Vaughn MacKenzie
TDR MEMBER
update?
Whitenite, any more news worth posting?
Whitenite, any more news worth posting?
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Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) 24v gone at 14,000 miles
- Thread starter whiteknight
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Tell them THEY, (the mechanic) will be the ones evaluated!!!
Imbeciles!
Whatever happens, get your truck out of there, NOW!
Check the turbo oil line.
whiteknight
TDR MEMBER
I don't have to much news so far. Fleetguard now has the oil filter and they told dad it was in their lab and as soon as they had tested it they would send him the lab results.
Dad did go to a dealer in the next town and they printed out the service history of the truck according to Chrysler and it didn't show anything about it being brought it with the engine lock-up. So I'm not sure at this point if the dealer that has it has even turned anything into chrysler about denying warranty on it.
One interesting bit of info dad got though was a printout from chrysler stating just what some of you guys have been saying about them reprogramming the oil gauge. I was a little surprised they would give that to him (in writing no less). It stated that if the customer complains about a low oil pressure reading, the dealer is to check with a mechanical gauge to be sure the oil pressure is actually correct. if so, then they should reprogram the computer to compensate for the low reading. (If I had a scanner I would try and post it here)
Dad did go to the insurance office and dropped the insurance on it back to were the only coverage it has is if it is damaged by a storm or something like that. That should get chrysler credit's attention.
As soon as anything else happens I'll let you know.
Sled Puller: I was wondering about the turbo line myself or even the turbo itself. I only looked at it when this all happened and we were waiting for the wrecker, but I didn't see anything wrong with it though.
Dad did go to a dealer in the next town and they printed out the service history of the truck according to Chrysler and it didn't show anything about it being brought it with the engine lock-up. So I'm not sure at this point if the dealer that has it has even turned anything into chrysler about denying warranty on it.
One interesting bit of info dad got though was a printout from chrysler stating just what some of you guys have been saying about them reprogramming the oil gauge. I was a little surprised they would give that to him (in writing no less). It stated that if the customer complains about a low oil pressure reading, the dealer is to check with a mechanical gauge to be sure the oil pressure is actually correct. if so, then they should reprogram the computer to compensate for the low reading. (If I had a scanner I would try and post it here)
Dad did go to the insurance office and dropped the insurance on it back to were the only coverage it has is if it is damaged by a storm or something like that. That should get chrysler credit's attention.
As soon as anything else happens I'll let you know.
Sled Puller: I was wondering about the turbo line myself or even the turbo itself. I only looked at it when this all happened and we were waiting for the wrecker, but I didn't see anything wrong with it though.
whiteknight
TDR MEMBER
UPDATE: Today we recived the lab report from Fleetguard which states that the filter is fine. The filter media, seam, shell, Center Tb (I'm not sure what that refers to), Gasket all tested fine. It states that it was impulse pressure tested from 0 to 125psi at . 5 hz for 10,000 cycles with no leaks or structural failure. It also states that the installation torque was 13 ft/lbs and removal torque was 25. 8 ft/lbs.
He took this information to the dealer here in Desoto, MO who it was towed to and they still said it was the filter that failed. So he called Chrysler customer service and the lady that he spoke with told him he would have to file for an arbitration request. She also told him that he didn't have any business changing the filter because he wasn't qualified. That when he got a little hot and told her that that is exactly what he has been doing for the last 30 years for a dealership.
This afternoon we both went back down to the dealer because dad needed the exact milage to fill out this form. I hadn't said anything until the service manager came out and mentioned how the gasket was sticking out of the filter and thats when I lost it. I told him he was full of @#$% I looked at the filter before the wrecker got there and the gasket was not sticking out of the filter. He then turned to my dad and asked him about it, he said "you were here when we took of the filter" and dad said "yea, I saw your mecanic take his finger and flip the gasket out of the groove when he took the filter off and handed the filter and gasket to you in two pieces". The service manger then got in a huff and said he wasn't doing any more to help him. (Like he was before) I am so fed up with this dealer and Chrysler.
He took this information to the dealer here in Desoto, MO who it was towed to and they still said it was the filter that failed. So he called Chrysler customer service and the lady that he spoke with told him he would have to file for an arbitration request. She also told him that he didn't have any business changing the filter because he wasn't qualified. That when he got a little hot and told her that that is exactly what he has been doing for the last 30 years for a dealership.
