Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) Auto Trans and Triple Disc Converters

[Mark_Kendrick]

I expect them to follow their warranty to the letter.



http://www.atsdiesel.com/PDF/Warranty 0803 A1.PDF



I'll worry about it when I break one. I haven't and none of my customers have either.

 

[Stefan Kondolay]

Wow, if our (DTT) warranty was like that none of our customers would have a warranty. No Sled Pulling, no Competition of any sort, no abuse, that rules out about everyone that has an aftermarket trans, and you can't even tow over weight. Why buy an aftermarket if your truck is only driven to get groceries.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Wow, if our (DTT) warranty was like that none of our customers would have a warranty. No Sled Pulling, no Competition of any sort, no abuse, that rules out about everyone that has an aftermarket trans, and you can't even tow over weight. Why buy an aftermarket if your truck is only driven to get groceries.

Stefan,

you're showing a complete lack of professionalism. This has been a discussion about the differences in transmission building methods used by various vendors and you are turning it into a ATS bash.



Like father, like son I guess...

 

[Stefan Kondolay]

I believe if you look back you are trying to pick apart our (DTT) theory on the proper operation of a trans, trying to give reason why you vendors aproach is better, then in your post you put up their warranty info which reads that as far as warranty goes their thinking is the same.



Although in normal fashion once something is pointed out that you guys don't like you whine till the moderators step in (moderators thanks for letting guys have fun on this one). :{



And Jim your truck doesn't count until you make as much power as Kendrick. Jim have you made over 500hp yet. :-laf



As far as unprofessional, I bet that most consumers didn't realize that these were the conditions of their warranty. So I tried to point that out if that offended consumers I'm sorry.



how many guys don't:



Sled Pull

Drag Race

Dyno

Compete in any form

Pull Heavy



that have an aftermarket trans? If you don't than why buy aftermarket trans?

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Mark now that you've figured out how much HP is lost through a DTT in the form of extra heat generated. Do yourself a favor and figure that out for an ATS without a man. lockup switch or the commander.



How tight or loose does ATS build their TC's ?? Probably 80 -83% ?? That's more heat generated.

I don't know what the efficiency is w/o lock-up. They don't rate the TC that way and I don't care. I like my TC locked under load. I think I'm gonna shell out for a Commander soon. I just have to finish afew projects first.

Under heavy towing i understand you generate ALOT of heat... ... . But a triplelock TC doesn't do any better to control the heat than a DTT. When unlocked both will produce about the same amount of heat. When locked both will cool as far as their coolers will them!!!



No argument is intended here, i just value others opinions and am trying to learn. It's clear you know your stuff about compounds, now teach me more about TC's, and trannies!!



Curtis

I don't pretend to be an expert at trannies. When I have questions I pick up the phone and call a buddy of mine



I'm just passing on the results of the research I've done over the years.



You are correct unlocked both will generate a lot of heat. ATS intends for you to get the truck moving then lock the TC so that heat isn't an issue.



DTT tries to minimize the heat generated in fluid coupling by making them very efficient. I have noticed a noticeably reduced stall speed in the DTT trucks I've driven. I didn't like it at all. Hot rod diesels tend to want a bit of RPM to get rid of smoke and the DTT TCs didn't allow that.



The ATS Stall is decidedly lower than stock but still allows enough RPM to start the turbo spinning a bit. If stock is too high and , for me, DTT is too low. The ATS is a good middle ground as far as stall goes. I am a firm believer in the Triplelok though. When it locks up the is no question about what just happened



A little bit about the brands. .



I don't think DTT makes a bad product I just don't like their method. They accomplish the same goal. They put a lot of power to the ground. ATS and DTT just take different routes to the same end. I like the ATS route and that's what I buy and install.



Some differences in opinion are unexplainable. . My dad likes PHORDS... :-laf

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

I believe if you look back you are trying to pick apart our (DTT) theory on the proper operation of a trans, trying to give reason why you vendors aproach is better, then in your post you put up their warranty info which reads that as far as warranty goes their thinking is the same.



Although in normal fashion once something is pointed out that you guys don't like you whine till the moderators step in (moderators thanks for letting guys have fun on this one). :{



And Jim your truck doesn't count until you make as much power as Kendrick. Jim have you made over 500hp yet. :-laf



As far as unprofessional, I bet that most consumers didn't realize that these were the conditions of their warranty. So I tried to point that out if that offended consumers I'm sorry.



how many guys don't:



Sled Pull

Drag Race

Dyno

Compete in any form

Pull Heavy



that have an aftermarket trans? If you don't than why buy aftermarket trans?

Your reply is egocentric as usual... to refer to your method as 'proper' is implying that any other way is not.



I have been entirely clear about my brand loyalty. I have not implied that you method is wrong but I have expressed my opinion and provided information to justify my position.



You are more than welcome to present your own opinion and justification if you like.



All I've seen so far are childish cheap shots.

 

[gitchesum]

Gentlemen, lets keep the site guidelines in mind when you post a response.



https://www.turbodieselregister.com/guidelines.htm

5. 1. The TDR Discussion Forums are not an appropriate forum for emotionally charged discussion between manufacturers, distributors, dealers, shops and/or users. These forums are intended to be technical resources for members interested in learning more about the proper care and maintenance of their trucks. All Vendors will refrain from making direct, emotionally charged, posts to and/or about competitors. All Vendor posts must be civil and technically oriented. If Vendors wish to compare products with competitors, use generic references (i. e. oiled element air filter; as opposed to Amsoil, AFE, etc. ).

