Billet Input shaft and hub - anyone break yet?

[KatDiesel]

Just curious I decided to skip over the cryoed stuff and go for billet input shaft and hub.



Anyone seen anyone break one yet?



Just curious... ... just some preventive maintence



Bill did find it kinda funny I don't have any sort of lock up switch... ... . I just haven't "needed" one yet. . if it unlocks. . it unlocks

 

[DHRA]

Haven't broke the stock shafts yet. I figure it's a matter of time. Either that or that ultra secretive locked to locked formula Clint at ATS came up with!

Anyhow, you can't go wrong with PM, especially if you are racing hours from home with no ride back.

 

[Strick-9]

Kat,



I wouldn't worry about DTT's billet shafts. They are GUARANTEED FOR LIFE. None of us have the power to break them anyways.



Eric,

There are no secrets about slipping clutches and smooth shifts. Once you start putting some power through that transmission, the hard parts will begin to break. I broke two stock shafts in fluid coupling before getting Bill's billet parts. Why do you not have billet parts yet? I thought ATS already had billet stuff.



-Chris

 

[KatDiesel]

Originally posted by Strick-9

I wouldn't worry about DTT's billet shafts. They are GUARANTEED FOR LIFE. None of us have the power to break them anyways.

I'm not worried about it, was just curious is all.



They are already bought and being shipped to James in TX, Sept 19th and 20th hes swapping my TC and going through the transmission, then Saturday going to the DFW dyno day. Now I will have no worries bout it being setup incorrectly.



Will you be there by chance? Saturday?

 

[DHRA]

Originally posted by Strick-9

Once you start putting some power through that transmission

No power here... .

 

[JConley]

Hate to burst the bubble of all the DTT guys, but ATS and DTT buy billet shafts from the same vendor in Canada. They are the same parts, so it doesnt matter who you get it from.

 

[work2muchplay2little]

Hey Kat,



James rebuilt my auto in June, I decided to go with the billet shafts and hub too. I switched from a 91%TC to a 89%Race TC this time and like the change. What TC are you going with? I'll hope to meet you at DynoDay next month.

 

[Strick-9]

John,



I know the type of person you are and I know you wouldn't knowingly spread false information.



Could you please tell us who you are getting your information from?



-Chris

 

[JConley]

No. What point would it serve?



If you dont believe me, prove me wrong.

 

[SlyBones]

Originally posted by JConley

Hate to burst the bubble of all the DTT guys, but ATS and DTT buy billet shafts from the same vendor in Canada. They are the same parts, so it doesnt matter who you get it from.

I have no idea whether these are the same parts or not. But just because they are made by the same company does not make them the same parts. In the end these shops to not have steel mills and pastic injection molding plants, and facbrication plants all inside their shop. Virtually everything in America is made by a company who buys parts from a vendor, who buys parts from a vendor, who buys raw stock from a vendor, who raw materials from a vendor, etc.



ATS, BD, DTT and all the rest may use many of the same vendors. But each may also be calling out their own specs, choosing their grade of materials, and so on.



The real answer to Kat's question is yes its worth it to skip the cyro step if you can afford it. Cryo'd shafts, while more rare than stock shafts, have still broken. Billet has not, as of yet. I dont know of cyro'd shafts are guarenteed for life. Billet ones are. Like Stack'd-n-Jack'd said the PM is worth it, expecially when you race far away from home. The extra protection would seem to offset some extra cost, IMO. At least if my truck was as powerful as yours I would be making the same choice. But since I only have about 2/3 what you got, I dont worry as much.

 

[Pit Bull]

Originally posted by SlyBones







In the end these shops to not have steel mills and plastic injection molding plants, and fabrication plants all inside their shop. Virtually everything in America is made by a company who buys parts from a vendor, who buys parts from a vendor, who buys raw stock from a vendor, who raw materials from a vendor, etc.



ATS, BD, DTT and all the rest may use many of the same vendors. But each may also be calling out their own specs, choosing their grade of materials, and so on.

Maybe/maybe not. An example I am familiar with is my Uncle who owns Steel Mills and some machine shops. For years he made winches for Sears and other retailers, he would also sell the winches under his own brand name. All of the winches were the same (except or the name cast in the winch), same material same cable etc. Sears rated it and sold it as a 8K lb winch, my Uncle sold it as a 6K lb winch. My Uncle said it was good for 12K lb's. It cost big $$$ to customize and modify parts, many companies share the expense by going with the manufactures spec's. I doubt anyone will ever really know. But it can make a great thread :-{}

 

[SlyBones]

PitBull,



I agree maybe/maybe not.



We do the same thing here. Where I work we tend to make the higher end products. We buy the lower end from a place in the UK. They make it and put our name on it. We sell it. Generally refered to as OEM'ing. -- Sears does that with just about everything. Kenmore Washers and Dryers I believe are made by Whirlpool for example.



