, knowing my transmission was running with low transmission fluid and I had to fill it while the truck was running, all while keeping the fluid around 90-100F.

Now after doing it once, I could do it twice as fast (and not wearing and drinking a quart of ZF transmission fluid!).

Yes, I totally agree the pan and fluid is stupid expensive for what it is. Along with the service procedure.

I bought the Mopar fluid and Mopar pan with gasket at a discount, and it still cost me slightly under $500.

 

[Ozymandias]

Most uses it's a Lifetime filling or very close to it, you aren't going to change that fluid every 30k like on an Aisin.
I'm not going to judge that lifetime stuff.

 

[Diesel85]

Most uses it's a Lifetime filling or very close to it, you aren't going to change that fluid every 30k like on an Aisin.
I'm not going to judge that lifetime stuff.

I would never, ever keep fluid in a transmission for life!

After doing the fluid in my ZF in my EcoD, no way, no how is that a "lifetime" fill. I kick myself for not doing a fluid analysis...

I find that the ZF 8HP75 at least under normal driving should be changed around 50-70k miles. No more. Towing? Like 50k miles at minimum.

Here's what my ZF 8HP75 fluid looked like at 52K miles and 3 years... new fluid is a clearer, but dark army green and see through. Magnets did pick up fine debris from the clutch and drum materials, but still a lot of very, very fine debris/particulate matter suspended in the fluid making it nearly black with a slight green hue.

 

[06 Dodge]

Most uses it's a Lifetime filling or very close to it, you aren't going to change that fluid every 30k like on an Aisin.
I'm not going to judge that lifetime stuff.

On another forum someone emailed ZF asking about when they should service the ZF-8 in their truck iirc they were told 5-6 years, 80k max, 50k if towing frequently, its FCA and an a few other manufactures that got the bright idea that claim the ZF ATF is life time, but when you ask them how long that lifetime is they refuse to say...

 

[bcbender]

Well.. we'll see, but Im not a fan of that direction, and as stated before, unless they change the cab, there really is not benefit to me to spend more money for less truck.

 

[Diesel85]

Well.. we'll see, but Im not a fan of that direction, and as stated before, unless they change the cab, there really is not benefit to me to spend more money for less truck.

I have a feeling it's going to be the same frame and chassis. Just a change in the power train, specifically the transmission.

Does anyone know if the reason they don't put the HO in the 2500 is because of frame/chassis limitations? Or is it just RAM being RAM?

Hopefully by the time I'm ready to upgrade my truck, they are at least on a new platform and most importantly, it's been out for at least 2 years a minimum.

No way am I buying something new to be a guinea pig.

 

[bcbender]

Does anyone know if the reason they don't put the HO in the 2500 is because of frame/chassis limitations?

Most likely cost and marketing.. almost all companies are reducing MTOCs (Model, Trim, Options, Cost).. Notice you cant buy a reg cab or even 2wd Limited or Longhorn.. No longbed 1500s.. Same goes for the AISIN.. No need really in a 10k GVWR truck as the 68RFE is more than capable for the usage, and likely costs more for that TM. If you want it, you buy the 3500 and pay more its that simple. That also allows them (not only RAM) to differentiates the MTOC and make pricing more simple instead of having model overlap at both Options and Cost. I have now owned many early launch vehicles and knock on wood they really arent all that bad. Aside from change over years having interesting issues when it comes to ordering parts long down the road the mfg have done decent job making things reliable. My 04 was a "first year" with the 305/555 and it was fine, my 20 is 2cnd year and aside from the CP4 not being able to survive on a real engine it has been decent.. I would not hesitate if I had the means and something stellar came along to jump in while I'm still young. Best part about being an early adopter is that you have the new body truck for the longest time.. My 20 is the first truck I've ever owned that was the "Current" bodystyle...

JM2C but I still like my 6spd!

