Best Available Torque Converter

[Snow man]

Merrick,it sounds like your pulling thru your torque convertor big time. I think you need to upgrade it before you bother adding any more power. 1300RPM drop is huge,no wonder you need lockup in the lower gears.

 

[Jim Fulmer]

I don't think ANY other Performance Trans is built to take locked shifts... and boy are the other guys jealous!



Hey Robert maybe you need to ride in a real truck doing locked shifts except mine only drops 300-400 rpm when it's not spinning , the only thing I worry about is keeping it out of the ditch.



Merrick you are correct about everything except 3rd gear (direct) is weaker than the converter or the shafts... ... it's math brother but you have got the right idea with the pressures.



Jim

 

[MCummings]

Hey Snow Man,

I am actually in a very odd predicament. I Need the RPM to light my chargers (They are big enough that I don't call 'em turbo's anymore).



When I get on the line I go to 1/8 throttle and get 1,400RPM right from the get-go. As boost start to build the RPM climbs, at 5PSI I'm at 1,700RPM, and at 13PSI I'm abour 2,000RPM. My boost gauge was not working last time out at the track, but I think at 20PSI I am very close to 2,700RPM at about 1/4 throttle.

I plan, as I get the truck tuned more, to hit lock-up just off the line. With the traction I have available, and the planned transmission mods, I think sub 1. 5 60's are possible, especially using that huge lock-up RPM Drop as a "smoke and mirror" torque increase to the wheels.



I can't tighten up the TC, and still light my turbo's. My "little" turbo almost outflows an HT3B, and has to have 1,500RPM to even begin to light. At 1,500RPM, I am making 0 PSI. The RPM band at the track is intended to be from 2,500 to 4,000RPM. We'll see how we can work that.



Merrick

 

[MCummings]

Originally posted by Jim Fulmer

Merrick you are correct about everything except 3rd gear (direct) is weaker than the converter or the shafts... ...

Hey Jim,, Yup, yo uare right. I brought this point up in another thread when supposedly the triple lock was the best thing ever. I was pounded into the ground with statements stating, "Who cares about 3rd gear, atleast the TCC won't slip". So this time, I was gunshy to bring it up.



I've heard under any situation while in 3rd gear, the TCC has 25% more holding ability, or the 3rd gear pack, is 25% weaker than the TCC. The TCC just isn't the weak point of the transmission, so why build a triple clutch ? It's nearly a moot point. They need to work on designing the shifting characteristics, and holding capabilities of the clutches. I know the Billet intermediate isn't to far off! Great news for the 4wd guys.



Merrick

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Who knows I'm not going to get into the converter:-{} The worse thing about 3rd is the same circuit releases 2nd so it get double duty, then there is the leak issue, I got to pull a core transmission and do the bench pressure test with my own hands... . wow what a learning experience.



On the shafts here's one for you, if I can't get a billet one for a 2WD and I run slicks I'll have to build up a spare O/D section to carry to the track if the output shaft breaks and doesn't crater anything else, not too many people have broke an output shaft with a 2WD but it's happened.



Jim

 

[MCummings]

And the demand for 2wd billet output shafts continues to grow.....



Merrick

 

[Cooker]

Originally posted by ronsram1999

In essence what your telling us is that it doesn't matter who's TC or other component some one might use... . the problems start when guys start uping the power and that is what causes things to break. If transmissions are used the way they were designed to operate at a given power level at a given time and then some one finds a way to up the power even more and something else breaks then it was the TC's fault. There is not one manufacturer out there that has not had a component fail because someone uped the power level. Could that be the reason why cryo-ed shafts are used by almost all aftermarket trans. product producers after a given Hp level.

Not really. Obviously higher HP breaks more parts, thats very simple. I would venture a guess to say that shifting locked to locked on a stock truck will break a stock input shaft, it just may take a little longer to work at the impurities in the metal than a higher HP truck. My point was locked to locked shifting is violent and causes damage and will continue to cause damage by finding the weakest link. A non locked shift is a little more forgiving.



I agree big HP is violet and will cause carnage no matter who's TC is in the truck, that is the pay to play rule but why accelerate it with locked to locked shifting unless that is what you choose to do with your truck. I bet most of the customers of any of TC companies want reliability first and performance second, especially after dropping the kind of money that these performance transmssions cost.



Merrick, or should I say the previous owner, did not get a cryoed/billet shaft with over 500HP and twins. Maybe 500hp isn't quite there yet to justify it

 

[MCummings]

Originally posted by Cooker

Merrick, or should I say the previous owner, did not get a cryoed/billet shaft with over 500HP and twins. Maybe 500hp isn't quite there yet to justify it

Would you sell a trans that was going to bolted behind a 500HP truck, and not include atleast a billet input shaft?