If this thread strays any further, I'm going to lock it.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

if you do heave pullying over10k and have over 450 hp yes triple. if not Dunrite converter is more than perfect for most apps.

i put one in and all is fie

i went through 4 trannys befor they isolated that the tc was tearing out the gears, and burnig u[p

My 2wd daily driver is ~380hp and the triplelok is well worth the expense. the difference between my truck and stock(transmission wise) is phenomenal.



I drive it pretty hard. when I want to go, I go. If i can hook up to it I'll pull it.



I have a friend who is a Goerend(sp?) fan. the only real difference between his and mine is the TC. He has lockup available in all gears(most every vendor does). His lockup is a lot lot less firm but neither of our trucks have any shifts or engagements that could be classed as 'harsh'. The triplelok engagement is decidedly different though.



From what I understand Suncoast also has a 3 disc converter. there are differences in contruction but the concept and function are similar to the Triplelok.

 

[I-6DZL]

My dads truck has the ATS (as you can tell from sig) I love it, very very good feel. BUT the fluid coupling sucks. The stall isn't low enough (for me anyhow) The truck is bone stock, not even a BHAF (yet).



Mark thank you for clearing up your preferences. It's clear you're ATS all the way. I like both trannies, but will have DTT do mine when my trans decides it's had enough. I would love to see dad get a fueling box or injectors. Just something to boost the power up enough to see if the ATS converter will have any slip to it, or if it will get to the stage of 'harsh' Right now it's borderline..... But better too much than not enough.



Thanks for the input

Curtis

 

[zstroken]

DTT sled pulling

Does that mean DTT will warranty their convertors for sled pulling? I emailed DTT about using there convertors for sled pulling and am still awaiting a response.

 

[Cooker]

All companies agree that higher than stock levels are needed. The question is how much higher.

Mark,

This is what I was alluding to in our discussion. ATS realized the need to increase line pressures even though the TC doesn't need it the rest of the transmission does.



Any idea what kind of pressures your ATS trannies are running? The numbers I have seen from ATS owners are not all that different than that of DTT trannies or really any other high performance transmission vendor.



Thanks.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

My dads truck has the ATS (as you can tell from sig) I love it, very very good feel. BUT the fluid coupling sucks. The stall isn't low enough (for me anyhow) The truck is bone stock, not even a BHAF (yet).



Mark thank you for clearing up your preferences. It's clear you're ATS all the way. I like both trannies, but will have DTT do mine when my trans decides it's had enough. I would love to see dad get a fueling box or injectors. Just something to boost the power up enough to see if the ATS converter will have any slip to it, or if it will get to the stage of 'harsh' Right now it's borderline..... But better too much than not enough.



Thanks for the input

Curtis

When you talk to the fellas at ATS you start to understand their reasoning behind their design. They are in Denver which requires smog testing and are at 5000+ft of elevation.



A truck that barely smokes here(~1000ft) is a freight train there.



When you start taking about high hp you need to go for a ride in Clints D-max. It's scary fast, firm but smooth shifting, and makes almost no smoke in Denver.



You have to understand the problems they are needing to solve when you evaluate the answer they give.



You can ask for a lower stall on the converter. They have 2 or three different stall speeds that are std. Your dad may have one of the higher ones.



FWIW,

Mark

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Mark,

This is what I was alluding to in our discussion. ATS realized the need to increase line pressures even though the TC doesn't need it the rest of the transmission does.



Any idea what kind of pressures your ATS trannies are running? The numbers I have seen from ATS owners are not all that different than that of DTT trannies or really any other high performance transmission vendor.



Thanks.

I need to measure mine for the warranty paperwork. I'll try to post it back.

 

[Cooker]

I need to measure mine for the warranty paperwork. I'll try to post it back.

Thanks Mark.

 

[Stefan Kondolay]

DTT TC's are warranted if you sled pull, so if you e-mailed about that it doesn't matter if you pull, drag race, pull heavy.



Put the right parts in and you can do these things. If our trans/tc's couldn't do these things we probably wouldn't be in business.



DTT TC's have a Lifetime pro-rated warranty, the first 2 years full coverage, and after that it's pro-rated, I just had a guy re-doing his transmission that he did 4 years ago and wanted a New TC and it only costed him a $375 because he sent his back for freshen-up. And the cost will never be over 50% of new.

 

[Cooker]

Mark,

You must have overlooked the post, but "zstroken" did ask about DTT's warranty a little farther up on this page.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Mark,

You must have overlooked the post, but "zstroken" did ask about DTT's warranty a little farther up on this page.

I missed that one. . i see now.



I didn't find the warranty on their website though. I didn't look all that hard though.



The ATS TC will hadnle over 2000ft# of torque. You don't have to worry about the TC. The rest of the transmission may have issues with a 44,000# anchor though.



Sled pulling is a test of mean-time-between-failures for all kinds of parts. In comparison drag racing is easy on components.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

I broke an NV4500 HARD in one pull. ~$1500 later I decided I didn't need to sled pull anymore.

 

[Sled Puller]

Mark,

How did you manage to break a 4500 with 400 HP? :-laf

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Mark,

How did you manage to break a 4500 with 400 HP? :-laf

sleddy, twice in one week . . ouch.



that truck made 586rwhp after I detuned it to sell it

It ate 3 nv4500s before I parted with it