Thanks to all you big "OIL" boys, and to our lovely politicians... . What a rip off... I filled up today right here in lovely El Dorado Hills, CA. 20 miles east of Sacremento, CA.
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$3.20 for a gallon of Diesel !!!
- Thread starter Heavyweight
- Start Date
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Roger that... Here in Cali,,,, . 18 cents state and . 18 cents Federal tax per gallon. They should make the oil companies pay that.....
Heavyweight said:
Puh-leeeeez, give me a break. Anyone with half an education and an awareness of todays economy should be able to recognize that it's not politicians that control the price of oil. It is a GLOBAL MARKET!
Additional worldwide demand for oil is what's increasing our crude prices.
Diesel being more expensive than gas, especially in CA, is due to lack of refining capacity. CA is a hostile environment to do any business in, much more so for an oil company. No community wants a brand new refinery in their back yard, so they do not get built.
Some good reading here:
https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136391
Prices finally got high enough around here that it's falling inline with BioDiesel. I just got a tank of soy bean stuff for $3. 00 per gallon. If I'm going to pay those prices I'd rather put it in American farmers pockets than sending it offshore.
Lee
Lee
I'm trying not to drive the truck period. I don't need to right now, and I've been taking the motorcycle back and forth to work. Wife takes the Civic. We both get 40+ mpg. That's how I solve the problem.
Cleary, (I will out gun you anytime). The politicians do not regulate big oil? Do you know the profit margins of big OIL? Chevron, and Unocal etc. They are making money hand over fist, yet the consumer is getting screwed. Politicians including Bush are in their back pocket. Do not think for a second there is not an oil lobby, especially with their ring leader sitting in the "GREEN" room at 1600 Pennsylvania ave.
The refining line of crap is a total JOKE! Look at the oil companies profits!!!!! If you beleive that bull crap,,, :{
Oil companies rake in record profits in spite of falling production
In spite of falling production, The Wall Street Journal predicts tomorrow that oil companies will report record earnings for 2005. Lower production and costly drilling operations have been more than offset by an enormous rise in crude prices, leaving the industry's top 70 producers with a 26% net increase in earnings this year.
The report by Bhushan Bahree (with contributions by Russel Gold and Jeffrey Ball,) also claims that 2006 will likely see a plunge in profits. Though the industry is currently sitting on huge cash reserves, experts are predicting dips in oil profits for 2006, based on rising costs and an anticipation of lower prices per barrel.
Excerpts follow:
High Energy Prices Drive Earnings, But Some See Turn in 2006
By Bhushan Bahree Staff Reporter, The Wall Street Journal July 26, 2005
...
In a report published last week, Merrill Lynch & Co. said the aggregate net income of the 70 largest companies in the sector is expected to rise 26% this year to $230 billion, on sales of $2. 57 trillion, up nearly 10%. The reasons: high oil prices and fat refining margins, plus a pickup in oil-field services, particularly in rates for drilling rigs. The 70 companies are expected to return about $110 billion to shareholders this year through dividends and share buybacks, Merrill Lynch added.
But next year, the sector's net income is forecast to decline to $205 billion due to an expected easing of oil prices and slimmer margins on gasoline and other refined petroleum products. Increased spending on new oil and gas projects, now being ramped up to offset depletion of existing fields, is starting to take a toll. Shell recently announced that its giant gas development in Sakhalin, Russia, could cost as much as $20 billion, twice the original estimate. Merrill Lynch says that the cost of finding and developing oil rose 22% in 2004.
...
Exxon is expected to report Thursday an approximately 40% increase in earnings over the year-earlier quarter, though its production is expected to stay basically flat, according to Deutsche Bank and Oppenheimer & Co.
...
At Shell, despite an expected 3% fall in production, higher oil prices are expected to boost exploration and production profits by 43% in the second quarter and lift companywide earnings once again when the company reports on Thursday, Deutsche Bank estimates. France's Total SA is expected to report an increase in net income of 30% to 40% or more on Aug. 4. "If anything, it should be toward the upper end of that," said Lucas Herrmann, a Deutsche Bank analyst in London, citing output growth at the company and strong refining margins. Total is Europe's largest refiner of crude oil.
...
Oil and natural-gas production is expected to fall 7% at Chevron, which will report Friday, as normal field declines and an absence of any large new projects take a toll. Production should get a boost later this year with the start-up of a large deepwater offshore West Africa project.
Still, Chevron is likely to report an 11% increase in earnings, says energy analyst Fadel Gheit at Oppenheimer, because of high commodity prices.
