48RE + Exhaust Brake: Current Status

[abdiver]

Wouldn't it be GREAT if DC would have someone monitor this site and PROVIDE answers to legitimate questions, I have been waiting for DC to respond to messages I left on the phone and email at this point I doubt I will get a reply. Will I still buy a $40,000 truck from a company that appears will not answer a question to a customer? I might unless I find a company with a bit better service. I too thank Carlton for his efforts to keep us up to speed.

 

[JCotte]

What?? What would a mileage relash and the info Carlton is providing about the 48RE and an exhaust brake have anything to do with each other?

You really are confused TSCHWAB. they have nothing to do with each other. I wanted to see if he has an opinion on our problem there Oo.

 

[tschwab]

You really are confused TSCHWAB. they have nothing to do with each other. I wanted to see if he has an opinion on our problem there Oo.

JCOTTE - Not confused at all - my point exactly, they have absolutely nothing to do with each other... . so WHY are you asking it here? As you already have an active thread going about your mileage lose. I also posed a question on the '05 48RE on this thread and the lack of OD lockout and was chastised a bit for not keeping to the subject at hand. Carlton is a great resource to us all, I just don't want to see this thread go off into the weeds, like so many others do.

 

[JCotte]

JCOTTE - Not confused at all - my point exactly, they have absolutely nothing to do with each other... . so WHY are you asking it here? As you already have an active thread going about your mileage lose. I also posed a question on the '05 48RE on this thread and the lack of OD lockout and was chastised a bit for not keeping to the subject at hand. Carlton is a great resource to us all, I just don't want to see this thread go off into the weeds, like so many others do.

TSCHWAB

If you read it you would notice I was thanking him for the info on the transmission teardown and asking him to look at my thread. I was not asking to bring my issue into this one. I have been a member here for a long time and do know how the system works.

 

[DAldous]

5-Speed auto from DM?

I haven't followed this thread religiously but I have a couple of questions!



(1) Is the 48RE is a four-speed auto?

(2) Even if it is a five-speed auto, why is DM and Cummins working so hard (and so long) to make it work with an exhaust brake?



As we know, Chevy and Ford both offer five speed autos with tow-haul mode, eliminating the need for an exhaust brake. How can Dodge stay competitive by working two years on an idea that is several years outdated by the time it is developed?



The truth is, they can't! I visited a local mid-sized Dodge dealer last week (Sacramento) who had more than thirty Dodge Ram CTD's of every shape, color and size on the lot. They had so many, they had a 2500 that was loaded for $32K, about $8-9K off sticker price (in March)!! Two blocks down the street a large Chevy dealer had one 2500 Duramax. It had no discounts!!I checked with several other dealers and the story repeated. So, who is selling trucks?



Dodge is very competitive. Is all the work discussed in this thread a smoke screen for a new transmission design from DM-Cummins? I hope so. If it is not and Dodge has nothing better to offer than a four speed and an exhaust brake addition. I might have to settle for a Duramax!

 

[TFucili]

Tow/haul and e-brake are not mutually exclusive IMHO.

 

[JCotte]

enjoy your duramax... you will be back

 

[Texasrattler]

Go look at the trucks that are doing the real hauling and most are Dodges. Talk to the hauling companies about the Ford and GM problems they have had. Also, ask the haulers how many miles on their Dodges. Also, asked the drivers using Fords and GMs and ask them what they are getting for milage hauling, they are very upset.



Pete

 

[klenger]

I don't see how a tow-haul mode on a transmission (like the Allison) can make up for not having an exhause brake. Without the exhaust restriction of an exhaust brake, downshifting and locking up and automatic transmission won't slow down a truck any more than a manual transmission would w/o an exhaust brake. I'm not saying the Allison tow-haul mode is not usefull, I just don't see how it can be as effective as an exhaust brake.

 

[Carlton Bale]

Is the 48RE is a four-speed auto?

Yes.

As we know, Chevy and Ford both offer five speed autos with tow-haul mode, eliminating the need for an exhaust brake.

