Are We Ready For War?

[Doc Tinker]

OK - We already discussed this issue before. And since the USA was suddenly victimized by terrorists, which drew us into a war, we have been waging a pretty casual fight over there in Afghanistan.



Now, things seem to be changing a bit, with Israel moving to end acts of terror against their people. Every day now, something bigger seems to be happening. GWB told Israel to back off. "I really mean it" were his words. Now what I'd like to know... what if Israel keeps thumbing their nose at us? Are we going to go in there and show them that we mean it? I wonder how long before one of Israel's neighbors jump in there and show them that THEY mean it.



Maybe we should bring our men home and wait for those crazies to nuke them selves and turn the desert into the Middle East Sea.



Doc

 

[JLinder]

Two words...

Glass Factory!



I just hope that we've learned our lesson about humaniarian efforts in urban areas. It gets really ugly, and never really solves anything. Besides, the Israeli army is pretty tough. I can't really disagree with P. M. Sharon about his objective in the way that he is going after those they are terrorising his people. But, the whole situation is getting worse every minute.

 

[Sregorb]

Bottom Line (?)

Doc,

The bottom line is that the only unifying view in the world is that it's American's fault.

We're blamed if we try and help and then we're blamed if we don't help. Then there's every degree of "you didn't help enough/you went too far in help".

If it weren't for global integration of everything from food, energy, materials, investment, diversity, etc. etc. I'd say your theory of back off and deal with the winner would be great. But now I'd say (IMHO) the best we can do is know how we want to live, define a tentative road with THIS countries interests in mind, and press with or without "the rest".

We either have a good thing going and others copycat and become allies or we have a bad thing going (in their views) and they go their seperate way. We don't have a problem until one side or the other tries to impose "their shining path of death" on the other and starts killing people to provoke actions...

If there is no other way than war (now or ever) to settle, then "fight's on!", and it'll be ugly. BUT, may it be sooner rather than later as the technological edge currently belongs to us and our allies.



May we never lose that edge.



Brian

ps. in the meantime, let 'em duke it out all they want. If enough screaming idiots from one side or the other are neutralized then maybe we can get back to peace for another generation.....

 

[illflem]

Lets reduce our dependence on foreign oil by developing our own supplies and alternative energy sources then kiss that Allah damned part of the world good-bye. Probably be cheaper than fighting a never ending war.



As for Are We Ready For War? According to our Sec of Defense in reference to whether we will be going after Iraq, " Our troops are tried from their long engagement in Afghanistan and need a break". Sounds pretty wimpy to me.

 

[QRTRHRS]

The question may be "Do we have the stomach for it?" The problem is not our soldiers. Give em' the tools and the right commanders and let them do the job. It's the politicians and that portion of the public who only wants to take without contribution that will loose it for us.



Re: oil. I thought the Russians had plenty to sell? Why not buy from them. Such as they are, at least we understand each other.

 

['956Wheel]

Doc,



Do we have a choice? We are ready, IMO, despite years of ignorance in the White House.



The ironic part of this mess is the worlds enemy is one group that has several "cells" and factions. One of their leaders won the Nobel Peace Prize! Thats right, Jesse Jacksons buddy Arafat. It seems that our country has grown sympathetic, (pathetic being the key word), to a rather small group of militant illiterates. History has been ignored thus allowing such acts as "9/11" to occur. How many of us remember the Munich Olympics? The terror of Munich was yet another curse of the same Nobel Peace prize recipient!



Where do we go from here? We haven't been afforded the option of deciding our future, the luxury of freedom does not allow us to believe the unbelievable. There was a time, not long ago, that Arafat was the enemy then we were hit with an action that only a free country could be struck with... Yasser came to the White House! That sick little man cannot find it in himself to sit up straight like a leader should.



Take away our oil... . go ahead Saddam, better develop an appetite for crude cause you will be biting the hand that feeds you! How many tons of wheat do we send there? Too many! Let them get used to a sand and tar diet.



So lets do our best to remember who the enemy is and act accordingly as we have no choice... they made the choice for us. When we are asked if we should arm Israel, the answer should be clear for all to see.



