Buy Back / Lemon Law Experience

[SSage]

Well, after many attempts DC and their dealer Palmer Dodge has failed to fix our A/C problem. After 10 months and 13. 5K, we have had an A/C that shuts down after about an hour of driving. The last fix lasted longer, about three hours. It stopped cooling when I hit Atlanta's 285 loop coming from Alabama. It really got sticky quick with it raining at about 89 to 92 degrees.



Although it actually "shocked the service department" I think they understand I expect the A/C to work when I want it too. The y have been trying to fix it and they have been good about putting us in a rental car. I would rather the truck be repaired, but they have exhausted their fixes and don't understand why it keeps failing. The thing blows very cold at first and then the air warms and stops flowing 100%. It still makes the blower noise, but nothing comes out of the vents unless you turn the temp control to heat. It acts like its icing up.



The dealer called and said we would have to agree to a new truck. I'm not sure what that means yet. I have a bunch of stuff on this truck, which is probably going to be a problem getting them to deal with.



Has anyone had a buy back experience? I've been reading my states lemon law info. I presume a buy back is more better for us? I haven't added it up, but this truck has about 12K in $$$$'s payments and extras already paid for. Does the loan get paid off during a buy back? Is it based on purchase price or current value? We have a very nice interest rate. I would hate for a higher one.



The dealer said it would be a new deal, I would get the $2500 rebate and pay about 500 less than I did before which was 41K even, which included the Mopar step bars. I know thats not a great price, its only about 7K off list. I would hope that the dealer could just return the full purchase price, but, can I go for the interest too for the 10 months?



Advice please. I need some, I can't tell if the sales department is being fair or not. They did find a truck with the exact options and color, I actually don't want black again..... I haven't told them that yet. We went with black because thats what was available at the time in the Sport Laramie :{

 

[Bertram65]

I had a Camaro lemon law deal in '95 after 9 months, all I had to pay was the miles I put on. They reimbursed me the origional cost plus sales tax and alarm I had put in. They charged me $0. 10 a mile, I had 9K on it so I paid $900, that's it. I recently had a friend who had a similar experience with a Ford F250 6L buyback, same deal but I think the mileage was more like $0. 25 a mile, he had a crazy stereo also, they gave him close $2500 extra for it.

 

[Summit]

first off try another dealer.

second as far as "buybacks" or "replacements" go rebates do NOT apply. you get back purchase price plus extras but you must have receipts.

basically if they told you rebates would apply then they are going to trade you out with a mileage penalty, otherwise they charge a usage fee which is a % of the purchase.

i think it's purchase price 41,$$$ X 120,000 div. by odometer.



lots easier to try another dealer first.

 

[sbrennan007]

I had a buyback through Ford (yes I bought a 6. 0 diesel, but I have since learned my lesson) and it was a strait MSRP for MSRP. It makes no difference what you paid for it.





As mentioned, they will reimburse you for anything and everything you have receipts for. You will get a newer vehicle, but usually the base price of the truck goes up from when you bought the first one.



Sometimes they will charge you for milage, but you can try and negotiate out of this with them.



Again as mentioned before, try another dealer, or consult an atty. An atty will take a lemon law case at no cost to you.



I was able to work with the dealer / Ford rep and would recommend this to you first.

 

[JWChessell]

Ditto about talking to an atty. If the truck costs approx $ 40K, an atty familiar with lemon law procedures will probably save you 10% or more, and the atty's fee, even IF you have to pay it, will undoubtedly be less than $4,000.

 

[SSage]

I can't find a dealer that will work on it once they see the trucks history. DC looks at it as Palmer's problem. The dealer north of me said they would never get paid to repair it unless I was from out of state and they probably would only throw parts at it, which has been done. The truck is getting worn out by the techs, they already had to fix a dash squeak. Plus, everything has been replaced, more than one tech has worked on it too. The service manager says he can't replace any more parts, none left so they claim. Obviously he is missing something, so is DC. I would like a dealer to fix it, I sure wish I new of one that wouldn't say to take it back to Palmer. I don't want to drive an hour for service either.