I'm confused with your last comment. It looks like you are implying I don't have 500HP.



A few of my dyno runs were under 500 HP, a few 480, and 490's, but I think lke 10 of my dyno runs were over 500, with my best HP being 561 and 1176 TQ. It's not much, I'm not bragging about it. Who knows how much HP the truck had when I bought it... but it wasn't running a 12 second 1/4 mile, That's for sure. It felt like High 400's, MAYBE 500RWHP. I've invested over $5,000, and haven't picked up anyHP, allthough, I have picked up 15PSI boost, lost a ton of driveability, and made the truck more durable.



It'll be some time before I can put down the HP I want,, I've stopped saetting a date, as the date just keeps getting pushed back with more, and more unforeseen delays.



I feel somewhat bent over with the snapped input shaft two weeks after I bought the truck.



Merrick

 

[Idaho CTD]

Merrick,



I think he finds it amazing that the transmission was put in a truck with that kind of hp without at least an upgraded input shaft.



Nathan

 

[WadePatton]

shifting question

Since we're having all this locked shifting discussion--



I'm going to be sled pulling with 350-400HP. The transmission is a Sun Coast Pro-Loc.



Should I hit lock in low and let then shift to second locked OR wait until I hit second and then lock it?



The puller I bought it from pulled it about nine times and I think he always locked it in low--with close to 500hp. I'm thinking that it might last longer if I don't lock it until second.

 

[MCummings]

Ahh, I see. Thanks Nathan.



Wade, I would let it shift to 2nd, then put the mystery to it.



Merrick

 

[Edward]

Snow man

My ATS only drops 250 rpm when it locks.



Merric

I am not trying to throw a curve ball your way but others are making some inconsistent applications from your transmission saga. Since it has been implied by others that your transmission and its vendor are not up to par because you managed to break it. Could you please list the rest of the major parts on your trucks that you have managed to break? I know the list is quite long from talking to you in the chat room. It would be good for those same people to show some consistency and publicly imply that Cummins, Dodge and the rest of the vendors parts you've managed to brake are equally sub standard.



Edward

 

[Snow man]

Edward,how much hp do you have?over 5oo like Merrick? lower hp trucks do not have the Hp to pull thru the convertor,like Merrick is. When you in the 5-650hp range like him and I are,any weakness in the trans shows up quickly.

 

[jrandol]

What does "pull thru the converter mean"? Just curious

 

[MCummings]

Hah! You got me Edward. I have broken my fair share of parts!



I've blown a motor, broken my 5-speed, broken a clutch, 3 VP44's, around 5 Lift Pumps, Broke the Transfer Case, broke the input shaft, and rescently demolished both my high dollar hybrid turbo's I've gone through 4 sets of rear tires in the last 30,000 miles. That's all I can remember off the top of my head.



I'm hard on my trucks, harder than one is suposed to be.



I ruined my 5-speed South Bend Clutch. Ripped the center right out of it. Peter took the trashed clutch, and for only the difference,, let me upgrade. Since the upgrade, I have been very happy with my South Bend Clutch, it hasn't let me down.



My EGR Brakes have performed Flawlessly, my Edge COMP has been nearly perfect. My DD Injectors have performed as advertised.

-------

After typing all this, I am starting to think, it's not that I am hard on parts, but the fact that why was a transmission sold and knowingly installed behind a twin turbo 500HP truck with stock shafts? THAT should not have happened. Why was the truck setup like that? Was it the previous owners fault specifcly requesting OE shafts? or was it the vendor trying to save/make some money?



And with this aimless, wordy, bad grammered post, I will step out of this discussion for a while.



Merrick

 

[rrausch]

Merrick, you sound like an A-OK guy!

 

[jjohn]

Originally posted by jrandol

What does "pull Thur the converter mean"? Just curious

Jeff,



I'm taking it as delivering power threw fluid coupling rather than lock up??? But I was wondering the same thing.

 

[wilddiesel]

Well guys I guess it is about time to post this new transmission that is being built here in Utah. To heck with all these torque convetor issues and slipping clutches and trying to get engine to spool up with all of these tight low stall convertors that smoke like a banshee when driving. PS when you go to the site I am listing these are just starting numbers for the amount of power this thing can handle, Oh and did I mention it also has brake retarding built into it. You can go to transrevolution.com or keep intouch with me and I will let you know when available.

 

[pwr2tow]

Here's a direct link to the web page www.transrevolution.com



If this pans out it sounds very interesting.

Competition keeps giveing us better products

 

[wilddiesel]

Thank you for fixing the url address.