Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) 1000rpm, 2% throttle and wont turn off

[Ted Constantine]

Of course the truck never breaks in the driveway, right.





I am on a trip overnight and after a couple hours of non stop highway I get off to use the bathroom and notice the truck is idling at 1000rpm. Weird but I continue. First time I pull off for food and go to shut down the truck it will not shut down. I screw with the juice and find the throttle % at 2% and turn off the turbo timer to ensure it is not keeping to truck running. I end up intentionally stalling the truck to shut it down. This resets the system and on startup all is well.



I drive another hour and everything is normal. But after the next longer period of highway I notice the same thing while exiting. I am back up to 1000rpm, 2% and it won't turn off.



Ideas? The Juice? TPS?



This is a 2001. 5 HO with dd2s, juice..... and a bunch of stuff that does not matter for this case. I need help.



Thanks

Ted

 

[Cummins724]

I'd unplug the juice & see if it still occurs..... then diagnose it.

 

[Ted Constantine]

still happened with the juice disconnected but the truck will shut down without the juice. So the throttle issue is not the juice but the juice is not letting it shut down with this condition.



Thoughts?

 

[Graphic man]

did you check for codes?

 

[SWC]

Ted, what you describe without the juice is what I have had for quite a while.

I have had an EZ on my truck for around 5 years. My truck will idle somewhere around 900 to 1100 rpm when this happens. It will always shut off when I turn off the key. Like yours when the engines shuts off, the engine idles normally for a while. This higher idle will only occur if I use the cruise. My Pac brake will not engage when this happens. This started about 1 1/2 years after I bought the truck. With warranty still on the truck, I took off the EZ, went to the dealer and they could not reproduce the problem. There were no codes either. Under warranty they charged me for hooking up their scanner and not finding anything. I asked why they charged me the scanner fee? They said they do that if they can't reproduce the problem. I said in other words you are calling me a liar. The service writer didn't know what to say! I believe that is the last time I have been there.

The problem with the Pac brake? I bypassed the ECM for the closed throttle signal to the Pac brake. Now I have immediate Pac brake.

I assume the problem is in the ECM. Basiclly being a tightwad I live with the problem rather then spend the money to get a new ECM.

Stan

 

[Ted Constantine]

two codes: 1693 and 0500. the first I believe is the one always there with any computer box second I have not seen before. It is something about a speed sensor. I don't know.

SWC,
What have you done to try to fix this?

 

[SWC]

Ted, sorry I haven't responded sooner. I have just lived with this problem. The problem with the Pac brake I worked around. The high idle is annoying, but I can live with it.

I am not sure if the problem is in the ECM or the APPS. The ECM is not reading idle throttle position. I assume the cruise control is based in the ECM. This would explain the problem only occuring if I use the cruise. Were you using the cruise control when this happened to you?

Sure as I spend the money on an ECM the problem will be in the APPS, or the other way around.

It is interesting that when you have the juice on that the fuel will not shut off to the injection pump. Have you contacted Edge about this?

This doesn't help you much but that is all I can add.

Not too many people have had this problem by the lack of response to this thread and in 911.

Stan

 

[Elk_aholic]

Ted, talk about coincidence. This past week I experienced the same symptoms as you with my 01. 5' and similar accessories! Kinda freaked me out the first time it happened. I had been traveling for a few hours non-stop pulling my fifth wheel when we stopped for lunch and the truck would not shut off with the key and was "high" idling around 1100 rpm. My first thought was that somehow the attitudes temp cool down timer had been lowered but it hadn't and I wasn't able to disable this feature by pressing on the brake. I was able to get the truck shut down by disconnecting the wire harness from the edge ez. In order to try to determine if this was a one time fluke or not, I drove the truck non-stop for a few more hours using my normal driving habits which when freeway traveling involves traveling at around 75 mph with the cruise engaged. Low and behold, upon stopping for a pee break the same thing occured and I went through the same motions as above. Earlier in the week I noticed that when I went to use the Jacobs exhaust brake while slowing to exit off the freeway, it would not engage? I determined that if I shut the cruise totally off rather than just cancelling it, before I activated the brake it would engage. I stress before because if I tried the brake while the cruise was in the on but non active mode, I would end up having to shut the truck off and on again for the brake to be able to function properly. Since I don't do a lot of freeway traveling and don't use the cruise very much, I figured I had just discovered that the ex. brake and cruise were not compatible to be operated at the same time, but also wondered why I hadn't heard or read about this?? Back to the no shut down/high idle mystery, I traveled the final couple hour leg of my journey without activating the cruise and everthing seemed to function normally?? Sorry for the long post, but the short of it is that the cruise seems to be the common denominator of the two scenarios??