They can not deliver, yet they raise the price... Where is our Govt at to protect us from "BIG" business??? Does anyone remember Occidental OIL and Al Gore???? Of course not, selective amnesia... Oo.
The refining line of crap is a total JOKE! Look at the oil companies profits!!!!! If you beleive that bull crap,,, :{
Oil companies rake in record profits in spite of falling production
In spite of falling production, The Wall Street Journal predicts tomorrow that oil companies will report record earnings for 2005. Lower production and costly drilling operations have been more than offset by an enormous rise in crude prices, leaving the industry's top 70 producers with a 26% net increase in earnings this year.
The report by Bhushan Bahree (with contributions by Russel Gold and Jeffrey Ball,) also claims that 2006 will likely see a plunge in profits. Though the industry is currently sitting on huge cash reserves, experts are predicting dips in oil profits for 2006, based on rising costs and an anticipation of lower prices per barrel.
Excerpts follow:
High Energy Prices Drive Earnings, But Some See Turn in 2006
By Bhushan Bahree Staff Reporter, The Wall Street Journal July 26, 2005
...
In a report published last week, Merrill Lynch & Co. said the aggregate net income of the 70 largest companies in the sector is expected to rise 26% this year to $230 billion, on sales of $2. 57 trillion, up nearly 10%. The reasons: high oil prices and fat refining margins, plus a pickup in oil-field services, particularly in rates for drilling rigs. The 70 companies are expected to return about $110 billion to shareholders this year through dividends and share buybacks, Merrill Lynch added.
But next year, the sector's net income is forecast to decline to $205 billion due to an expected easing of oil prices and slimmer margins on gasoline and other refined petroleum products. Increased spending on new oil and gas projects, now being ramped up to offset depletion of existing fields, is starting to take a toll. Shell recently announced that its giant gas development in Sakhalin, Russia, could cost as much as $20 billion, twice the original estimate. Merrill Lynch says that the cost of finding and developing oil rose 22% in 2004.
...
Exxon is expected to report Thursday an approximately 40% increase in earnings over the year-earlier quarter, though its production is expected to stay basically flat, according to Deutsche Bank and Oppenheimer & Co.
...
At Shell, despite an expected 3% fall in production, higher oil prices are expected to boost exploration and production profits by 43% in the second quarter and lift companywide earnings once again when the company reports on Thursday, Deutsche Bank estimates. France's Total SA is expected to report an increase in net income of 30% to 40% or more on Aug. 4. "If anything, it should be toward the upper end of that," said Lucas Herrmann, a Deutsche Bank analyst in London, citing output growth at the company and strong refining margins. Total is Europe's largest refiner of crude oil.
...
Oil and natural-gas production is expected to fall 7% at Chevron, which will report Friday, as normal field declines and an absence of any large new projects take a toll. Production should get a boost later this year with the start-up of a large deepwater offshore West Africa project.
Still, Chevron is likely to report an 11% increase in earnings, says energy analyst Fadel Gheit at Oppenheimer, because of high commodity prices.
They can not deliver, yet they raise the price... Where is our Govt at to protect us from "BIG" business??? Does anyone remember Occidental OIL and Al Gore???? Of course not, selective amnesia... Oo.
Last edited:
Fuel prices
Exxon/Mobil has a little problem related to the fuel prices, as of early May, they had 25 billion cash on hand, and if oil stayed above $55 a barrel, they'd pull in another billion a month, cash, folks, after dividends, etc. Source here was Fortune magazine. Heck, why worry about refineries with business going like this ?
Exxon/Mobil has a little problem related to the fuel prices, as of early May, they had 25 billion cash on hand, and if oil stayed above $55 a barrel, they'd pull in another billion a month, cash, folks, after dividends, etc. Source here was Fortune magazine. Heck, why worry about refineries with business going like this ?
Relief on the way in Southern CA ( hopefully )
There has been a huge spike in CA diesel prices in the last 5 days as you've noticed -- even relative to gas prices. According to an article in last Thursday's Wall Street Journal, one cause is the temporary shutdown of portions of Chevron's El Segundo, CA refinery. The refinery is slated to resume production Aug. 13.
For now, I'm driving a work truck, and crossing my fingers that I see price relief towards the end of next week!
There has been a huge spike in CA diesel prices in the last 5 days as you've noticed -- even relative to gas prices. According to an article in last Thursday's Wall Street Journal, one cause is the temporary shutdown of portions of Chevron's El Segundo, CA refinery. The refinery is slated to resume production Aug. 13.
