Better RV Brands?

[HBarlow]

The RV industry seemed to have generally LOWERED the standards of build to meet consumer demand based ONLY on price. How many 6500# trailers have been built with 3500# axles. To only give 500# of load carrying capacity. I know that the hitch also carries some weight, but blown tires, bent axles and ruined bearings seem the norm on a lot of the average trailers. If your trailer is going to be used 3x a year for 500 miles almost anything will give good service. I use our RV 130+ nights a year and take lots of forrest service roads. I demand a higher standard than some. Sorry if I offend some , dont mean to just trying to get a point across.

Consumer demand not manufacturers has brought the quality down. Most RV buyers are fooled by the surface glitz and glitter. The buying decisions of many couples shopping for RVs are made by wives who are utterly clueless about build quality but make their choices based on colors, fabrics, and cute little interior design issue. I did not allow my wife to participate when I selected a fifth wheel (or the previous fiver or the earlier conventionals). I bought it, brought it home, and showed it to her. She likes it and understands why I bought it that way.

Most current RV buyers buy what is cheap and flashy then whine and complain when they begin having problems. I have seen it many times here on the TDR forum. A member comes here and asks what we recommend or asks our opinions about certain brands. The member almost always ignores our advice and buys cheap or has already made his decision and is only asking for us to reinforce the choice he has already made. Many of them then get angry and defensive when we tell him the truth.

Most Americans are living beyond their means on borrowed money and can't really afford quality. Americans prefer buying cheap junk and are then outraged when they learn the product they bought is . . . cheap junk.

The RV industry hasn't really lowered the standards. They are producing to demand. Unfortunately, many of the manufacturers that are now in business and selling lots of trailers are building trailers of lower quality. Consumers made the decision to shut down the true quality builders.

NuWa has not lowered their standards although they did experiment with Lippert frames for two model years. They learned that was a mistake.

 

[Bill Carlyle]

We are full timers living in our 5th wheel 365 days a year. After four years I had new tires put on and that is being lucky I guess. We keep it clean and well maintained and I try to stay on top of things to prevent trouble. We put about 12,000 miles on the 5th wheel and about 19,000 on the Ram every year.



Bill

 

[Gonzo 1066]

Very good points, I agree that the RV industry has built to consumer demand, It is just a sorry sorry state when I see a young couple upsidedown in a junk RV that is worth FAR less than they owe on it.

 

[Slow Six]

We are hoping to upgrade within a year and we have been looking at higher end 5th wheel trailers. We have short listed to Carri-Lite, Mobile Suites & Hitchhiker. I am leaning towards the Mobile Suites but I have a concern over their frames as they are made by Lippert. Are all Lippert frames bad or are the problem frames in lesser quality trailers whose manufacturers speced a lighter frame to cut costs? The Mobile Suites appear to be well built and have a lot of features that we want plus they seem very accomodating to build to our wants (where possible). It is going to be a tough process for us as we want to go full timing and at the price of these good units we can't afford a mistake. The unit we choose will need to function in all weather conditions from very cold to hot with the extreme cold being the main concern. I also need a trailer that can be used on a 3500 dually as a MDT will not work for us, so weight and length need to be considered. I have been following this thread and would like to hear "real world" experiences from people who have these units and have used them extensively.

 

[Grizzly]

Slow Six, My best advice is to purchase the latest copy of RV Consumer Group. It's money well worth spent for such a large investment. With that in hand, you can study your options to fit your needs and pocket book. I did and am very happy with my 5th wheel selection. It has an American made frame, which is made in their own plant in La Grande, Oregon and Dexter axles. It doesn't have a lot of foo foo fancy stuff, but does have excellent workmanship.



george

 

[gtoli]

Thanks Harvey,

The Tango we bought on the Lippert frame is our first "Entry" level trailer. I will definitely do my homework before the next upgrade.

So far the Tango has worked well no frame failures yet. The rest of the trailer appears to be well built. I hope Pacific Caochworks figures this out and builds on a better frame. I will continue to use my trailer and post updates on this thread.