I don't understand how the A/C could stump them after replacing all the major items. I also have all the vibration issues, the steering wheel can numb your hands, the truck droans like my little 1500 with the loud Flowmaster 3" to 4" system. She growls too. I was going to just live with it until the A/C screwed up, which gave me a reason to take it in. I got the dealer to test drive it, they hear/feel the vibrations thank goodness. What really bothers me is that I expected a better truck than what I got and I'm not hard to please, little squeaks and vibrations don't matter, its the loud ones I don't like. The shudder at take off and such is getting worse. It drove much better when new, the trans has gotten louder. I really don't want the 6 speed either, too much traffic.



If some one knows of a dealer willing to work on it in the Atlanta metro area I'll try them.

 

[Summit]

Originally posted by Summit otherwise they charge a usage fee which is a % of the purchase.

i think it's purchase price 41,$$$ X 120,000 div. by odometer



oop's i mean 41,000 div by 120,000 X mileage



my mileage penalty on my 03 was; 41,005 div, 120,000 X 10,000= $3333. 75 + difference of msrp's ($70. 00)

it was a big headache to go through. if you like the truck i would still suggest a different dealer.

 

[SSage]

Originally posted by sbrennan007

I had a buyback through Ford (yes I bought a 6. 0 diesel, but I have since learned my lesson) and it was a strait MSRP for MSRP. It makes no difference what you paid for it.





As mentioned, they will reimburse you for anything and everything you have receipts for. You will get a newer vehicle, but usually the base price of the truck goes up from when you bought the first one.



Sometimes they will charge you for mileage, but you can try and negotiate out of this with them.



Again as mentioned before, try another dealer, or consult an atty. An atty will take a lemon law case at no cost to you.



I was able to work with the dealer / Ford rep and would recommend this to you first.

I'll find out soon about Palmers solution. The sales man called for the payoff amount, he left a message. I guess something is happening, maybe they will work this out. I'm sure they would like to get this truck gone and out of their misery. They must have given up, they found an exact replacement truck and claim they want to get us in it this week. My concern is the 13. 5K miles, but I've been having problems with the A/C since it was like two months old. I forgot about the extended care thing, that added almost 1K to the bill. I wanted an 04. 5 anyway, right?

 

[RCapehart]

[QUOTE

Advice please. I need some, I can't tell if the sales department is being fair or not. They did find a truck with the exact options and color, I actually don't want black again..... I haven't told them that yet. We went with black because thats what was available at the time in the Sport Laramie :{ [/B][/QUOTE]



DC bought back from me a 95 CTD 2500 set up just like my 96. I think it depends a lot on how the factory rep is to work with. I delt with the factory rep not the dealer. I consulted a lemon law atty and then called the factory rep. He was a jerk at first. I did not back down and told him I was going to go ahead and drop all of my paper work at the atty's office. I save everything!



I settled for $0. 10 a mile for the millage I had on it. I showed him my reciepts for all of my ad ons but told him I wanted the 96 set up the same as the 95. He had me get new estimates(it was more than what I had paid for topper & fiberglass boards, bug shield and more the first time) and then wrote me a check for $2200. 00 to cover it.



It was a easy switch after the factory rep's mood changed.



Ron

 

[SSage]

I understand we have two options, one with no miles which sounds fair. Except he did not explain how the new loan works terms wise, I guess its a new loan at current rates. The one he talked about was an even buy out as long as we buy a new truck exactly the same as long as we don't do the lemon law route.



I presume the second involves miles with no new Dodge. I don't trust the Ford engine and the GM product is not an option, so Dodge is the only choice for us anyway. I was surprised, but if I understand correct, he said he would match the same price of the 03 plus the rebate which he said is $2,500. I got a good amount off the 03 with little effort plus the $2,000 rebate, business, farm, returning customer discounts low interest rate and a couple other things I can't remember. Looking at the numbers, we paid about 39K for the actual truck with another 2K in extras installed. The price is now supposed to be lower due to the larger rebate 2K verses 2. 5K. I'm sure there is some bad news somewhere... . or maybe not. I cringe at the thought of removing the aux. tank and tool box.



I hope they will do it or just fix my A/C, I can live with the vibrations.

 

[DocDetonancour]

A buddy got a new truck from DC and they didn't care how many miles he had driven. They replaced his add on's and away he went with a new truck. Good luck, Doc

 

[GCross]

I have known a few people here in CA that got screwed on Lemon buy backs. It might benefit you to pay a few hundred buck to a Lemon Law Attorney in GA to get the straight scoop instead of relying on information here from people in different states which may not be applicable in GA. The Lemon Law is not federal it is a state law and the rules vary.

