48RE + Exhaust Brake: Current Status

[p-Bar]

Hey guys any bets if the auto transmission passes Carlton's test drive.

 

[LightmanE300]

Any bets if Carlton, Cummins, or DC does a damn thing about us 48RE owners who've been without an EB since late 03... I'm not holding out much hope.

 

[Carlton Bale]

The good news is that the software passed the checkout with fyling colors. We're starting an intensive, very high duty cycle test next week to validate durability. This has been a difficult program to push through but we are making progress.

 

[JCotte]

Carlton

Did they decide a build date for the 04. 5 traanys yet as far as when the hardware is installed to be in compliance so that we may only need to do a software upgrade? Oo.

 

[jcarey]

Carlton, THANK YOU!

 

[Carlton Bale]

By the way, sorry for being out the thread for so long, but I haven't been receiving e-mail notifications until today for some reason.



I'm posting nothing excpet factual information here. I'm not trying to mislead anyone as a previous post suggested. The thrust washer change in mid-MY04. 5 was the last remaining hardware change identified by the DaimlerChrysler transmission group. There are some changes to the external control devices of the MY05 transmission, but that has nothing to do with the exhaust brake. The internals of the transmission aren't any different, at least as far as the brake is concerned.



I wish there was something more I could do, but Cummins has no influence whatsoever in the warranty offerings or approvals for transmissions. Our helping with the validation of the software and hardware is, unfortunately, the extent of our capabilities.

 

[Carlton Bale]

Carlton

Did they decide a build date for the 04. 5 traanys yet as far as when the hardware is installed to be in compliance so that we may only need to do a software upgrade? Oo.

Unfortunately, I still haven't received a truck build date for the transmission hardware change. I have a date for the transmission plant, but that doesn't help owners much.

 

[FDrake]

And what about the 305/555 engine-48RE combo? I would like to get an EB too.

Frank

 

[RankRam]

And what about the 305/555 engine-48RE combo? I would like to get an EB too.

Frank

Frank don't hold your breath.



I'm about to dump my perfectly good running 03 for a possible fuel guzzling 04. 5 just to get a six speed and E-Brake. :{

 

[FDrake]

Well, I guess I don't understand why DC went backward. I had a 1997 diesel with the auto transmission. I put a PacBrake EB on it and it worked fine. To use it on downgrades, I first set the cruise control so it was about 5MPH below the posted speed. When I hit the downgrade, I just engaged the EB. The speed control kept the auto transmission locked up and it never overheated and it held the speed I set very well.

So is there some strange thing working here that wouldn't allow me to do the same thing with the 48RE? Why can't I lock it up using the cruise control and then engage an EB to hold it to the speed on a downgrade?

My '03 6 speed had a cruise control that allowed me to set it before I hit a grade but the Banks EB was installed so they EB would disengage the cruise control to allow the truck to slow down and stop with stopping the engine. I think I prefer the auto transmission with the EB since it would stay in cruise even with the EB engaged.

It shouldn't take a wizard to figure it out. They had it right in the older trannies.

Frank

 

[Carlton Bale]

Well, I guess I don't understand why DC went backward. I had a 1997 diesel with the auto transmission. I put a PacBrake EB on it and it worked fine. To use it on downgrades, I first set the cruise control so it was about 5MPH below the posted speed. When I hit the downgrade, I just engaged the EB. The speed control kept the auto transmission locked up and it never overheated and it held the speed I set very well.

So is there some strange thing working here that wouldn't allow me to do the same thing with the 48RE? Why can't I lock it up using the cruise control and then engage an EB to hold it to the speed on a downgrade?

My '03 6 speed had a cruise control that allowed me to set it before I hit a grade but the Banks EB was installed so they EB would disengage the cruise control to allow the truck to slow down and stop with stopping the engine. I think I prefer the auto transmission with the EB since it would stay in cruise even with the EB engaged.

It shouldn't take a wizard to figure it out. They had it right in the older trannies.

Frank

You can choose to install an exhaust brake on your current vehicle. However, it would be at your own risk as the exhaust brake is not currently approved by DaimlerChrysler warranty. Warranty approval and validated durability are the issues being addressed by the ongoing exhaust brake / 48RE work.

 

[LightmanE300]

Lets say we don't care about warranty hypothetically. Is there a technical reason we can't run an EB on the 48RE? Is there an inherent weakness or something preventing us from putting one on? It sounds like we 48RE 305/555 owners are probably getting the shaft from DC on the EB situation, so I'd like to know what exactly is neccesary to reliably use an EB with the 48RE?

 

[RMcCulloch]

If, as I have, you'd followed this thread from the beginning, you'd already have the answer to your question.



The "weak link" that's been identified is a $6 thrust washer whose design was changed for the '04. 5 version of the 48RE.



There are a few people that are running a Jacobs Exhaust Brake on '03. 5 305/555 trucks with a 48RE and, so far, I haven't seen anyone report any failures. That doesn't mean that there haven't been any nor does it mean that there won't be any - it just means that I haven't seen any reports of any.



FWIW, the Service Manager of the dealership [Don Elliot in Wharton, TX] where I bought my truck asked me on Monday if I knew of anyone who wanted one since they have an extra in stock.