Gene

 

[Bill Stockard]

We are hoping to upgrade within a year and we have been looking at higher end 5th wheel trailers. We have short listed to Carri-Lite, Mobile Suites & Hitchhiker. I am leaning towards the Mobile Suites but I have a concern over their frames as they are made by Lippert. Are all Lippert frames bad or are the problem frames in lesser quality trailers whose manufacturers speced a lighter frame to cut costs? The Mobile Suites appear to be well built and have a lot of features that we want plus they seem very accomodating to build to our wants (where possible). It is going to be a tough process for us as we want to go full timing and at the price of these good units we can't afford a mistake. The unit we choose will need to function in all weather conditions from very cold to hot with the extreme cold being the main concern. I also need a trailer that can be used on a 3500 dually as a MDT will not work for us, so weight and length need to be considered. I have been following this thread and would like to hear "real world" experiences from people who have these units and have used them extensively.

We are friends with a couple who are TDR members and have been "full time" for nearly 20 years. They have been Hitchhiker (2) owners until the last couple of years when they traded for a 36' triple slide Mobile Suites (I don't remember the model) about two years ago. After owning the Mobile Suites they regret that choice and wish they had traded for another Hitchhiker instead. They agree that the Mobile Suites is a nice unit, but their biggest problem with the Mobile Suites is it appears that no one at Mobile Suites has ever towed and/or lived in one for any length of time. There are many features that are inconvenient and haven't been thought out before it was incorporated into the trailer. For example, ask a Mobile Suites representative how one gets the slide-outs in it the electric motor fails.



The trailer is heavy and the Goodyear G-rated tires have been a problem. The suspension isn't built for the weight. They have had the springs replaced. (The trailer has been weighed on scales and it is under the GVWR) When weighing the trailer, they discovered that there is much more weight on one side of the suspension than the other which is a result of poor design. Another expample that the designer/engineers haven't towed or lived in the trailer. There are other things they have mentioned, but at the moment, I can't remember them.



I don't own a 5th wheel trailer nor do I plan to buy one; however, I have owned three in the past. I'm only repeating what I've heard from them.



Bill

 

[HBarlow]

I have not had any personal experience with Mobile Suites so what I am going to write is opinion only. When I began thinking about a new fifth wheel back in '06 I was still transporting out of Indiana.

I had a day off the road and visited the Elkhart dealer that claimed to be the largest volume Travel Supreme dealer in the country to look at inventory. The dealer was only 20 miles or less from the Travel Supreme manufacturing plant.

The dealer didn't have any new TS trailers on the lot and a couple of late model used units smelled musty like they had spent their service life in Florida humidity so I passed them by.

The salesman tried to shift me to Mobile Suites because they had several in inventory. He blew a lot of smoke about the MS being in the same category as a TS. I looked at a couple of them and took home a brochure to study.

Frankly I was not impressed. My gut feeling was the Mobile Suites was a pretender to high quality. The manufacturer's goal appeared, to me, to be to focus attention and resources more into appearance than genuine build quality. I didn't know about Lippert frames at the time but had been living in a '95 Travel Supreme which I had purchased used. I could see the difference. The interior wood was an indicator. I don't remember now some of the other details I noticed. I think the Mobile Suites brochure was another prime indicator. The absence of construction details in the presence of glowing hyperbole was a clue that registered.

I wasn't impressed enough with Mobile Suites to even seriously consider one. Knowing now what I know about Lippert frames and components I would not give one serious consideration.

 

[NStates]

Slow Six,
My wife and I have been traveling and doing volunteer work all of USA for the past 14 years. My first 5th wheel was a Carriage when the business was a family owned business. It was a good rig and we spent a summer in Alaska in it. Our second rig was a Teton an excellent rig. Now we have a Mobile Suites and I consider it top of the line. The craftsmanship is outstanding. Quality work shows up in areas (storage and etc. )not normally seen. Their frames are heavy and I would not be concerned. Ours is a 2007 32 TK3. I am considering trading and will purchase another Mobile Suites. I find everything top quality example: Plumbing, cabinetry, lighting, appliances, roof, windows, air ride axles and hitch, and exterior. The cost is well worth it. We have never had a problem with anything except a recall on the disc brake unit which was replaced.
We spend from 4 to six months a year on the road.