 

[Sherman]

problem

Originally posted by SSage

I can't find a dealer that will work on it once they see the trucks history. DC looks at it as Palmer's problem. The dealer north of me said they would never get paid to repair it unless I was from out of state and they probably would only throw parts at it, which has been done. The truck is getting worn out by the techs, they already had to fix a dash squeak. Plus, everything has been replaced, more than one tech has worked on it too. The service manager says he can't replace any more parts, none left so they claim. Obviously he is missing something, so is DC. I would like a dealer to fix it, I sure wish I new of one that wouldn't say to take it back to Palmer. I don't want to drive an hour for service either.



I don't understand how the A/C could stump them after replacing all the major items. I also have all the vibration issues, the steering wheel can numb your hands, the truck droans like my little 1500 with the loud Flowmaster 3" to 4" system. She growls too. I was going to just live with it until the A/C screwed up, which gave me a reason to take it in. I got the dealer to test drive it, they hear/feel the vibrations thank goodness. What really bothers me is that I expected a better truck than what I got and I'm not hard to please, little squeaks and vibrations don't matter, its the loud ones I don't like. The shudder at take off and such is getting worse. It drove much better when new, the trans has gotten louder. I really don't want the 6 speed either, too much traffic.



If some one knows of a dealer willing to work on it in the Atlanta metro area I'll try them.

Yoy say it's the dealer's problem according to what you say,I believe it's DC 's problem to satisfy you the owner,the dealer is following DC's commands,if your finance package is through Chrysler then I would make that part of the package to resolve the problem,a replacement truck to match what you have with the existing finance transfered to the new vehicle including any extra warranty that you purchased minus milage that is on your present vehicle(negotiate a fair cost per mile). Any thing less than that is not acceptable. Remember if both parties want to resolve this situation it will happen,DC doesn't want to involve lawyers any more than you do so stick to your guns and git er done!!!!

 

[SSage]

After sleeping another night on it, we are going to push for another dealer to trouble shoot the A/C. I really would hate to move all my stuff over to a new truck. I don't like the 04. 5 year choice either. I would probably end up having vibration problems again. Then again, this 03 has a clunk in the drivetrain thats getting worse, which the dealer can't find yet. I figure its a u-joint or TQ. Happens only when it shifts or when you change directions with some power. It also clunks when you first put it in gear, they say its normal. I don't know, I've only driven in two. One did it... mine.

 

[randyn]

If I had "clunks" & vibrations, I'd go for the new truck. Get the color & trans you now want, and get them to switch out the tank & tool box as part of the deal.



RandyN

 

[truckstom]

I would switch also... from what you've said, there's more going to happen to that truck.

Do what randyn said... get them to swap everything over as part of the deal







my 2 coins.....

 

[SSage]

I need an auto trans, its the main reason I test drove a Ford last time. I think the 48RE auto is still the same, right? So, that wouldn't matter much. If DC would give us a good auto they would sell much more trucks. This is an all around family rig, so its run in traffic and city streets often.



We going to send off our letter to DC and see what happens first. The dealer only has one truck left they can trade for or only one they can find left with our options. I think ordering an 05 would be a smart thing to do. I want a good noise free truck if I do a buy back. Shouldn't they have less problems like droan? Thats the 3rd year of this body style I think, at least the 2nd diesel run... .....

 

[sag2]

Here is the text of the Georgia lemon law concerning manufacturer and customer obligations. No need to waste money on an attorney, just print the law and review it. Both of you have certain obligations, but all are negotiable. Regardless of what they tell you, an attorney can get you no more than the law allows.



If you really want it fixed, and they do, ask for a service contract (or refund if you have one) or a months payment for your inconvenience.



I found this at http://www2.state.ga.us/GaOCA/lemonlaw.htm



10-1-784. Nonrepair of vehicle; contractual obligations between lessor and consumer; replacement of vehicle; attempts to correct nonconformity; duration of lemon law rights period; liability of dealer or distributor; enforcement of violations; election of remedies; effect of article on dealer franchise or distributor agreement.