This afternoon we both went back down to the dealer because dad needed the exact milage to fill out this form. I hadn't said anything until the service manager came out and mentioned how the gasket was sticking out of the filter and thats when I lost it. I told him he was full of @#$% I looked at the filter before the wrecker got there and the gasket was not sticking out of the filter. He then turned to my dad and asked him about it, he said "you were here when we took of the filter" and dad said "yea, I saw your mecanic take his finger and flip the gasket out of the groove when he took the filter off and handed the filter and gasket to you in two pieces". The service manger then got in a huff and said he wasn't doing any more to help him. (Like he was before) I am so fed up with this dealer and Chrysler.
I would be hiring a lawyer at this point and begin recording all the evidence that you have... every word... every detail... in a chronological order... he with the most evidence will win in court by a preponderance of the evidence, pure and simple. They may appear to be right, but you will look more right so you will prevail.
First off I would have my truck taken to a competent dealer thats not up to no good. If they are lying cheating and stealing someone else will gladly take the truck to do warranty work on it. For the mechanic to push out the gasket is a very dishonest thing to do and is tantamount to stealing. I would post the name of the dealer so that others may know which dealer to avoid. Good luck with your repairs.
P. S. isnt the chrysler oil filter a rebadged fleetgaurd?
P. P. S if they diagnosed it as a failed oil filter without removing it. And fleetgaurd says its fine. I wouldnt let them touch my truck anyways.
P. S. isnt the chrysler oil filter a rebadged fleetgaurd?
P. P. S if they diagnosed it as a failed oil filter without removing it. And fleetgaurd says its fine. I wouldnt let them touch my truck anyways.
Last edited:
Go up the foodchain! let everyone know about it!
Talk to the owner of the dealership.
If all else fails take them or Chrysler to court.
Keep us posted.
--Justin
Talk to the owner of the dealership.
If all else fails take them or Chrysler to court.
Keep us posted.
--Justin
That mess just had to be repeated, as a service to TDR members, this dealer should be advertised in the mag- for NOT going to!
And they wonder why we go postal... ... ... .
I wish you luck in getting this taken care of under warranty.
But if your case works out like my brother-in-laws did. You won't get very far.
In his case he was driving to work one morning when with no warning he had #5 rod go threw the side of the block (318ci). He had it towed to the dealer he bought it from (60 mile tow BTW). After looking in the computer to check out the service history of the truck. The dealer told him warranty was canceled. He had no service work done by the dealer. My B-in-law them brought in receipts from the local shop he had all maint done on the truck. The longest interval in oil changes was 2247 miles. (This truck drives 80 mile round trip to work every day). Warranty was still denied. B-in-law then had lawyer brought into the mess.
To make a long story short. After it was all said and done. It cost my B-in-law $15,ooo. to get a new engine in his truck. 11k of that was for lawyer and court costs. The other 4k was for new engine. He did not win the court battle.
Need less to say Dodge has lost him as a repeat buyer.
But if your case works out like my brother-in-laws did. You won't get very far.
In his case he was driving to work one morning when with no warning he had #5 rod go threw the side of the block (318ci). He had it towed to the dealer he bought it from (60 mile tow BTW). After looking in the computer to check out the service history of the truck. The dealer told him warranty was canceled. He had no service work done by the dealer. My B-in-law them brought in receipts from the local shop he had all maint done on the truck. The longest interval in oil changes was 2247 miles. (This truck drives 80 mile round trip to work every day). Warranty was still denied. B-in-law then had lawyer brought into the mess.
To make a long story short. After it was all said and done. It cost my B-in-law $15,ooo. to get a new engine in his truck. 11k of that was for lawyer and court costs. The other 4k was for new engine. He did not win the court battle.
Need less to say Dodge has lost him as a repeat buyer.
Pay to tow it out of there TODAY!!! The source of the oil leak has to be determined. They (Dodge) are obviously stuck on blaming the filter, which has been determined to be OK by the professionals, Fleetguard. Therefore, it is paramount to determine the cause of the oil leak which, in the case of a failed engine component, is someones fault... but not yours. Get pictures... and more pictures before and after towing. And let them stick to their oil filter story... they dont have a leg to stand on. You did the right thing sending it to Fleetguard.