BTW, I'm glad I have mine! Oo.

 

[FDrake]

I question whether or not the same weak link on the 2003 48RE exists on the 2004 48RE. If so, why? If they were aware of the problem, why wan't it rectified? If push comes to shove, who is going to have to foot the bill to replace the "Weak link"?

Frank

 

[thejeepdude]

If push comes to shove, who is going to have to foot the bill to replace the "Weak link"?

Frank

YOU, if you install an EB (just get it upgraded and you won't have to worry about it). THEM if it's stock and under 70K miles. We all agree that they should step up and retrofit anyone's 48RE that requests, but, well, that just ain't gonna happen!

 

[FDrake]

Sure, under 70K miles, but it HAS to fail first. If it is defective, we shouldn't have to wait for it to fail. I shouldn't be expected to pay for an outside transmission upgrade either. It should be THEIR responisibility to replace any defective part. What happens if it fails while I am towing down a grade and it goes out. I don't have an EB. Do I get to call them from a hospital if I have an accident due to the failure? That sucks!!

Frank

 

[RMcCulloch]

If you don't have an EB then you don't have any Warranty Issue so long as it fails within the Warranty Period.



If you have an unauthorized EB installed and your "slush box" fails because of the use of the unauthorized EB then you're on your own.

 

[RFogarty]

The "weak link" that's been identified is a $6 thrust washer whose design was changed for the '04. 5 version of the 48RE.

Do you have any idea what it would take to retrofit an '03 48RE with the newer thrust washer, if that is possible?



I only have 14,000 miles on my 03 and I am trying to determine what my options are from an expense standpoint as I would like to add an EB in the near future. I am willing to go to the after market trans rebuilders to do an upgrade, but I would like to get a little return on my investment in this truck before I spend the kind of cash it will take to do the modifications to correct the washer problem.



The trans has had a minor rebuild as I just got the truck back after a recall in which they replaced the block mounted trans cooler, trans cooling lines, the PCM harness, and all the clutch bands after discovering that there was coolant in the trans fluid from the cracked cooler. The cooling system got a complete flushing and new coolant as well.



They claim they didn't flash the eprom, but I noticed a definite difference in the shift behavior after I got the truck back, and I'm very happy with the performance when towing the trailer.



There is a very definite reduction in the tendancy to hunt between OD and 3rd gear when climbing a long grade when I leave the selector in the OD position. The trans also has a very positive shift to it, almost to the point of being a little harsh.



Rowland

 

[RMcCulloch]

To do a "retrofit" they'd have to do the same thing as to "repair" it after a failure. [Estimates here have been around $1400. ]



Are you sure that your trans. cooler problem was a "recall"? It sounds more like a failure that was handled under Warranty to me. [If it'd been a "recall" then (1) why no TSB and (2) why no notice to all '03 48RE owners?]



They probably didn't reflash anything but, probably, did have the batteries disconnected for a while to clear out codes. When you "retrained" it by towing soon after getting it back, it handled better.

 

[RFogarty]

Are you sure that your trans. cooler problem was a "recall"? It sounds more like a failure that was handled under Warranty to me. [If it'd been a "recall" then (1) why no TSB and (2) why no notice to all '03 48RE owners?]

I received two postcards with the recall notices. One was: W 10DOZ13 Driveability Recall C42 PCM Connectors, and the second one was: W 11DOZ03 Driveability Recall C44 Trans Cooler Lines.



The postcard with the cooler line recall went into some detail about when the trans is under a full load, a pulsation can occur in the cooler lines that might cause the block mounted trans cooler to crack which would allow a coolant/trans fluid migration causing problems with the trans and cooling system.



When the dealer started to do the work, they said the discovery of the cracked, block mounted, trans cooler and the comingling of the coolant and the trans fluid triggered the R/R of the trans to replace all the seals, gaskets, clutches and flush the cooling system. They said that the ethelyne glycol will attack and loosen the bonding agent that holds the clutch material to the bands and they didn't want to risk having to R/R the trans a second time by not replacing everything.



If I were the owner of an '03, and I have not been contacted, I would look into this issue.



I only wish I had known about the issue with the thrust washer before this recall service or I would definitely have had some sort of an agreement with them to fix that problem.



I was told by the DC salesman when I bought the truck that the Jake brake was the only EB that DC recommended for use on this truck as it was a joint effort between Jacobs, Cummins, and DC to design the brake specifically for these trucks.



If as many have said so far that they have the Jacobs brake, or some other EB, on their 03's and have not had any problems, and DC has been well aware for sometime that there is a fix for the 48re, I'm inclined to believe that DC should warrant the trans if a Jacobs Brake is installed and live with the repairs that must be made if and when those 48re's with EB's fail.



This is my 4th Dodge Cummins, and I switched from a stick all these years to an auto soley on the word of the salesman that I could eventually install an EB without affecting my trans warranty.



I realize that these salesmen cannot be up to speed on every little nuiance of these trucks. However, on major issues like EB installation and trans warranty nullification, I think it is not unreasonable to ask DC for some accountability when a purchase is based on declarations made by the sales staff at the time of the sale.