In the end we would need to know if billet shafts are custom made items created to vendor specs, or more of an off the shelf item that places like ATS and DTT can just OEM the things with their name on it. -- Would also depend on how the original contracts were created. If for example ATS designs a shaft and gets SlyBones inc, to build it. Part of the agreement would be I cant build this for anyone else, and I cant disclose any details. In this case DTT would have to create its own design and SlyBones inc would have to build each to each companies specs. However if ATS came to SlyBones inc, and said will you design this for us and I do the design. I may have part of the agreement that I retain rights to the intellectual property. After some period of time specified in the agreement I may have the rights to now sell this same design to other vendors as well. Now I would be into the OEM game. -- Like you say, will probably never know.

 

[KatDiesel]

Originally posted by work2muchplay2little

James rebuilt my auto in June, I decided to go with the billet shafts and hub too. I switched from a 91%TC to a 89%Race TC this time and like the change. What TC are you going with? I'll hope to meet you at DynoDay next month.

93% race TC... ... Bill and Stefan both think with my 4. 10 gears and DD camshaft... ... I''ll love it. I hope they are right. I currently have a 91% regular TC. Barring any catastrophic event during the transmission overhaul Floor It and myself will be at the dyno day (in my truck).

 

[steve marshall]

Finding out the truth is actually quite easy since we are the manufacturer. Our integrity is not for sale. The shafts that we produce for Diesel Transmission Technology belong exclusively to them. The tooling to produce these shafts also belong to them since special tooling is required. As for the specs of the input shaft and hub, they also belong to Diesel Transmission Technologies.



Don Ramer of ATS asked to buy these input shafts and hubs. We requested a drawing of specifications and material type and no drawing was ever submitted.



We at TCS have a full machine shop which is ISO9002 approved. We can build anything you can think of. But it is unethical to sell one man's products to his competitor. We will not stoop to that level.

 

[Strick-9]

Wow!



So, John.



Did you make that up or did someone lie to you? Because one way or another someone has been lying. The members of the TDR deserve the truth for once.



-Chris

 

[JConley]

Yup and they got the truth thanks to Steve.



Was my statement incorrect?? YES In fact I just got off the phone with my source and confirmed it. Based on the information I had at the time, (and was told) I went with what I knew. In this case the situation changed.



Will I be wrong again?? YES I am human, and I feel no disregard stating when I am wrong.



Chris

Your statement indicates that there have been lies and intentional dishonesty. I have no idea what you are talking about, so if you could possibly go into some detail about this, I would be quite interested in what you have to say.



Forgot to mention. Billet shafts are an "option" at ATS. I didnt need them, so I didnt feel like paying for them.

 

[Strick-9]

So who is this source of yours? Is this the same guy that told you that Bill was lighting fires in trashcans at Muncie trying to burn down the ATS booth and running away from them laughing?



How many times are you going to believe these lying 'sources' of yours?



-Chris

 

[work2muchplay2little]

It looks like we're fixin' to have a good old fashioned Texas brawl here - maybe it's time you two took this out to the TDR parking lot?!:-{}

 

[JConley]

Chris. .

No. . Actually that was another source now that you mention it. Is it true? Dont know, I wasnt there, but it is what I heard, and I told the story to you as I would any other person that I considered to be a trusted friend of mine. (you have to admit... it is a good story) I guess I was wrong for doing so, as you just proved.



Chris you have a lot of talent and potential and I respect your knowledge, but I am bothered by your constant search for fault in both my transmission and ATS. I have talked to you about my experience with ATS, and let you ride in my truck to provide any insite as to what ATS is doing. I figured you could learn something, and I was happy to help in any way I could. Just as you have full trust in Bill, (as I do also) I also have full trust in ATS to address any problems I have down the road.



At this point I have lost all trust in you, and I wish you well. I value my friends, and it really bothers me that something as stupid as transmission vendors could get in the way of that trust. Dont we all have the same common interest? As I have told you before, I am very happy with what I bought, and If it blows up I will say so. I really dont care if you think I got screwed, because it is my money.



Work 2 much. . I tried taking this off line by Calling Chris on his cell phone, and I sent him a PM with my home phone number. I have yet to get a responce, and at this point it wouldnt matter if I did. I have a knife to take out of my back...

 

[danandamy]

SIGH

Alas, another transmission thread turned ugle by page 2 (and this one was started by a moderator) I actually get a kick out of these threads but I think some of us take them way too seriously. I love my truck but if it died tomorrow and I had to drive something else it wouldn't be then end of the world. Take a step back and let's all remember, it our ride, maybe even our hobby but it's NOT our life.



dan

once again the voice of reason