Amsoil. Is ther a Problem? Is there an Answer?

[Iguide]

This thread is to inform other member of an issue that has arisen with changing my truck over completely to Amsoil. Also to ask if there are any members that may have an effective and detailed solution to this problem. To me the above answer to the above question is YES there is a PROBLEM.



In my first Dodge truck I eventually changed all of my fluids over to Amsoil. The performance was impressive enough that when I purchased my 03 2500 diesel I changed all of the fluids over @ 3000mi. over to Amsoil. In addition I wanted to install a bypass filter to extend the drain intervals. So I called Amsoil tech dept asked what bypass system would fit my 03. I was told a BMK-15 would fit my 03 as it is the one that has the Cummins adapter. When I got the system I took it to a mechanic that had done a lot of work for me in the past. After assessing the situation the only place that there was to mount it was to make a bracket & bolt it to the preexisting, pretapped holes on the top passenger side of the engine block. Some where along the line after we got this started I read something on TDR web page that prompted me to call my dealer & check about voiding any warranties. After some time he got back to me & said that it was thought by higher powers in Chrysler that it would indeed void the engine warranty if this was done. So it was a call back to Amsoil. Which by the way I told them that I was none to happy that I had to be calling back to because I was told this would fit my truck. Infact what I was sold & sent would in no way fit & work on an 03 due to the reduced engine compartment space, which Amsoil acknowledged even though they had previously told me directly by that it would. This time I was told oh yea there was really no room in the engine compartment, so some guys were mounting them on the cross member at the rear of the transmission. I'd have to measure & then order extra parts, lines ect. Well After examining it I didn't think that was the answer & after getting my mechanic took a look at it, it was final. There was no way for us to mount the filters at that location & protect the lines in the kit from being potentially ripped of in the future with the work I do. So Another call to Amsoil. This time I'm not a happy camper & I let them know that in no uncertain terms. After a unproductive conversation in which I related all of the above information, including being a guide and often am not driving on Rds. that are of interstate quality, it was related to me that most of the guys that mount these down below just drive them over the rd. . Not going off rd. . At all, & there for could leave the lines exposed in the manner they would have to be left to swing free because on one side was the exhaust and on the other was the transmission. Neither one could have the lines in the kit attached to them. It was suggested that I go to an all metal line & pass over the muffler. Maybe this would solve the dilemma. When pressed further for solution it was admitted that Amsoil really didn't have one. They just sell the kit to the appropriate motor. I was told that I could return the kit for a credit, no refund was mentioned, only a credit. However I am out money for shipping & the mechanic & then to reship if that is the way I want to go.



I told the tech person that I was really upset over the way this is being handled & I stated that I was going to post this on the TDR web site. He said go ahead, maybe another member would have a solution as he, “they” didn’t.



Well to me that is a hell of a way to do business. That would be like me being hired to guide some one on a moose hunt & telling them I'll take you to where the moose are but you have to find them on your own & you have got to figure out on your own how to harvest them ect. with no impute from me. Just give me the money & you figure out the rest. I don't do business that way. I believe in doing the best job I know how, & it is my business to know how to give my best service and make sure that it is second to no one. Amsoil should hire me . I could teach them a lot about how to do business.



At this time I'm not decided what I'm going to do. I can say this. Unless someone from Amsoil steps forward with more of a helping hand than what I've gotten so far I seriously have doubts about using their products again. What damn good is a “ great” product if you get incompetent service. If I get this type of treatment now I can only imagine what it would be like if I have a warranty issue with them.



So in ending if there is some one who can offer me a detailed solution to this problem I would greatly appreciate it, & I would be in your debt. I'm sure not going to get any answers from Amsoil

 

[BHolm]

I think you are laying WAY to much of this on Amsoil. You must accept that you are trying to make aftermarket modifications to your truck. Not only that but, I don't get the impression from your post, or Amsoils info on the web, that they promised you a "bolt on kit". I think that lays the expense of fitting it to your application squarely in you lap. You have appraoched Amsoil with your issues. They have offered to accept the system for credit. You are otherwise pleased with thier products, take the credit, use it later, whats the big stink?