For now, I'm driving a work truck, and crossing my fingers that I see price relief towards the end of next week!
Refinery capacity?
The big oil companies keep refinery capacity at max to keep prices up and blame the EPA while trying to fool us , well some of us into thinking it is not actually the oil companies. I do agree that a lot of fuel cost is global demand but there is a lot of greed out there and we are the ones paying up.
I work in the electrical industry and any new powerplant I know of that needs to be built has gained EPAs aproval. The biggest problem getting refineries and powerplants built is the, "NOT IN MY BACK YARD", thinking. The public, especially in the power generation industry has a huge impact in getting higher generation and transmission capacity.
The big oil companies keep refinery capacity at max to keep prices up and blame the EPA while trying to fool us , well some of us into thinking it is not actually the oil companies. I do agree that a lot of fuel cost is global demand but there is a lot of greed out there and we are the ones paying up.
I work in the electrical industry and any new powerplant I know of that needs to be built has gained EPAs aproval. The biggest problem getting refineries and powerplants built is the, "NOT IN MY BACK YARD", thinking. The public, especially in the power generation industry has a huge impact in getting higher generation and transmission capacity.
Last edited:
Hopefully the El Segundo large crude unit will be up and on-test by Sat, Aug 13th. It has been real rough at work with all of the repairs. The fire was a medium sized one, no one was seriously hurt in the fire. 
One contractor was burned on her hand. :-( She almost jumped off the column until a unit operator showed her where to go to get off of the column. Most of the refinery has been limping along. Soon all will be back to normal and maybe the price will go down sooner rather than later.
I had to pay $3. 09/gal yesterday. Today, I saw it as high as $3. 24. Luckily I still get better mileage in my CTD than my 10 year old Dakota.
One contractor was burned on her hand. :-( She almost jumped off the column until a unit operator showed her where to go to get off of the column. Most of the refinery has been limping along. Soon all will be back to normal and maybe the price will go down sooner rather than later. I had to pay $3. 09/gal yesterday. Today, I saw it as high as $3. 24. Luckily I still get better mileage in my CTD than my 10 year old Dakota.
"The politicians do not regulate big oil? Do you know the profit margins of
big OIL? Chevron, and Unocal etc. They are making money hand over fist, yet
the consumer is getting screwed. "
Profits are indeed growing at a breakneck pace in the energy sector, because
the price of the raw material that these companies find and extract is
rising. The profits of mining companies have also been growing at a
breakneck pace, because the price of copper and just about every other metal
has soared the past several years. Is that Bush's fault too? Of course not.
It is simply the case that demand for most industrial commodities, from
natural gas to steel, has been increasing rapidly; though the American media
remain fairly gloomy about the economy, the fact is that GDP growth in the
U. S. during the past three years has exceeded that seen throughout most of
the 1990s (you know, when the economy was "good"), China and other emerging
markets are coming on strong now that the hangover from the Asian currency
crisis of the late '90s is finally over, and even Japan (the world's second
largest economy, though we sometimes forget that) appears to be emerging
from a dozen years of economic stagnation. In short, demand is up
everywhere, and anyone who wants to give Bush *credit* for this is, in my
mind, giving the guy much more *credit* than he deserves.
Supply is also a lot tighter than it should be, but this isn't the result of
some big conspiracy between energy companies and the Bushies. Oil prices
fell throughout the 1990s, and - understandably - energy companies who got
burned by expanding too rapidly in the '80s only to see the price of their
product fall for the next ten years decided to cut back on exploration
budgets and new projects - which goes to the point of the WSJ article cited
by Heavyweight; the old projects are producing less and less, and there
weren't enough new projects initiated in the 1990s to make up for it. (Who
could have predicted how fast the economy would be growing today following
the bear market of 2000-02, a global recession in 2001, and, of course, the
gloom and doom predictions of economists after 9/11? If Heavyweight did,
then he should be running one of these oil companies! But I suspect that
back then he was as worried about the economy as everyone else and probably
would not have recommended to Exxon that they drastically expand their
production budgets - "Yeah, let's increase jet fuel production capacity
after 9/11... that makes sense. " Not. )
So we have the double whammy of surging global demand and the risk premium
of heightened tensions in the Mid East, yet energy producers simply don't
have the capacity that they would like to have. Are you telling me that
Exxon wouldn't love to produce more oil right now to cash in on high prices,
even if the prices are pushed a bit lower by the increased supply? Would you
rather sell two fish for $6 or five fish for $5? Trust me, they want to
bring more oil to market. Badly. In fact, though I'm sure they are
enjoying the short-term gains, oil prices at these levels make them very
nervous; what keeps the CEOs of these companies up at night is the
possibility that oil prices will reach a "tipping" point for the global
economy, causing a recession, which will suppress demand lead to a crash in
the oil market when hedge funds and other speculators fall over themselves
to close out massive leveraged long positions.