 

[Diesel85]

Most likely cost and marketing.. almost all companies are reducing MTOCs (Model, Trim, Options, Cost).. Notice you cant buy a reg cab or even 2wd Limited or Longhorn.. No longbed 1500s.. Same goes for the AISIN.. No need really in a 10k GVWR truck as the 68RFE is more than capable for the usage, and likely costs more for that TM. If you want it, you buy the 3500 and pay more its that simple. That also allows them (not only RAM) to differentiates the MTOC and make pricing more simple instead of having model overlap at both Options and Cost. I have now owned many early launch vehicles and knock on wood they really arent all that bad. Aside from change over years having interesting issues when it comes to ordering parts long down the road the mfg have done decent job making things reliable. My 04 was a "first year" with the 305/555 and it was fine, my 20 is 2cnd year and aside from the CP4 not being able to survive on a real engine it has been decent.. I would not hesitate if I had the means and something stellar came along to jump in while I'm still young. Best part about being an early adopter is that you have the new body truck for the longest time.. My 20 is the first truck I've ever owned that was the "Current" bodystyle...

JM2C but I still like my 6spd!

I got the 2020 Gen 5 1500, even though in early 2023. But I did the research. Knock on wood -- NO problems.

The 6 speeds are OK. Not saying they are that bad, but after driving with the AISIN for so long, and then testing out a few 68RFE trucks, then I was sold on the ZF on the EcoD. However, if I was towing what I plan on towing in a few years, no way the EcoD will cut it.

Who knows, maybe maybe this ZF transmission will be terrible and make the AISIN and 68RFE shine. Won't know till they start making them and real people, including myself start putting seat time behind them.

If it indeed will be 2025, I will be for SURE to test drive it ASAP to make up my mind to hold off or not.

All we know is that this article is pure speculation.

It sure is fun to dream and discuss.

 

[crispyboy]

To me this is certainly good news. My truck is a first generation 68RFE and the shifting characteristics is something I truly hate about the vehicle.
My mother has a 2020 Grand Cherokee with the ZF transmission. It is a smooth operating transmission that always seems to be in the correct gear. I know they are using the ZF in the Hemi 2500 trucks since 2019 and I haven't heard any complaints. I have always heard complaints about the 66RFE used in the gas trucks.

 

[Cummins12V98]

Is this just replacing the 68rfe and the AISIN will still be available?

 

[AH64ID]

Is this just replacing the 68rfe and the AISIN will still be available?

Rumor is they are both being replaced with a single transmission

 

[bcbender]

Rumor is they are both being replaced with a single transmission

Likely to save money... not to the benefit of the end user.

 

[AH64ID]

Likely to save money... not to the benefit of the end user.

No reason it wouldn’t benefit the end user thou. If it’s as robust as an Aisin and is standard on all Ram CTD’s then everyone wins.

 

[Diesel85]

To me this is certainly good news. My truck is a first generation 68RFE and the shifting characteristics is something I truly hate about the vehicle.
My mother has a 2020 Grand Cherokee with the ZF transmission. It is a smooth operating transmission that always seems to be in the correct gear. I know they are using the ZF in the Hemi 2500 trucks since 2019 and I haven't heard any complaints. I have always heard complaints about the 66RFE used in the gas trucks.

The ZF behind my 2020 Gen 3 EcoD is what sold me on this truck. I get enough fun from the AISIN on my work truck.

The best way I can put it from driving both the AISIN and the 68RFE is that the ZF's 7 & 8 gears are really double overdrives. Not for pulling. Just straight up cruising gears for better fuel economy mainly when unloaded or very low torque input. The 1-6 gears in my opinion do all of the work just like if it were a 6 speed gear box. In fact, I think it holds a better 6th gear even unloaded than the AISIN or 68RFE does when giving it some more diesel juice.

Oh, and the shift speeds. I've never seen anything shift so darn quick for a diesel and how it handles the low rpm torque so dang effectively.

As long as it's a reliable and smart transmission, then I have no problems with it.

No reason it wouldn’t benefit the end user thou. If it’s as robust as an Aisin and is standard on all Ram CTD’s then everyone wins.

Totally agree.

In fact it would make it less likely for mistakes to happen with service too.

 

[bcbender]

Time will tell. One size fits all usually comes with some compromises. I'm not looking to buy anything anytime soon so I can sit with my popcorn and watch.

 

[Ozymandias]

Quick shift is the key to keep to boost up on a CTD.