Phillip, at least whiteknight is dealing with a Cummins engine and Fleetguard Filters, which maybe gives more direction to turn to in this case. At least Dodge does not have the only say in this. I was unaware that all warranties were void if a person has a competent automotive repair facility perform general maintenance work. That would tell me that a enormous percentage of vehicles on the road actually are driving around with a false sense of available warranty. I suppose then DC could void your warranty after 3000 miles (first oil change) if you change your oil at Jiffy Lube. Sorry to hear about your brothers ordeal. Thats awful... and pathetic of any auto manufacturer to be like that.
This is from Cummins.com
"At Cummins, our customers always come first! If there's anything we can do for you, we want to know about it right away. Your opinions and input are important, so let us know what you're thinking. Our hours are Monday through Friday, 7am - 7pm eastern standard time, except for holidays. Please call us at 1-800-DIESELS (1-800-343-7357). "
"At Cummins, our customers always come first! If there's anything we can do for you, we want to know about it right away. Your opinions and input are important, so let us know what you're thinking. Our hours are Monday through Friday, 7am - 7pm eastern standard time, except for holidays. Please call us at 1-800-DIESELS (1-800-343-7357). "
All you need is proof of warranty service. It can be a receipt for the filter and the oil with your handwritten note of date changed and mileage, showing you did it yourself. Unless DC can prove that the work was done improperly you are covered. That is what the dealer in this case is trying to say. Example if the Fleetguard filter would of been purchased by the owner from Geno's and handed to the dealer to install then the dealer would not have a case. Since the filter was shown by Fleetguard to be OK, the dealer would be responsible for the quality of the installation. I am not saying that it was installed incorrectly, I am sure it was installed correctly. Again, sorry for your Fathers problem 
At least in the case I mentioned one of the items to go against him was the training of the people at the commerical garage. The shop had been in business for many years. But the owner and his employees had not gone to the effort of getting ASE cert. This and the fine print in contracts concerning warrenty's. Plus they did not due all the other service items listed in the owners manual for set mileages. Cost him the court battle.
But remember the problem was a broken rod. It did not spin a bearing. This was a mfg'ing defect in a major engine part. But they used the small print and any other thing they can to not do big money repairs.
Now one the other side of the coin. My sister has had two engines replaced under warrenty. She is married to the guy with the 15k engine in a 98 W100. But she had all work done at the Dodge dealer. Dodge has lost her as a customer now after the W100 problems.
The good part it is A cummins. But with Dodge not paying Cummins for any warrenty makes a bit of a problem. They controll the show. Cummins won't step in and start doing warrenty work for Dodge with out prior approval for payment from Dodge.
But remember the problem was a broken rod. It did not spin a bearing. This was a mfg'ing defect in a major engine part. But they used the small print and any other thing they can to not do big money repairs.
Now one the other side of the coin. My sister has had two engines replaced under warrenty. She is married to the guy with the 15k engine in a 98 W100. But she had all work done at the Dodge dealer. Dodge has lost her as a customer now after the W100 problems.
The good part it is A cummins. But with Dodge not paying Cummins for any warrenty makes a bit of a problem. They controll the show. Cummins won't step in and start doing warrenty work for Dodge with out prior approval for payment from Dodge.
Blew an Oil Gasket too
WhiteKnight,
I had an oil filter gasket severly leak and it was installed by the dealer... .
The '99 had about 50/55K and about 1500 after the dealer changed the oil filter. I had them put in Amsoil synthetic, the expensive stuff! Prior dealer oil changes alsway took 2 or 3 trips to the dealer.
First trip to change the oil & filter,
Second trip 1 to 3 days later to tighten the filter as it leaked and they were supposed to degrease the area.
Third trip to have them degrease the area because they forgot one the second trip.
When I went to pick up the truck from the last oil change (before the leak) I asked the service writer if they had tightened the filter this time as I asked. He didn't know, but crawled under and tightened it himself.