Mike

 

[baby.driver]

SHEEEEEEET

Who cares?

When JESUS returns HE is going to BURN THE WHOLE PLACE. You ready for that?

 

[rdanley]

what i dont like is this bush says we need to weed out terroism by any means . but yet when isreal is threaten and they take charge to protect ther people we tell them no you cant do that ,but yet we are doing the same in ragistan. isreal has a right to fight and who are we to tell them no! we should be there helping or set back and let the sand monkeys take care of them self.

 

[hammersley]

It all seems to simple....

Just take over the oil fields and tell Iran, Irag and Saudia to take a flying _ _ _ _ at the moon!

 

[rmrc]

As far as I'm concerned, we should stop trying to play "WORLD COP"! Since when to we have the right to tell the rest of the world how they have to live and what rules they have to live by! The people from that region of the world have been fighting, for what seems like all recorded history. Let them fight their own battles! If our government is so hell bent on spending money, let them take care of our own citizens and financial troubles FIRST!!!!!

 

[hammersley]

rmrc

You're right about how we should take care of our own problems first - the problem is that it appears the money to be made by doing this, goes to the wrong folks so there is no support. But we can sure spread the wealth around in about every other place. And man can we drean up the reason to do it. A lot of young men never got any older protecting somebody's else's interests. And also we must be careful about discussing Govt Waste, because as we all know it's waste to one person - but it's another's Bread and Butter. And I'll bet a lot of us here who complain about the Big Govn'mt are actualluy at the feeding trough in ways we don't even know!

 

[sdalton]

I think the only reason GWB is mildly condeming what Israel is doing is because we still have a few Arab friends over there. It does seem that the whole middle east is against Israel. He seems to be trying to walk a fine line with middle East politics.

I say "Dam The Consiquences, and Back Israel". "The Hell with the PLO and Yassar Toad Face". It has never worked and will never work, when you try to make friends with religious fanatics. If they are willing to blow themselves up, along with innocent children, do you think they will ever keep a truce? Are they the kind of people you would want to make a deal with? I say strike them down, HARD. Then, when they show up again, strike them down harder and hunt them to all ends of the earth. By any means necessary. Unleash the dogs of war and let Israel take care of business.



OOPS, was I typing out loud again??

 

[DRR-24V]

Mad Dogs !!

I am possibly different than you folks, but if a particular group or Race insists on destroying me, My loved ones and everything I love, I see EXTERMINATION as a viable alternative to the problem.

Who would miss them?



I gotta tell you me and SDalton gotta be twins. We sure think alike. ! There is no way I want our Servicemen to be over there as targets. That would be a tragic joke. We are just starting to realize what Israel has been trying to cope with forever.

 

[Champane Flight]

Either

The real question is, are we against terror or not? If they were blowing up busses in New York right now, would we be asking them to pull back? We can either get out of the whole region and quit backing Israel or jump in with both feet. Sooner or later the war is going to come to us again if we continue to back Israel. I am not so sure we don't need to move the Israelies out and give them White sands, same kind of country, no?



Then we can help arm all the middle east and wait for them to blow each other up. After the smoke clears give it all back to Israelies... ... ... ... ... ...

 

[sdalton]

Well, it looks as if this Middle East thing is gathering up some steam. My only fear is that Israel is surrounded by nothing but hostile countries. When it comes down to it I hope that when the full blown war breaks out there that our leaders have the balls to do back and support Israel and not take the economic backstep and stay out. Anyone know how the UN feels about Israel? Also, are the European countries ready to take the side of Israel?? I hope so, or Israel could be in some serious trouble. Israel alone might be seriously outgunned, or outnumbered. I also fear China might be behind the backing of some of the Middle East countries, in so far as supplies of weapons.

 

[Shrimpy]

The thing I can't get over is that back when Arafat and Netenyaho (sp) the then Israile (sp) prime minister were at Camp David with Klinton he turned down a deal that would have given him and his "people" back 97% of the land they have been fighting over. 97% !!!!!!!!! Yet he turned it down. Why???? Because he does not want peace. He is the equivilent of jesse what's his name over here. Jesse does not help the average down trodden person, he lines his own pockets. The same could be said for Arafat. If their is peace, he looses his world stage.