MY05 Dodge trucks have a tow/haul mode. Tow/haul does not eliminate the need for an exhaust brake. Because the diesel engines in other trucks use hydraulic lash adjusters, exhaust brakes are not recommended or approved by the manufacturer. An exhaust brake offers much more retarding than does the different shift schedule provided by a tow/haul mode.

So, who is selling trucks?

I can't answer your question, but this has been the biggest year ever for Cummins engines in Dodge trucks. Suggest you look at Polk data.

Is all the work discussed in this thread a smoke screen for a new transmission design from DM-Cummins?

This thread is an open, informative post regarding work being performed to make the brake and 48RE transmission compatible. Instead of saying "it's not approved" and offering no information, I'm attempting to keep people as informed as possible. Most manufacturers don't do that.

 

[amsoilman]

I haven't followed this thread religiously but I have a couple of questions!



(1) Is the 48RE is a four-speed auto?

(2) Even if it is a five-speed auto, why is DM and Cummins working so hard (and so long) to make it work with an exhaust brake?



As we know, Chevy and Ford both offer five speed autos with tow-haul mode, eliminating the need for an exhaust brake. How can Dodge stay competitive by working two years on an idea that is several years outdated by the time it is developed?



The truth is, they can't! I visited a local mid-sized Dodge dealer last week (Sacramento) who had more than thirty Dodge Ram CTD's of every shape, color and size on the lot. They had so many, they had a 2500 that was loaded for $32K, about $8-9K off sticker price (in March)!! Two blocks down the street a large Chevy dealer had one 2500 Duramax. It had no discounts!!I checked with several other dealers and the story repeated. So, who is selling trucks?



Dodge is very competitive. Is all the work discussed in this thread a smoke screen for a new transmission design from DM-Cummins? I hope so. If it is not and Dodge has nothing better to offer than a four speed and an exhaust brake addition. I might have to settle for a Duramax!

Question (1) Taken from the Repair Manual:



AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION -48RE

DESCRIPTION

The 48RE is a four speed fully automatic transmission with an electronic governor. The 48RE is equipped with a lock-up clutch in the torque con-verter. First through third gear ranges are provided by the clutches, bands, overrunning clutch, and plan-etary gear sets in the transmission. Fourth gear range is provided by the overdrive unit that contains an overdrive clutch, direct clutch, planetary gear set, and overrunning clutch.

The transmission contains a front, rear, and direct clutch which function as the input driving components. It also contains the kickdown (front) and the

low/reverse (rear) bands which, along with the over-running clutch and overdrive clutch, serve as the holding components. The driving and holding components combine to select the necessary planetary gear components, in the front, rear, or overdrive planetary gear set, transfer the engine power from the input shaft through to the output shaft. The valve body is mounted to the lower side of the transmission and contains the valves to control pres-sure regulation, fluid flow control, and clutch/band application. The oil pump is mounted at the front of the transmission and is driven by the torque con-verter hub. The pump supplies the oil pressure necessary for clutch/band actuation and transmission lubrication. It also has a "tow/haul" mode.



QUESTION (2) The Exhaust brake is a device that works independently from the transmission, but requires the tranmsission to be able to hold up to the added pressures and torque the Exhaust brake applies to the transmission, and also requires the torque converter to stay locked during the exhaust brake application.



I would much rather have an exhaust brake... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... . even on a Duramax or Ford, than just having a "tow/haul mode"



I've had an Exhaust brake on the last two CTD trucks I have owned, and wouldn't want to tow without the exhaust brake.



my . 02 worth,



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[tschwab]

A lot of people seem to think the I-6 CTD "needs" a 5 or 6 spd auto. But from what I have experienced with mine and what I have read, is that with the low revving I-6 you don't need 5 or 6 spds. The CTD works just fine with the current 48RE 4spd. From what I understand, the chev & ford auto's are limited (torque wise) in 1st and 5th and/or 6th. I'm sure someone will chime in on this. It seems alot of folks want to bash the 48RE because it does not have 5 or 6 spds - which is ridiculous and unfounded criticism. That is like saying the CTD does not measure upto the Dmax or PSD because it only has 6 cylinders.