Norm

2008 Dodge RAM 3500 Laramie Quad Cab 4X2

6. 7 Liter Cummins (R) Turbo Diesel Engine, 6 -Speed Automatic 68RFE Transmission, 3. 73 Anti-Spin Differential, Brilliant White, ISSPRO Gauges, Transfer Flow Fuel Tank, PullRite #20,500 Super 5th Hitch, Line-X, XTRA Bed liner , Hayes Genesis brake controller, PML Deep Transmission Pan, Custom Graphics, Pull a Mobile Suites Fifth Wheel.

 

[RustyJC]

Construction details of the DRV Mobile Suites can be found HERE.



We've owned our Mobile Suites since August 2004 and, although we're not full-timers (I'm still a working stiff), we've put some pretty heavy usage and made some long trips in the MS over the last 6+ years. Based on my experience, would I consider another? YES, in a heartbeat!



We've had no structural issues whatsoever - no frame problems, no water leaks, etc. A lot of 5th wheels other than Mobile Suites used the Goodyear G614 tires when they came out, and just about all of them had problems - we had 2 tread separations when the tires were about 3 years old, but Goodyear paid to repair the damages and replaced all 4 tires with what they said was a "radically improved" design. We had no problems with the new G614s, but when they came up on 3 years old, I went ahead and replaced them with 17. 5" J-rated Michelin XTAs anyway just prior to a summertime trip across the southwest to the Grand Canyon. The 17. 5" upgrade is optional or standard (depending on model) on the Mobile Suites and competitive 5th wheels now.



I certainly agree that the HitchHikers, Travel Supremes, Newmars, etc. are top-of-the-line units, but they don't offer anything that makes me want to pull out my checkbook and leave our Mobile Suites. It's been a quiet, well insulated, comfortable and generally reliable (typical RV buyout stuff like Dometic fridges excluded) 5th wheel.



Rusty

 

[S.Morris]

George



I was wondering if you have any info on 267RL ,TT Sunset Creek by Sunny Brook?



I purchased this 2009 model new in late 08 . It is , I think well built with the aluminum x frame (supposedly they pioneered it 15yrs ago). It is not high end as does still have aluminum siding coverage and insulation is not on par to full time. I installed dexter ezi flex suspension, and with that and fact that GVWR is 10k and dry weight is a little over 6K thought it would stand test of time.



I settled on this brand after inspecting an old friends similiar SB that was 12 yrs old and seen extensive road travel(coast to coast in Canada several times). He had never had a issue other than very minor, although it did not have any slideouts.



I already own it and plan to for several years so hope I have made a sound purchase...



I load my motorcycle in bed of truck , hence the lack of 5th. Using a drw for the job makes a very stable platform that is very lowly stressed.



Look forward to your book review... ... good or bad



Thanks

 

[Grizzly]

S. Morris, Sunset Creek by Sunny Brook is an excellent TT, which has a 4. 5 star rating. There type use is for Snowbirding, which means you can live in it 6 months out of the year, but not meant for Fulltiming use. Here is what RV Consumer Group has to say about them;



SunnyBrook RVs have been popular with consumers, most of whom have few, if any, complaints about their purchase. Most would recommend a SunnyBrook to anyone considering a trailer or fifth wheel purchase. Most have found that they are easy to tow. Although some owners have encountered minor problems, they have generally been satisfied with customer service in getting them fixed. Sometimes owners have reported slideout problems (a common complaint with many manufacturers' products), but these have also been fixed promptly. The following are typical comments from SunnyBrook owners:

"This is my fifth RV, although my first SunnyBrook, and I am very pleased with the unit after researching many prior to buying. "

"We have had no problems with this trailer. Quality seems to be very good. "