(a) (1) If the manufacturer, its agent, or the new motor vehicle dealer is unable to repair or correct any nonconformity in a new motor vehicle after a reasonable number of attempts, the consumer shall notify the manufacturer by certified mail, return receipt requested, at the address provided by the manufacturer. The manufacturer shall, within seven days after receipt of such notification, notify the consumer of a reasonably accessible repair facility and after delivery of the vehicle to the designated repair facility by the consumer, the manufacturer shall, within 14 days, conform the motor vehicle to the warranty. If the manufacturer is unable to repair or correct any nonconformity of the new motor vehicle, the manufacturer shall, within 30 days of the consumer's written request, by certified mail, return receipt requested, at the option of the consumer, or the lessor in the event of a leased motor vehicle, replace or repurchase the new motor vehicle. If the manufacturer fails to notify the consumer of a reasonably accessible repair facility or perform the repairs within the time periods prescribed in this subsection, the requirement that the manufacturer be given a final attempt to cure the nonconformity does not apply.



(2) If a lessor elects replacement, the contractual obligation, except for those terms of the agreement which identify the vehicle, between the lessor and the consumer shall not be altered. If a lessor elects repurchase, it shall return to the consumer a sum equal to the allowance for any trade-in, and down payment or initial balloon payment, made by the consumer, and all future obligations of the consumer to the lessor shall cease. In the event a lessor elects to require the manufacturer to repurchase a leased vehicle, the consumer will remain liable for all lease obligations arising prior to the date that the lessor elects such replacement, but will have no future obligations under the lease, and will be liable for no penalty for early termination. A lessor must elect either a repurchase or replacement within 30 days of receiving written notice from the consumer that such an election is desired; if the lessor fails to make such an election within the 30 days, the consumer may make the election to repurchase or replace and the lessor shall be bound by the consumer's election.



(3) The replacement motor vehicle shall be identical or reasonably equivalent to the motor vehicle to be replaced. Such replacement shall include payment of all collateral charges which the consumer or lessor will incur a second time which would not have been incurred again except for the replacement, and any and all incidental costs incurred by the consumer or lessor. In the case of a replacement motor vehicle, the reasonable offset for use shall be paid by the consumer to the manufacturer. Compensation for a reasonable offset for use shall be paid by the consumer to the manufacturer in the event that a replacement motor vehicle is elected. In the case of a lease where the consumer either has no option to purchase the motor vehicle at the end of the lease term, or the consumer has an option to purchase the motor vehicle at the end of the lease term but does not exercise the option, the lessor shall refund to the consumer the lesser of (A) the offset for use paid by the consumer to the manufacturer at the time of delivery of the replacement vehicle, or (B) the gain realized by the lessor by reason of the difference, if any, between the anticipated residual value of the original motor vehicle as determined at the inception of the lease and the realized value of the replacement motor vehicle at the end of the lease. If the lessor does not realize any gain from the disposition of the replacement vehicle, there will be no refund due to the consumer from the lessor. The foregoing rules apply only to leases where the consumer performs all of the consumer's obligations under the lease agreement and the lease terminates upon the scheduled expiration of the lease term as set forth in the lease agreement or any mutually agreed upon extension of the lease term. The administrator may provide by rule under Chapter 13 of Title 50, the "Georgia Administrative Procedure Act," for determining the manner of calculating the amount of any further charges or refunds that may apply in the case of leases terminated prematurely either by the voluntary election of the parties, or involuntarily by the lessor in the event of the lessee's default, the loss or destruction of the vehicle, or for any other reason.



(4) When repurchasing the new motor vehicle, the manufacturer shall refund to the consumer all collateral charges and incidental costs. In the event of a repurchase, purchase price refunds shall be made to the consumer and lienholder of record, if any, as his or her interests may appear, less a reasonable offset for use. In the event of a lease, purchase price refunds shall be made to the lessor, less a reasonable offset for use. If it is determined that the lessee is entitled to a refund, the consumer's lease agreement with the lessor shall be terminated upon payment of the refund and no penalty for early termination shall be assessed.