Dean

 

[Elk_aholic]

In my previous post, I mentioned "edge ez" when I meant to say "edge juice". Sorry for any confusion.

 

[Ted Constantine]

The common thread is the idle. My exhaust brake is not ECM controlled so i don't know about the rest of it. The not shutting down appears to be the juice recognizing that there is throttle present. I have to think that this has to do with the turbo timer override mechanism. You know if you want to shut down without waiting for the turbo timer you tap the throttle showing a cycle of the throttle from 0% up and back to 0%. I wonder if part of this requires a 0% throttle to shut down.



I can't reproduce any of this without a trip of at least 1. 5hrs so I don't yet know if the apps fixed the issue. your issues make me think it is a ECM issue.



Did you try to turn off the cruize control when it would not shut down to see if that effected anything? I did not try that or even think of it

 

[Ted Constantine]

Elk,

do you have any codes??

ted

 

[Elk_aholic]

Ted,



I checked for codes last night and have the same as you, 1693 and 0500? You mentioned your juice shows 2% throttle?? I looked through all my menus last night and can't find this option on mine? Also, when setting the temp for the turbo timer, I get a message that says for emergency shut down, depress the brake pedal to override timer? By the way, I did try shutting off the cruise when truck would not shut down and that didn't work??? You replaced your apps since this occurrence??

Dean

 

[Ted Constantine]

Yes i replaced the APPS after this thinking it was the cause but now I am not sure. I don't know what codes are normal with a juice hooked up. I believe the 1693 is there with any power module but is the 0500 related to our issue or the fact that the juice is pulling off the speed sensor for the speedo calibration?

In the juice display menu there is a setting called throttle %. it should be pretty easy to find as they are in alphabetical order it is between speed and trans temp. Mine does say tap the throttle to shut down for the turbo timer.

So obviously there are differences in the versions of the juice we have but the symptoms we get are the same so my thought is that the juice is not the issue it is just reacting to other issues.

I need to find out what the 0500 means. It is the ECM not seeing a signal from the speed sensor but i really don't know what this means.

ted

 

[NoSeeUm]

I don't have a Juice, but I do have a ScanGauge. I can get the percent of throttle position to display on it as well. The ScanGauge just looks at what the ECM holds for that value and displays it.



I would bet that is also what the Juice uses. So in my case and maybe in your case I would assume that your 2% open indication is actually what the ECM believes the throttle position to be.



That does not explain why the engine will not shutdown.



Have you tried disconnecting every electric / electronic gadget you have hooked up and going completely back to stock?



Jim

 

[Hornball]

Hi guys I am having the same problem with my 01 also. Freeway drives with the cruise on and when I pull off idle at 900rpm. I dont have a juice either, I have comp box. Also my truck is an 01. 5 but not an HO, it's a five speed, ETC motor. Im not sure if its related but when not running cruise I feel like the truck is surging slightly also, could be just me though. Anyway sorry for the long post. Did anybody find out anything other than ecm or apps?



Kevin

 

[Ted Constantine]

well I have since sold the truck but... .

I changed the apps and thought I had it fixed. I never did to again but has happened once to the new owner so I don't think it was the apps.

I think the 0500 code is the answer but we don't know what it really means as it appears to mean just about anything related to weird sensor readings.

So sorry but I don't have any real answers. the only thing we know for sure is that the juice is what keeps it from shutting down but only because it is seeing throttle. Not its fault.

Ted

 

[GHolcomb]

Hey Guys,



Hate to come in on the end of this one, but I think the common thing is the cruise. I have read other posts about the problem after extended time on cruise. I think you are right about the juice keeping it running.



This happened to me about a month ago on a trip to Fla. My experience is that if you go for between one and two hours on cruise, you get the high idle. If you go longer than about two hours, you get a dead pedal and in my case got a MIL as well. Shutting the truck off reset everything and I continued my trip.



It seems like the longer you are on cruise the more likely the computer is to forget the pedal is there!



Now that I know what to expect, I am just living with it.



Greg

 

[GiesJ]

Ted -

No more Dodge??

Hope things are well and you are shopping for a new horse in the stable...

Jason

 

[LUnderwood]

I've had to deal with this problem in more than one truck! All the Exact Symptoms except for the shut down issue! In all cases the APPS Was the culprit! in 2 Cases it failed without any codes and started a dead pedal. I would look at the APPS as a major posibility!

 

[BBliss]

do not discount the fact that you had a 1693 code, this means something!!! the dodge has two computers to search for codes, pcm and ecm, a 1693 code in the pcm means that there is a code in the ecm that must be dealt with and likewise a 1693 in the ecm means there is a code in the pcm. By the way the apps can set codes in either or both computers.