About 1500 miles later I was elk hunting in late Jan and 10 degrees. Fast flowing streams were frozen!! I had been driving about 3 hours and was 2 hours from the nearest pavement. I stopped to unload the ATV and left the truck running. I noticed a large oil puddle under the front of the truck
I was an hour from the ranch house. I looked under the hood and under the truck with it running and off and could not find the leak. I checked the oil and it was 2 qts low. I added a couple of qts I had, loaded the ATV and headed back. I would shut the engine off on straight stretches of road and coast downhill trying to minimize the oil loss. I watched the oil gauge like a hawk. I stopped a couple of times (when I wouldn't coast any more) and checked the oil. The oil pressure slowly dropped to about 20 or so PSI. Then it started to suck air and go to ZERO for a second and back to 20/25. When it went to ZERO for 3 or 4 seconds I decided to shut it down. It still had about 3 or 4 or maybe? 5 qts left. I was still 4 or 5 miles from the ranch so I used the ATV (Polaris of course--the way out!!) to get help and a tow. I still tried to find out the problem with a couple of mechanic friends, but we could not find the leak and the gasket looked OK. I couldn't remove the filter it was on so tight. We went to town and bought a case of cheap oil. days later at the end of the hunt I started for town pumping oil. Did the same routine of coasting downhill and only started the engine to turn or brake. Had to stop 3 times to fill the oil up. Used all but 6 qts to get to walmart to buy more oil and my hunting buddies went to the dodge dealer to get a filter. I got an oil wrench and mangled the filter trying to get it off. The gasket was OK. No breaks, no deformities, not out of the groove, nothing
I put on the new filter and added 4 qts of oil and there was NO LEAK 
... .
I went to the dealer and was one very unhappy camper. They stonewalled me too, but I did get a filter and dodge oil (Not Amsoil) plus labor.
That was my last trip to them. I installed an Amsoil Remote Dual bypass filtration system and at 8K miles it has not leaked one drop. Of course I installed it and love it.
Sorry for the long post, I wanted to say you must have had a total failure of the oil gasket to loose that much oil that fast, but it doesn't sound like the gasket was gone?? I pumped out 2 to 3 qts in about 5 to 8 minutes unloading the ATV. Oil was slung everywhere, but I was at an idle.
I sure hope everything goes well for your father. Keep us posted.
Richard
Remember Veterans Day -- To those who have fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know. - unknown author - found written in a foxhole in Korea.
my little corner of the world http://www.agrentals.net/veterans.htm
WhiteKnight,
I had an oil filter gasket severly leak and it was installed by the dealer... .
The '99 had about 50/55K and about 1500 after the dealer changed the oil filter. I had them put in Amsoil synthetic, the expensive stuff! Prior dealer oil changes alsway took 2 or 3 trips to the dealer.
First trip to change the oil & filter,
Second trip 1 to 3 days later to tighten the filter as it leaked and they were supposed to degrease the area.
Third trip to have them degrease the area because they forgot one the second trip.
When I went to pick up the truck from the last oil change (before the leak) I asked the service writer if they had tightened the filter this time as I asked. He didn't know, but crawled under and tightened it himself.
About 1500 miles later I was elk hunting in late Jan and 10 degrees. Fast flowing streams were frozen!! I had been driving about 3 hours and was 2 hours from the nearest pavement. I stopped to unload the ATV and left the truck running. I noticed a large oil puddle under the front of the truck
I was an hour from the ranch house. I looked under the hood and under the truck with it running and off and could not find the leak. I checked the oil and it was 2 qts low. I added a couple of qts I had, loaded the ATV and headed back. I would shut the engine off on straight stretches of road and coast downhill trying to minimize the oil loss. I watched the oil gauge like a hawk. I stopped a couple of times (when I wouldn't coast any more) and checked the oil. The oil pressure slowly dropped to about 20 or so PSI. Then it started to suck air and go to ZERO for a second and back to 20/25. When it went to ZERO for 3 or 4 seconds I decided to shut it down. It still had about 3 or 4 or maybe? 5 qts left. I was still 4 or 5 miles from the ranch so I used the ATV (Polaris of course--the way out!!) to get help and a tow. I still tried to find out the problem with a couple of mechanic friends, but we could not find the leak and the gasket looked OK. I couldn't remove the filter it was on so tight. We went to town and bought a case of cheap oil. days later at the end of the hunt I started for town pumping oil. Did the same routine of coasting downhill and only started the engine to turn or brake. Had to stop 3 times to fill the oil up. Used all but 6 qts to get to walmart to buy more oil and my hunting buddies went to the dodge dealer to get a filter. I got an oil wrench and mangled the filter trying to get it off. The gasket was OK. No breaks, no deformities, not out of the groove, nothing
I put on the new filter and added 4 qts of oil and there was NO LEAK ... . I went to the dealer and was one very unhappy camper. They stonewalled me too, but I did get a filter and dodge oil (Not Amsoil) plus labor.