(b) A reasonable number of attempts shall be presumed as a matter of law to have been undertaken by the manufacturer, its agent, or the new motor vehicle dealer to repair or correct any nonconformity of a new motor vehicle, if: (1) a serious safety defect in the braking or steering system has been subject to repair at least once during the lemon law rights period and has not been corrected; (2) during any period of 24 months or less, or during any period in which the vehicle has been driven 24,000 miles or less, whichever occurs first, any other serious safety defect has been subject to repair two or more times, at least one of which is during the lemon law rights period, and the nonconformity continues to exist; (3) during any period of 24 months or less or during any period in which the vehicle has been driven 24,000 miles or less, whichever occurs first, the same nonconformity has been subject to repair, three or more times, at least one of which is during the lemon law rights period, and the nonconformity continues to exist; or (4) during any period of 24 months or less or during any period in which the vehicle has been driven 24,000 miles or less, whichever occurs first, the vehicle is out of service by reason of repair of one or more nonconformities for a cumulative total of 30 calendar days, at least 15 of them during the lemon law rights period. If less than 15 days remain under the lemon law rights period when the new motor vehicle is first brought in for diagnosis or repair, the lemon law rights period as regards the problem to be diagnosed or repaired shall be extended for a period of 90 days.



(c) For purposes of this article, the lemon law rights period regarding nonconformities on all new motor vehicles sold in this state shall be for 12 months following the purchase of the vehicle or for 12,000 miles following the purchase of the vehicle, whichever occurs first.

 

[sag2]

Sorry, too long. Here is the rest.





(d) This article shall not create and shall not give rise to any cause of action against and shall not impose any liability upon any new motor vehicle dealer or distributor except as provided in this Code section. No new motor vehicle dealer or distributor shall be held liable by the manufacturer or by the consumer for any collateral charges, damages, costs, purchase price refunds, or vehicle replacements, and manufacturers and consumers shall not have a cause of action against a new motor vehicle dealer or distributor under this article. A violation of any duty or responsibility imposed upon a new motor vehicle dealer or distributor under this article shall constitute a per se violation of Code Section 10-1-393; provided, however, that enforcement against such violations shall be by public enforcement by the administrator and shall not be enforceable through private enforcement under the provisions of Code Section 10-1-399, except that a knowing violation of Code Section 10-1-785 shall be enforceable through private enforcement under the provisions of Code Section 10-1-399. The provisions of Code Sections 11-2-602 through 11-2-609 shall not apply to the sale of a new motor vehicle if the consumer seeks to use the remedies provided for in this article. A consumer shall be deemed to have used the remedies provided for in this article when he or she completes, signs, and returns forms prescribed by the administrator for the submission of disputes to an informal dispute resolution settlement mechanism or to a panel, whichever occurs first. Such forms shall contain a conspicuous statement clearly advising the consumer of the rights the consumer is waiving by participating in the procedures under this article. A consumer may not use the remedies provided for in this article if the consumer has already sought to use the remedies provided for in Code Sections 11-2-602 through 11-2-609, unless the nonconformity did not exist or was not known at the time of using the remedies provided for in such Code sections. Manufacturers and consumers may not make new motor vehicle dealers or distributors parties to arbitration panel proceedings or any other proceedings under this article. The provisions of this article shall not impair any obligation under any manufacturer-dealer franchise agreement or manufacturer-distributor agreement; provided, however, that any provision of any manufacturer-dealer franchise agreement or manufacturer-distributor agreement which attempts to shift any duty, obligation, responsibility, or liability imposed upon a manufacturer by this article to a new motor vehicle dealer or distributor, either directly or indirectly, shall be void and unenforceable, except for any liability imposed upon a manufacturer by this article which is directly caused by the gross negligence of the dealer in attempting to repair the motor vehicle after such gross negligence has been determined by the hearing officer, as provided in Article 22 of this chapter, the "Georgia Motor Vehicle Franchise Practices Act. "



(Code 1981, § 10-1-784, enacted by Ga. L. 1990, p. 1013, § 1; Ga. L. 1991, p. 94, § 10. )

 

[SSage]

Thanks, I'm writing the letter now and sending it to the address in the owners manual. I think the dealer wants to put this one on their car lot and let us take the hit on a new one. The dealer would not give a straight answerer on their intentions. No $ figures, they just say no mileage. I think they tell you what you want to hear and then expect you to loose money on what seems to me as a simple trade with an extra good sale price. Some buy back! I won't take a huge hit, can't afford it.