I agree with 956wheel, see how long a tar sandwich can sustain life, then get back to us.



But if differant factions of arabs keep offering up $20,000 to 35,000 per suicide attack, it could go on for ever!!!! Don't know the answer but something needs to be done. Bush1 should have driven saddam beyond bagadad.



The kings X will be the first Nuke or Bio attack, then to me, all bets are off and prepare for total and complete destruction.

 

[sdalton]

I listened to Rush after I got off the computer this morning. He talked in detail of Klinton , Yassar, and Nettenyayhoo. Apparently Yassar was offered 95% of the land he was asking for and a lot of other things. He didnt once offer anything in return. He just walked out of all the meetings when an offer was made. After it was over, he went back to Israel and started a new campaign of suicide bombings. I forget what the name of it was, some arab jibbyjabby name. What every person in this country and free world needs to realize is that the muslems over there dont want peace. They want total elimination of ISRAEL and the JEWS. No compromise. No ifs ands or buts about it.

I am not Jewish, but I think Christianity was founded by Jews, and most post Christ religions are based on Judism.

I feel for them and their plite.

 

[GFoley]

illflem,



Tired soldiers, I am not surprised. We have been in Afghanistan for over 6 months now. We surely sent too few soldiers for the job, worked 'em long and hard, never give 'em days off to unwind from the stresses of a deployment.

I just spent a little time in Central America on a base camp. Not there nearly as long as Afghanistan, but even when I was off, I was still on duty becasue we could never leave the base camp other than our assigned missions.

Sorry I skipped right to the bottom of the trhead and launched this. I may have missed some other good point along the way. I don't want to make any enemies on the board but had to let you know how this soldier feels.



Glenn

 

[PHaller]

I think Patton said it best. The politicians always stop short and leave us <the American military> with another war to fight. He said it 55 years ago about the USSR. Now, the same could be said about Iraq.

Palistein cannot push Isreal into the sea no matter how hard they try and Arafat has become ineffective as a leader and can not or will not control his people. IMHO, there is no point talking to him at all. Stand up and be counted as an ally of Isreal and do whatever is necessary to bring peace to the regeon including bashing Iraq and Palistein if needs be. Isreal has shown time and time again that they will defend themselves from hostile neighbors and will also direct preemptive strikes against other countries that present a threat to them. Remember the strike by Isreal against Iraqi heavy water plant in about 1980. Had Isreal not done this strike, we could well have battled a nuclear armed Iraq in 1990.

Isreal has also shown that, given the opportunity for REAL lasting peace, they will offer land and political comprimises as witnessed by their peace treaties with Jordan and Egypt. They will not, however, negotiate, peace with Arafat because he never has offered any REAL promise of peace. Historically, Palisteines offers of peace have been empty. Would we as Americans worried about our sovernty, do differently?

Judging Isreals intentions are fairly easy. They want peace and the right to live without fear and they are willing to put their men and women in harms way to defend their right to exist. I have no problem with that. My position is to defend them as needed. Bush, however, is an oil man first and foremost. You can always count on him to do whatever is in the oil buisnesses best interest, including looking the other way when electricity prices skyrocket and Enron lies about its earnings causing the single largest collaps to date. Why? Because 91% af all electricity produced comes from burning fossel fuels. The rest is primarily, hydroelectric and nuclear with green producers placing a very distant 3rd. Don't count on Bush doing anything to disrupt the flow of oil including not funding alternitive fuel cell technology and being intentionmaly vauge with his intentions with the Isreali and Palistein ongoing conflict.

Are we ready for all out war in the middle east? I don't think we are and we wont be anytime soon. All we can really do is offer some sword rattling and the fear of reprisals if our will is not followed. Iraq knows this and has continually done whatever it wants. So has Iran. So has Isreal.

-Paul R. Haller-

 

[Royk]

Just keep in mind that our longtime support of Isreal was the primary reason for the attacks on 9/11. Had we never supported Isreal, the arabs wouldn't hate us as they do and we would probably still be living in that pre 9/11 bliss.



-Roy