Now, IF they had represented this as a bolt on kit for the '03 Ram, and it wasn't, then you would have every right to be PO'ed and submit mechanics expenses and shipping expenses. That isn't what happened the way you tell it. Yes, they should get some knowledgable help. Unfortunately, good help is nearly impossible to find anymore.



If you still must run the dual bypass system, get some braided metal lines and AN fittings and figure out a place to mount it. If you are convinced that it will not work in your application, take the credit.

 

[MCummings]

Originally posted by W. A. Derby

... what I was sold & sent would in no way fit & work on an 03...



... . When pressed further for solution it was admitted that Amsoil really didn't have one... .



***They just sell the kit to the appropriate motor. ***



... . Well to me that is a hell of a way to do business... .



... What damn good is a “ great” product if you get incompetent service... .

This is the biggest turn off I have with Amsoil, and why I have used nothing more than their oil, and ONE oil Filter from them. believe it or not, I used a Fram Filter the next time I had the choice between an Amsoil, and Fram.



As an Option,, Maybe you could find space tucked up in that Huge front bumper? OR, If you don't live where it's too cold, you could probably get away with running only one battery, and installing the Dual Bypass in the Battery location.



That's my guess,



Here's my best advice...

Look up this guy.



amsoilman



He has an '03 with the Bypass system.



Hope you get this all worked out!



Merrick Cummings Jr

 

[DOWG]

The best thing about the TDR website is that it contains a lifetime of advice on the care and feeding of the Cummins Turbo Diesel. It also contains a lifetime of experience on what not to do so folks can learn from others mistakes. A search on Amsoil and by-pass filters would have saved you a lot of time and money.



To wit:



It is generally not recommended to change over to synthetic engine oil until a least 10,000 miles so the rings have a chance to seat properly.



The adapter for the by-pass from Amsoil is acknowledged to leak. A TDR memeber (CPFF) manufactures and sells a very fine billet adapter and battery box mounting bracket for the by-pass.



I know, cause I did the search, bought the billet and battery box mount and consequently did not experience any of the problems mentioned in your post.



Sorry about your troubles; you can still do the appropriate searches and get where you want to go.



Good Luck!

 

[Iguide]

Amsiol. Is there a Problem? Is there an answer?

BHolm

Sir I respectfully disagree. If I'm told that this kit fits and am sold the kit with the items that are suppose to fit & they don't that is blatant misrepresentation. That's not my doing thats Amsoil's. Their service tech represents Amsoil& there is a reason for calling them, or so I thought They advertise they have a kit to fit Cummins, Dodge, & when asked about 03 I was told that it worked & fit with the components in the kit & had the directions and information necessary to compete the job. I was very specific about obtaining that information. After market or not. If you say it stand behind it. Other wise don't say it. If they said up front that they have an adapter for the Cummins motor,& the filters but have no idea what will be needed as to other materials to finish the job, you need to figure that out on your own, I would totally concur with your assessment. However that was not the case. I was lead to believe that what I was sold was all I would need to do the job.



As far as service goes. If it is so hard to find good help it portrays a sad day and sad state of affairs that we as a people have grown to except. Frankly sir I won't except it. I don't give it & I will not except it. Nor will I except that it is something we should put up with. Damn the political correctness, get off your butt & do the job right the first time.



I do appreciate your suggestion of the braided lines. I'm only of fair mechanical ability so I'm still unsure how to apply your suggestion. The other thing to consider here is the warranty on the frame. From all of the information I've been able to gather, drilling the frame would void that warranty due to being a hydro-formed frame. Do you have a constructive answer to that. At no time do I mean to be disrespectful of you comments. I just expect more for service, & I Disagree with your assesment.