"MINOR PROBLEMS WHEN I FIRST BOUGHT IT were CORRECTED RIGHT AWAY. "

"very pleased with this trailer. not one problem with it; just wish it had more storage outside . "

"we have not found a single thing wrong with this rv. we had a dutchmen before and had one trouble after another. SunnyBrook is great. "

"to make a long story short, we bought the SunnyBrook at 23% off msrp. the SunnyBrook's interior and exterior quality far exceeds that of the other manufacturers' trailers we looked at and we believe that we got what we paid for. SunnyBrook pays attention to the details, especially the interior, where the other manufacturers didn't. "

"I Was somewhat disappointed with the problems that occurred on a cross-country trip. the shower leaked, the hot/cold water was reversed in the bathroom sink and the refrigerator door was misaligned -- which caused the hinge to break off the refrigerator. no door-no refrigerator. "

"some cracks have developed in the exterior fiberglass side and end cap. "

"tub floor not supported properly, permitted recurrent leaks at tub trap. dealer/manufacturer took 10 weeks to replace insulation and tank enclosure --never fixed tub supports, had to do it myself. staples worked out of rubber roof crown and the manufacturer would only pay half labor. pDI converter unit has been replaced twice in 3. 5 years. the Trailer is a good vacation class unit, but came with human flaws in installation. "

to sum up, serious complaints about this brand are the exception rather than the rule. Consumers overall are satisfied and often completely delighted. Customer service is reportedly well above average. Our own observations of SunnyBrook products over the last 10 years have shown them to offer solid value for the price.





Hope this helps, george

 

[Grizzly]

What's the consensus on Tango trailers made by Pacific Coachworks?

There only rated 2. 5 stars on RV Consumer Group. They are an entry level and there type use is for Vacationing. The following is their staff review;



This brand should be OK, but we don't expect it be good. That opinion comes from their philosophy of building a trailer that will fit into the budget of a down-turned economy. This usually means entry level or below. That the management came from an RV company that produced trailers at entry level and below should not influence us, but it does. We think you should use extreme caution if you get this brand on your list of brands worth considering. Expect workmanship flaws and materials that will give you trouble in both the short and long haul.



george

 

[dfirlik]

Avion Traiers

The Avion name pops up occasionally in this thread. Here is a link to the history of this trailer for those interested.



avion [DokuWiki]



Don (MI)

 

[CUMMINZ]

I think we are in our retirement RV now but we have looked long and hard at a Torrey Pine. It has the quality and lines that we like more than any other coach. I like the idea they have gone to dual tandums. :-laf



#ad

 

[Bill Carlyle]

I agree with Rusty. We own a 2005 Mobile Suites 36 ft TK3 and we love it. Ordered it like we wanted and have been more than happy with it. We have lived in it full time and other 5th wheels for 22 years and like I said last night I have only had to buy new tires and that was last year. We stay in south Florida in winter and travel to Colorado, Montana and other western states evey summer. Our Mobile Suite has never given us any trouble. (nock on wood). We belong to the MS club and have been to several rallys. Great people. Good fellowship.

 

[Newt]

Hard to go wrong with a Torrey Pines, very nice coach.

Newt

 

[HBarlow]

The Avion name pops up occasionally in this thread. Here is a link to the history of this trailer for those interested.

avion [DokuWiki]

Don (MI)

Thanks for the link to the Avion history. I enjoyed looking it over and have saved your link.

I owned a very nice '87 Avion 32-S front kitchen model that was a really great trailer. I pulled it about 60,000 miles in two years including a trip to Alaska in 2003. I also owned a Cayo slide-in truck camper but sold it at a nice profit before restoring and using it.

I attended two Avion rallys and knew Bob Muncy, leader of the Silver Fellowship. Also visited Chuck Cayo at his shop in Watervliet, MI and bought some small parts from him.

 

[Newt]

We had an 86 Avion 25. I still judge RV's by it. Most come up lacking.

Newt

 

[S.Morris]

Thanks George



Reaffirms my thought that decent quality for the money on Sunnybrook.



Steve