That was my last trip to them. I installed an Amsoil Remote Dual bypass filtration system and at 8K miles it has not leaked one drop. Of course I installed it and love it.
Sorry for the long post, I wanted to say you must have had a total failure of the oil gasket to loose that much oil that fast, but it doesn't sound like the gasket was gone?? I pumped out 2 to 3 qts in about 5 to 8 minutes unloading the ATV. Oil was slung everywhere, but I was at an idle.
I sure hope everything goes well for your father. Keep us posted.
Richard
Remember Veterans Day -- To those who have fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know. - unknown author - found written in a foxhole in Korea.
my little corner of the world http://www.agrentals.net/veterans.htm
whiteknight
TDR MEMBER
UPDATE: Friday 11/08/02
The truck is back home at my dads house. We told the tow truck driver from Tom's Towing from here in Desoto, MO a little about what was going on and he told dad that when he got ready to have it towed to a repair shop that he would tow it for a reasonable price. We appreciated that.
Next week a certified Cummins mechanic is suppose to pressure test the engine and said he should be able to tell were the oil was coming from. I told dad to video tape the whole test.
We were on the phone with the selling dealer, Cummins and Chrysler customer service most of the day Friday. The selling dealer said that it appeared that Chrysler and the Chrysler Rep had pretty much made the decision that they aren't going to fixing it and there wasn't much they could do. Cummins told us the same thing. I even emailed Robert, thought maybe he would know some contacts with Chrysler or Cummins but I have not received anything from him as of yet either.
I have found a company called Akron Rubber Development Lab in Akron, OH that deals with product liability and offers expert witness services in forensic services for rubber failure analysis. I don't know how much it would cost for them to do an independent test on the filter and gasket specifically. I thought that would be a help in court along with the findings from Fleetguard. If we can prove where the oil came from and have two lab reports on the oil filter, I'm hopeful we might have a shot in court.
My mom is a diabetic and her blood sugar has been going crazy after all this happened and after watching her sit in the kitchen yesterday in tears, worrying about all this mess, and after reading some of the other posts I seriously doubt that I will ever buy another Dodge product if this is the way they treat their customers. My dad has high blood pressure and mom is worried about him because he won't even check it to see what it is. Unfortunately my wife has a 2003 Intrepid on order right now. (from a different dealer) Although I don't know if it would have been any different with any other brand in the same circumstance. My dad is retired from a Ford dealer (which is way he bought the Dodge) and I'm not very enthusiastic about the power stroke but its certainly looking better after all this.
PS: My wife and I were planning on leaving on a week-end camping trip and when I went to hook the the trailer up the ABS and brake light came on for the umpteenth time on my 96. So I just parked it back in the driveway, and unloaded the trailer and now I'm staying home. Now I have another Dodge to work on on Saturday. A perfect ending to a perfect week.
PS #2: To VeitDoc and all you others out there, our deepest respect and gratitude to you on this upcoming Veterans Day. May God bless all of you.
The truck is back home at my dads house. We told the tow truck driver from Tom's Towing from here in Desoto, MO a little about what was going on and he told dad that when he got ready to have it towed to a repair shop that he would tow it for a reasonable price. We appreciated that.
Next week a certified Cummins mechanic is suppose to pressure test the engine and said he should be able to tell were the oil was coming from. I told dad to video tape the whole test.
We were on the phone with the selling dealer, Cummins and Chrysler customer service most of the day Friday. The selling dealer said that it appeared that Chrysler and the Chrysler Rep had pretty much made the decision that they aren't going to fixing it and there wasn't much they could do. Cummins told us the same thing. I even emailed Robert, thought maybe he would know some contacts with Chrysler or Cummins but I have not received anything from him as of yet either.
I have found a company called Akron Rubber Development Lab in Akron, OH that deals with product liability and offers expert witness services in forensic services for rubber failure analysis. I don't know how much it would cost for them to do an independent test on the filter and gasket specifically. I thought that would be a help in court along with the findings from Fleetguard. If we can prove where the oil came from and have two lab reports on the oil filter, I'm hopeful we might have a shot in court.