 

[Pit Bull]

Wayne, I would recommend you use Rotella T 15w40 and change the oil and filter every 7500 miles. That should get you 500,000 plus miles of use out of the old Cummins and the truck will be junk by then anyway. I run Amsoil synthetic in my Landcruiser and change it along with the filter every 7500 miles. Why do you want to do bypass? Costs money to modify, fight with DC about warranty if you have a problem. Sounds like a pain in the ass, plus like I said the Cummins will out last the truck using dino oil. PS never switch to synthetic until the engine is broken in, that should be around 20K miles per Cummins. I would get that Amsoil out of the engine ASAP and put in a good dino oil.

 

[BHolm]

No offense taken. I did qualify my assesment with a big "IF". Unless I missed it, your original post did not suggest that they told you that this was a complete kit that would fit. I recall it being more like "this is what fits a Cummins" which is much more vague and gets them off the hook.



I completely agree with you in that, if they told you the kit would fit the '03, you should be able to expect just that. Going one step above the salesperson and explaining that the kit was mis-represented should get you a refund if that is what you desire. My experience with getting re-imbursed for other expenses is that, more often than not you get nothing.



I own a business that employs about 30 people. It is tough to find good ones anymore. I still insist on it and we cycle bad eggs accordingly. I do not condone political correctness in any form. I was just offering a possible explaination for why you did not get good service, or satisfaction. It is certainly not an excuse, it is definately a symptom of things gone wrong.



Braided stainless lines are readily availible, try www.cantonracing.com . The metal provides good protection from abraison. I would think that they could be run tightly against the frame so that you do not create a hazzard when off road. I do not know how large the filters are so I wouldn't be much help with where you might put them. I wouldn't worry one second about drilling a couple of small holes in the frame. It is highly unlikely you could damage the frame and require any warranty claim, no matter what you do. I would not weld on the frame though, that is likely to cause problems down the road. To deny warranty coverage, they must prove that what you did caused the failure.



Good Luck

 

[Steve M]

There's a post in the forums somewhere of a '94 Dodge/Cummins with over 1,114,000 miles on it. The motor has never been apart. The owner used Shell Rotella 15w40. How could Amsoil be any better than that? How can you argue with success? I'll be using Rotella in mine as I have my previous three Dodge Cummins trucks.

So many aftermarket companies make a convincing arguement that the truck is crap and unreliable unless you buy their grossly overpriced product and modify your truck. Trouble begins while trying to install the gadget. Yet the folks who simply drive it bone stock and follow the maintenance schedule seem to drive them forever with very little trouble.

 

[Pit Bull]

Originally posted by Steve M

There's a post in the forums somewhere of a '94 Dodge/Cummins with over 1,114,000 miles on it. The motor has never been apart. The owner used Shell Rotella 15w40. How could Amsoil be any better than that? How can you argue with success? I'll be using Rotella in mine as I have my previous three Dodge Cummins trucks.

So many aftermarket companies make a convincing arguement that the truck is crap and unreliable unless you buy their grossly overpriced product and modify your truck. Trouble begins while trying to install the gadget. Yet the folks who simply drive it bone stock and follow the maintenance schedule seem to drive them forever with very little trouble.

Steve you are so, so right.

 

[Iguide]

Amsoil, Problems? Answers?

To The Membership: I would like to thank all of you that have responded to this forum. I have found every posting to be of value. I have sent amsoil a copy of my posting on the TDR {and stated that it was posted here} to see if they will deal with this in a more positive manner & in a more obvious & brighter light. I will continue to post the events as they unfold.



Once again Thank You To All.



Take Care & Make It a Good One.

 

[yogibear]

Dino oil is fine, but when I'm driving 10-12Kmi. a mo. , I'd be spending more time on the rack changeing oil and filter than I would fueling, esp. since I've got 165gal. cap. , and besides I'm saveing $$$ with the syn.



Larry

 

[Pit Bull]

Originally posted by yogibear

Dino oil is fine, but when I'm driving 10-12Kmi. a mo. , I'd be spending more time on the rack changing oil and filter than I would fueling, esp. since I've got 165gal. cap. , and besides I'm saving $$$ with the syn.