What is worse right now, gas prices or home prices? I know I can still
afford to fill up my 4. 3L V8, but I sure as hell can't afford a house in the
Bay Area! Is that Bush's fault? Is he in the "pocket" of "Big Housing"? What
a load of crap. When housing prices out here fell in the 1980s (and again
in the mid-'90s), homebuilders found themselves stuck with all kinds of
unsold inventory and half-finished projects, and after taking a financial
beating, they swore that they would never again embrace speculative
development. That memory is still fresh in minds of many homebuilding
executives, who seem reluctant to build too much today for fear of something
similar happening (sounds like what oil CEOs are worried about... . ). So
should we blame homebuilders for high housing costs? Should we blame Bush
and Cheney? Silly. With a handful of high-profile exceptions, the vast
majority of the 20,000 or so publicly traded companies tend to behave
rationally, and when prices are falling over several years, they don't
aggravate the problem by increasing capacity. Their job isn't to subsidize
YOU. Their job is to make sure that they run their organizations for the
maximum benefit of the owners, the shareholders. If you don't like that
concept and think the politicians should do more about it, then move to
France or Germany and see how easy it is to fill up your Diesel truck at
prices that are two or three times higher than they are here due to
government bureaucracies *actually* lining their own pockets with massive
fuel taxes. Oh, and you'll probably be unemployed in Germany or France,
given the double-digit unemployment rates in those countries (compared to
only 5. 0% here), which I imagine will make filling up your truck that much
more difficult. But be my guest. I'm sure things are much better in
countries that Bush doesn't run, where oil companies like BP and Total
aren't in Bush's back pocket. If enough people leave, maybe I'll be able to
afford a house. : )
From my good friend Ian, since I'm being so "outgunned"
big OIL? Chevron, and Unocal etc. They are making money hand over fist, yet
the consumer is getting screwed. "
Profits are indeed growing at a breakneck pace in the energy sector, because
the price of the raw material that these companies find and extract is
rising. The profits of mining companies have also been growing at a
breakneck pace, because the price of copper and just about every other metal
has soared the past several years. Is that Bush's fault too? Of course not.
It is simply the case that demand for most industrial commodities, from
natural gas to steel, has been increasing rapidly; though the American media
remain fairly gloomy about the economy, the fact is that GDP growth in the
U. S. during the past three years has exceeded that seen throughout most of
the 1990s (you know, when the economy was "good"), China and other emerging
markets are coming on strong now that the hangover from the Asian currency
crisis of the late '90s is finally over, and even Japan (the world's second
largest economy, though we sometimes forget that) appears to be emerging
from a dozen years of economic stagnation. In short, demand is up
everywhere, and anyone who wants to give Bush *credit* for this is, in my
mind, giving the guy much more *credit* than he deserves.
Supply is also a lot tighter than it should be, but this isn't the result of
some big conspiracy between energy companies and the Bushies. Oil prices
fell throughout the 1990s, and - understandably - energy companies who got
burned by expanding too rapidly in the '80s only to see the price of their
product fall for the next ten years decided to cut back on exploration
budgets and new projects - which goes to the point of the WSJ article cited
by Heavyweight; the old projects are producing less and less, and there
weren't enough new projects initiated in the 1990s to make up for it. (Who
could have predicted how fast the economy would be growing today following
the bear market of 2000-02, a global recession in 2001, and, of course, the
gloom and doom predictions of economists after 9/11? If Heavyweight did,
then he should be running one of these oil companies! But I suspect that
back then he was as worried about the economy as everyone else and probably
would not have recommended to Exxon that they drastically expand their
production budgets - "Yeah, let's increase jet fuel production capacity
after 9/11... that makes sense. " Not. )
So we have the double whammy of surging global demand and the risk premium
of heightened tensions in the Mid East, yet energy producers simply don't
have the capacity that they would like to have. Are you telling me that
Exxon wouldn't love to produce more oil right now to cash in on high prices,
even if the prices are pushed a bit lower by the increased supply? Would you
rather sell two fish for $6 or five fish for $5? Trust me, they want to
bring more oil to market. Badly. In fact, though I'm sure they are
enjoying the short-term gains, oil prices at these levels make them very
nervous; what keeps the CEOs of these companies up at night is the
possibility that oil prices will reach a "tipping" point for the global
economy, causing a recession, which will suppress demand lead to a crash in
the oil market when hedge funds and other speculators fall over themselves
to close out massive leveraged long positions.