 

[JBlock]

Two year, is a long time for the brake after production. I would figure there was another 1-2 years R&D before the RE48 was released. It look like it more smoke and mirrors and is NOT going to happen any time soon. Maybe 2006 model but I i wouldn't hold by breathe either.



Sorry, for being so negative , but there are successful after market exhuast brakes out there right now, so the factory approach appears to base on using the cheapest factory setup that can handle an Exhaust Brake. perhaps a faster approach would be to other a heavy duty RE48 call is am RE48H with an Exhaust Brake only as aoption applicable to it and only it. Oo. .

 

[ACerf]

Brake Exhaust + 48RE

I have towed my 11,500 lb. Holiday Rambler now about 7,000 miles. Up and down some very steep hills. Sure an EBrake would be handy, but I have not felt it overly necessary. I have too also agree with some of the other TDR members that a 5 speed would be nice, but again not necessary. I read somewhere that if you take all of the parts that make up the I-6 Cummins and the 48RE trans. It would have 300+ LESS parts than either the Ford or Chevy with their Diesels and Trannys! That in itself makes me feel alot better about having Dodge! There are alot of things that make the Dodge a much better choice than the Ford or GM, but not having an Ebrake is not worth the worry. It is a fact that Ford or GM don't really want folks to install an Ebrake on their products either. If you read the wording for the installation it leaves you wondering if they will stand behind their warranty. If the manufacture doesn't install this product themselves you can bet that if there is a problem they will complain about it. It is like with the chips. They don't like them on there vehicles, but alot of us use them. But you can bet that when I take my truck in for service I remove the Edge EZ!

 

[Raybocop]

Hello all:

New member, 1st post. Hope Im doing it right Just ordered a 05 2500 CTD on Monday, never owned a diesel before. Will get it in 6-8 wks according to dealer. Have been following this thread for a while. Specifically asked for the CTD maintenance cheif at the dealer, and asked about the engine brake. He said the 48RE has been approved for a dealer option engine brake, and that he has put on 4 or 5 already. In following this thread, I thought it was not approved yet.

 

[Carlton Bale]

In following this thread, I thought it was not approved yet.

That is correct; it is not yet approved. The front page of the brake manual clearly states "for manual transmissions only".

 

[Raybocop]

Thanks Carlton, guess I have an H. U. A. dealer service department. Am hoping it is available soon.

 

[DAldous]

I appreciate all the discussion post #405 generated. I learned a lot. I didn't know the Dodge 05 models have a Tow/Haul mode and I didn't know Tow/Haul is less effective than an exhaust brake for downhill grades.



I have the ATS TripleLoc with a Pacbrake now and I love it. I probably won't upgrade until Dodge perfects the 48RE because I really want to keep the exhaust brake function. I believe that an extra split (between 2nd and 3rd gear) would help my 2000 CTD on hills but then I only have about 265 HP and 515 fp of torque. With the HP an Torque ratings of the newer RAMs, I probably wouldn't need the extra gear. Thanks again!!



P. S. I still wonder if DM/Cummins has a five-speed just over the horizon!!

 

[juicedcummins]

A lot of people seem to think the I-6 CTD "needs" a 5 or 6 spd auto. But from what I have experienced with mine and what I have read, is that with the low revving I-6 you don't need 5 or 6 spds. The CTD works just fine with the current 48RE 4spd. From what I understand, the chev & ford auto's are limited (torque wise) in 1st and 5th and/or 6th. I'm sure someone will chime in on this. It seems alot of folks want to bash the 48RE because it does not have 5 or 6 spds - which is ridiculous and unfounded criticism. That is like saying the CTD does not measure upto the Dmax or PSD because it only has 6 cylinders.

Wise words from somebody that also understands an inline 6cyl.

 

[Kvic]

Will the Jacobs brake work with the 48re? Dealer says warranty not an issue for me.