Larry

Larry your needs are different then most of us. By the way what brand of hemorrhoid medication do you use? :-laf

 

[EB]

I agree with Yogibear. To each their own, if you like dino oil fine. I also drive about 10K a month and use Amsoil totally. Changing oil every couple of weeks might be fine if you have time, I don't. I have a single bi-pass filter which I made the bracket to fit the space I found. Works fine. I change oil when the oil annalise tells me to. Ck it every 15- 20K. As far as expense, it's much cheaper than dino oil when you use the extended drain intervals. My truck is 5 months old with over 52,000 miles on it. Changed the oil 3 times up to 18K, at which time I switched over to Amsoil, haven't changed since, changed the full flow filter once. Don't say I'm screwing up, my last truck went 419K and the engine was never touched. Use whatever oil you want, but believe me, the Amsoil will work. Like I said, to each their own, this is what works for me.

To the fellow who started this thread, someplace in an earlier thread, I saw where someone had a dual filter mounted down on the frame someplace if that will help, might try a search.

 

[yogibear]

Pit Bull, I don't need any, had mine removed back in 1965.



Larry

 

[amsoilman]

Wayne Derby,



I have PM you.



Thanks,



Wayne

 

[Pit Bull]

Originally posted by yogibear

Pit Bull, I don't need any, had mine removed back in 1965.



Larry

Larry your a brave man. I had a gunny in the Marine Corp back in 1969 tell me that having his hemorrhoids fixed hurt worse than being shot

 

[DPKetchum]

I turned a friend with a 03 2500 Cumming on to Rotella and he called me up and said what kind of JOKE did I play on him. Said it about gagged his wife and kid out of the truck. I told him to chill and in about 500 miles the smell would go away. He asked if I was serious. Said he couldn't take 500 miles of that SMELL. Well he did and said it took LONGER then 500 miles and NO way he would pour that in it again. Said his 5 year old asked WHATS THAT SMELL!:--)

 

[yogibear]

Originally posted by Pit Bull

Larry your a brave man. I had a gunny in the Marine Corp back in 1969 tell me that having his hemorrhoids fixed hurt worse than being shot

I've never been shot, but I sure believe that!! It sure felt good when it quite hurting tho!



Larry

 

[JThiessen]

EB and Rotella Users

EB: You stated that you use the Amsoil 'cause you dont have time to change the oil as frequently as would be required (and yes, you would be doing it twice a month!), and that you only change oil when the analysis tells you to. My question is - what steps are required to get an analysis done, how much of your time does that take, how often do you have it done? I would think that you'd want to do it at least once every 7 to 10K. Just trying to weigh the cost/benefit of Amsoil myself.



Rotella users: I was under the impression that Rotella was way over the top money wise. Whats the AVERAGE price on that stuff (I dont need your "best" price, just what I'd probably end up paying).



And I agree with all that stated that a search on here would have shown many ways to mount this system. Would have taken much less effort than what WADerby ended up going through. But frustation is just that.

 

[amsoilman]

JThiessen,



I can answer your regarding the oil analysis, as I do these quite frequently, not only on my own vehicles, but on others as well.



Where I get my oil analysis kits, they will cost $14. 00 each, and includes the lab costs. To take an oil analysis will take all of 5- 10 minutes depending on where you have to draw the oil from for the analysis, about 4 ozs. Then of course you need to fill out the paperwork, and put it in the mail. The mail costs are around 50 cents. I do the oil analysis on the engine oil every 10,000 miles.



The true benefits of the oil analysis is the fact you are getting a spectro-chemical analysis of the oil, and can not only tell you if the oil is still usable, but also how much wear is occuring within the component, ie. Engine, transmission or gear boxes. It will also tell you if you are getting other contaminants, such as water, antifreeze, fuel, dirt, soot etc. in the oil.



As one continues with this type program, a trend will develope, and you can tell what is truely happening within these components. A good oil analysis lab will explain in detail how everything is regarding the analysis.



Wayne

amsoilman