What is worse right now, gas prices or home prices? I know I can still
afford to fill up my 4. 3L V8, but I sure as hell can't afford a house in the
Bay Area! Is that Bush's fault? Is he in the "pocket" of "Big Housing"? What
a load of crap. When housing prices out here fell in the 1980s (and again
in the mid-'90s), homebuilders found themselves stuck with all kinds of
unsold inventory and half-finished projects, and after taking a financial
beating, they swore that they would never again embrace speculative
development. That memory is still fresh in minds of many homebuilding
executives, who seem reluctant to build too much today for fear of something
similar happening (sounds like what oil CEOs are worried about... . ). So
should we blame homebuilders for high housing costs? Should we blame Bush
and Cheney? Silly. With a handful of high-profile exceptions, the vast
majority of the 20,000 or so publicly traded companies tend to behave
rationally, and when prices are falling over several years, they don't
aggravate the problem by increasing capacity. Their job isn't to subsidize
YOU. Their job is to make sure that they run their organizations for the
maximum benefit of the owners, the shareholders. If you don't like that
concept and think the politicians should do more about it, then move to
France or Germany and see how easy it is to fill up your Diesel truck at
prices that are two or three times higher than they are here due to
government bureaucracies *actually* lining their own pockets with massive
fuel taxes. Oh, and you'll probably be unemployed in Germany or France,
given the double-digit unemployment rates in those countries (compared to
only 5. 0% here), which I imagine will make filling up your truck that much
more difficult. But be my guest. I'm sure things are much better in
countries that Bush doesn't run, where oil companies like BP and Total
aren't in Bush's back pocket. If enough people leave, maybe I'll be able to
afford a house. : )
From my good friend Ian, since I'm being so "outgunned"
I see where congress and the prez just gave the oil companies 6 billion dollars in the new transportion bill. I am glad to know they won't starve.
I just heard on the news that unleaded prices may go to 4. 00 in California this week. Locally we have set records daily for high prices. I now think that I might be able to make a buck storing fuel.
I just heard on the news that unleaded prices may go to 4. 00 in California this week. Locally we have set records daily for high prices. I now think that I might be able to make a buck storing fuel.
They never slant anything, are you that stupid Cleary? Follow the money, and learn something, the only thing not "Taking a hit" is the oil companies "BOTTOM LINE"!
Are you Exxon's poster boy or something? Kick backs?
Since you are a fellow cali-fornian, do you remember Red Davis and his excellent energy bill? There was never a shortage, there was plenty of outside interference and price gouging, yet you where probably on this board posting about what a terrific job that looser did.
Are you Exxon's poster boy or something? Kick backs?
Since you are a fellow cali-fornian, do you remember Red Davis and his excellent energy bill? There was never a shortage, there was plenty of outside interference and price gouging, yet you where probably on this board posting about what a terrific job that looser did.
Last edited:
Yep, Big Oil is a convenient whipping boy, regardless of the facts.Heavyweight said:
Crude oil and key refined products are commodities just like corn, pork bellies, soybeans and gold. These energy products are traded, among other places, on the New York Merchantile Exchange (NYMEX) where the market establishes prices based on supply and demand. The latest NYMEX prices can be found HERE - #2 diesel is shown as home heating oil - without road taxes.
If Big Oil set the prices, don't you think they would have raised crude oil, refined product and natural gas prices back in the 1990s when crude oil was $10/bbl, natural gas was $0. 70/mmbtu, oil-related businesses were closing left and right and talented individuals who are sorely needed today left the oil business for good.
Rusty
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Issue 128 – Digital Version
Digital Magazines
FREE!
TDR Test Drive - Digital Edition
Renew
Subscribe
Gift Subscriptions
Back Issues
Subscription Status
Address Change Form
Buyer's Guides
Ram Diagnostic Trouble Codes
The Perfect Collection
The Perfect Collection Vol. II
TSB Updates
Dodge/Cummins Historical Overview
Cameron Collection
What Makes Us Tick?
Product Showcase
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