My mom is a diabetic and her blood sugar has been going crazy after all this happened and after watching her sit in the kitchen yesterday in tears, worrying about all this mess, and after reading some of the other posts I seriously doubt that I will ever buy another Dodge product if this is the way they treat their customers. My dad has high blood pressure and mom is worried about him because he won't even check it to see what it is. Unfortunately my wife has a 2003 Intrepid on order right now. (from a different dealer) Although I don't know if it would have been any different with any other brand in the same circumstance. My dad is retired from a Ford dealer (which is way he bought the Dodge) and I'm not very enthusiastic about the power stroke but its certainly looking better after all this.
PS: My wife and I were planning on leaving on a week-end camping trip and when I went to hook the the trailer up the ABS and brake light came on for the umpteenth time on my 96. So I just parked it back in the driveway, and unloaded the trailer and now I'm staying home. Now I have another Dodge to work on on Saturday. A perfect ending to a perfect week.
PS #2: To VeitDoc and all you others out there, our deepest respect and gratitude to you on this upcoming Veterans Day. May God bless all of you.
whiteknight
I know this is a very stressfull time for you and all the family. I wish you luck.
They only thoughts I could add would be to fix the engine. Then find out if the low oil pressure warning is working. If it is not. Does your paper work say if it was turned off by Dodge. If it was. Then this would be the area I would work on in a court of law. They (Dodge) turned off a vital early warning protection circuit. If this circuit was working the way Cummins designed it. Then the owner would have been warned early enough shut down before damage.
I know this is a very stressfull time for you and all the family. I wish you luck.
They only thoughts I could add would be to fix the engine. Then find out if the low oil pressure warning is working. If it is not. Does your paper work say if it was turned off by Dodge. If it was. Then this would be the area I would work on in a court of law. They (Dodge) turned off a vital early warning protection circuit. If this circuit was working the way Cummins designed it. Then the owner would have been warned early enough shut down before damage.
makes me mad
things like this really make me mad... this is what warrenties are for, if a failure happens the customer doesn't have to be left holding the bag. ... . SO TO ALL YOU WORRIED ABOUT BOMBING AND VOIDING YOUR WARRENTY DONT BE,... . ITS VOID THE MINUTE IT LEAVES THE FACTORY!!! ... so it seems in so many cases.
None of my vehicles have ever been new enough to have a warrenty, but if I did I certainly would expect it do its job! most of us dont have the money to jack around with the big boys.
Whiteknight. . you would have been just as well off useing a 'Big bubbas chicken wire filter'! since obviously useing an approved filter makes no difference!
ok ok I am getting off my soap crate now... sorry for going off!
Jim
things like this really make me mad... this is what warrenties are for, if a failure happens the customer doesn't have to be left holding the bag. ... . SO TO ALL YOU WORRIED ABOUT BOMBING AND VOIDING YOUR WARRENTY DONT BE,... . ITS VOID THE MINUTE IT LEAVES THE FACTORY!!! ... so it seems in so many cases.
None of my vehicles have ever been new enough to have a warrenty, but if I did I certainly would expect it do its job! most of us dont have the money to jack around with the big boys.
Whiteknight. . you would have been just as well off useing a 'Big bubbas chicken wire filter'! since obviously useing an approved filter makes no difference!
ok ok I am getting off my soap crate now... sorry for going off!
Jim
Preach on Jim!!
--Justin
--Justin
I agree with Jim,they will sneak out of the warranty if possible. Whats sad id its been over a week,he still dont have his truck,and is looking at a big bill,by this time i would have drove my 3 yard loader thru one end of the shop and out the other without opening the shop door first. Then I would get a used low mileage 00-01 engine for 4-5grand and put it in my self,(this way you know its done right)and bomb it. It seems like bombed trucks have less problems than stockers,from what ive seen,of course highly bombed onew will have trans problems.
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Digital Magazines
FREE!
TDR Test Drive - Digital Edition
Renew
Subscribe
Gift Subscriptions
Back Issues
Subscription Status
Address Change Form
Buyer's Guides
Ram Diagnostic Trouble Codes
The Perfect Collection
The Perfect Collection Vol. II
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Dodge/Cummins Historical Overview
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What Makes Us Tick?
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