Concealed carry situation--What would you do?

[daveshoe]

I recently attended a CCW class given by a small town cop. Good class that made you think about what to do or not to do in certain situations,Here is an example

Some nut-case you do not know is standing in front of your house. He is screaming threats to Ralph [no-one named Ralph lives here], and is about to throw a flaming bottle at your picture window. We

will assume this bottle is the only bottle in his possession that you can see. Your family is inside,and there are witnesses outside across the street. First variation is there are no witnesses,second variation is the nut-case has just thrown the bottle,and your house is on fire,and third variation is thrown bottle and no witnesses.

You have a loaded . 357 in your hand. Briefly describe a course of action that you might take to defend your family,according to the laws of the State of Ohio.

Have fun!!

 

[fkovalski]

Scenerio 1:

This is a clear case where gun control is needed! (i. e. hitting your target) You do not want to put yourself in the situation where you would need to reload. If 1 round can resolve the situation to disable it would be ideal. I believe that the argument could be made that your family is in imminent danger.



Scenerio 2:

Primary concern is the family- get 'em out of the house... then refer to answer above if the whacko is still present. Shoot to disable, not kill (assuminh he has no fire arm. )



Scenerio3: Is the house on fire? if so follow answer #2.

 

[BILLVO]

Shoot the lit bottle in his hand and let him feel the pain of his own soon to be action. then go out and fan the flames.

 

[Pawpaw]

I don't know anything about Ohio laws, but in Texas you don't need a concealed carry permit on your own property.



As for me, If I see him draw back as if to throw that bottle, I'm going to start putting holes in him. Aim center mass to "stop the threat". I will keep shooting until the threat is indeed stopped. That could mean him lying on the ground, or that could mean that he drops the bottle. I'm going to keep making holes until one of those two things happen.



If he has just thrown the bottle, he has committed vandalism. In Texas, that also is justification for the use of lethal force. He isn't going to leave under his own power.



Bob

 

[NVR FNSH]

If he has just thrown the bottle, he has committed vandalism. In Texas, that also is justification for the use of lethal force.

Are you positive vandalism falls under the TX law allowing deadly force in response to criminal mischief at night? I don't know TX law well enough to know for sure.



Brian

 

[Jong]

If he has just thrown the bottle, he has committed vandalism. In Texas, that also is justification for the use of lethal force. He isn't going to leave under his own power.



Bob

I would say in this case he has committed more than just vandalism... more like arson with the potential for manslaughter or second degree murder. Definitely justifiable for use of deadly force.

 

[d906670]

A flaming bottle would be arson, and arson of an occupied dwelling is a felony.

 

[Signal73]

Yell out the window "Ralph lives 2 doors down":-laf

 

[d90boy]

In missouri deadly force is justifiable in the defense of the destruction of your home. It is not justifiable in the protection of any other property. So here you would be justified in all those scenarios although some would be harder to defend than others.

 

[Schlickenmeyer]

Well, firstly "shoot to disable" is not gonna happen. With the police miss rate at 89% in my state and similar nationally, no one in their right mind would try this nonsense. Legally in MN if you are not justified to use deadly force and do that than that would be a major felony. And if justified, as said above, you stop a threat. You should also follow an escalation of force model for ethical, legal and other reasons.

Witnesses are irrelevant.

If the house is on fire than forget the wacko and get out the other door if possible, if you have to go out front, then you get him on the ground at gunpoint as you would have a reasonable fear for your family, and wait for the cops. Sorry I do not know Ohio law, But I have been an instructor of this for a long time in MN.



Have a whacko free day!

 

[daytripper63]

I don't know anything about Ohio laws, but in Texas you don't need a concealed carry permit on your own property.



As for me, If I see him draw back as if to throw that bottle, I'm going to start putting holes in him. Aim center mass to "stop the threat". I will keep shooting until the threat is indeed stopped. That could mean him lying on the ground, or that could mean that he drops the bottle. I'm going to keep making holes until one of those two things happen.



If he has just thrown the bottle, he has committed vandalism. In Texas, that also is justification for the use of lethal force. He isn't going to leave under his own power.



Bob

Makes me want to move to TEXAS :-laf

 

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

Shoot him in front of the house, drag him in the house, kick in your own front door, clean the blood up outside and call the police. He broke in and you defended yourself.

 

[barbwire]

I recently attended a CCW class given by a small town cop. Good class that made you think about what to do or not to do in certain situations,Here is an example

Some nut-case you do not know is standing in front of your house. He is screaming threats to Ralph [no-one named Ralph lives here], and is about to throw a flaming bottle at your picture window. We

will assume this bottle is the only bottle in his possession that you can see. Your family is inside,and there are witnesses outside across the street. First variation is there are no witnesses,second variation is the nut-case has just thrown the bottle,and your house is on fire,and third variation is thrown bottle and no witnesses.

You have a loaded . 357 in your hand. Briefly describe a course of action that you might take to defend your family,according to the laws of the State of Ohio.

Have fun!!

OK, Whats your answer?

 

[SHobbs]

In Texas as far as vandalism is concerned you can use deadly force at night, only at night time. The reason is that you do not know if the person is armed. You will get slammed with a civil suit afterwards that could wipe you out.



If someone is in your driveway breaking into your car, slashing your tires etc, etc, deadly force can be used.

 

[Pawpaw]

Take another look at Texas law. Theft during the nighttime is justification for use of deadly force.



Vandalism is justification for the use of deadly force. There is no "nighttme" qualifier on vandalism.



Bob

 

[hammersley]

In a lot of States

you are required to EXIT the area - if that is an option... ... I have a hard time with it BUT you had better believe one thing - You Troubles have only started once you're shot someone! Even if it's justified - you had better be sure that shooting is in FACT THE ONLY GOOD OPTION - because while around here talk is cheap - once the gunsmoke clears - Nothing is cheap from there on - and your snap decision will get microanalyzed much more than a play on Monday Night Footballi!



It isn't as easy as the movies make it out.



Often the wierd o's relatives come and sue you for damages and even if you win - You're out the $$$ defending yourself etc.



Shooting is the last resort --

 

[Pawpaw]

After doing a little research, I see my original statement about vandalism was incorrect. Here is the Texas Penal Code for use of deadly force in the protection of property:



Sec. 9. 42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property:

(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9. 41; and

(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:

(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or

(B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and

(3) he reasonably believes that:

(A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or

(B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.

 

[MFalkinham]

I'd just run over the nut-case with my truck.

 

[Duluth Diesel]

I always give 5 warning shots.









3 in the chest, 2 in the head. LOL had you guys going there for a sec.

Check out www.packing.org



-Chuck

 

[The patriot]

I suppose I'd try to tell him Ralph dont live here.

If that didnt work, he'd be dead.



My lesson here is:

Do what you have to do to make your family safe. Worry about the law later.



Having said that... I live in NJ, so I'd be getting 15-20 with good behavior.