DC had better get on the ball.......

[WStoops]

How did you fix your launch shudder? Mine has it, but it only happens on occasion when empty, but always when loaded. Dealer drove truck for 15 miles stop and go, and it never did it of course. I can't keep *****ing if they don't find the problem. One day I'll show up with a trailer and go for another ride with them. Otherwise, the truck has been great, ( had the vibration repaired by replacing rear axle assembly) and no other problems, at 24K now.



04. 5 600/325 48RE 4X4 Q/C, SRW,S/B 4:10 anti spin, tow/plow

Hey Scott. The engineer in the LL hearing yesterday said that he has inspected 10 trucks with the vibration/drone/ launch shudder. He states they are all due to the high pinion angles. Various manifestations of the same problem. Wayne

 

[DKarvwnaris]

Hey Scott. The engineer in the LL hearing yesterday said that he has inspected 10 trucks with the vibration/drone/ launch shudder. He states they are all due to the high pinion angles. Various manifestations of the same problem. Wayne

WOW!!! someone actually is citing the true cause of the issue? Is the engineer a DC employee or independent? Numerous shops I have worked at in the past have corrected the pinion hop and shake issue quite easily, its trying to get the dealers to do it that is the problem.



I have corrected trucks with the pinion hop issue in numerous applications of lifted trucks as well as stock height. A few Dodges required little more than degree shims to correct the issue. The majority of dealers will list the degree shims as aftermarket parts and not allow them or list them on the service order that the truck has been modified from stock and therefore has lost coverage to the effected system. This is a really bad position to be in as a truck owner if you have warranty left on it to cover it, yet know the shims have corrected the problem. If you have given up on warranty coverage and can not enact a lemon law to your truck, I would then elect to shim the drive axle down a little. Hope this helps, typically a 1. 5 to 2 degree shim will do it.

 

[SHobbs]

They have not been on the ball for 10yrs. Finally they step up and offer a full 4 door then at the same time they take themselves out of 2 markets. They have the mega cab finally and it will not be available in an 8ft box and DRW. Talk about dumb. I wish I could paid as well as they do and be so out of touch.

 

[DPKetchum]

Not defending THEM but the auto makers look long and hard at what to produce. I inquired about why not a FOUR door 10 plus years back. DC. higher ups said that the market surveys were poor at that time for a four door. I said but FORDS got them. They(He)said that in the Dallas and Atlanta market the four door thing was good but the rest of the country it was bad. Said not enough reason to justify retooling a entire assembly line for a very small percentage of the market. Thats why the FULL size vans are gone. Once a line drops below a certain percentage its history. Oldsmobile also. Ramchargers long gone here but still very popular in the South American market where they are still produced and sold. Maybe we think they wait a day late and a dollar short and maybe they think let someone else test the waters first. Nissan did that for years behind Toyota and it was on purpose. I know that WE think sometimes these companys are run by a bunch of not in touch big wigs. But in truth more often then not their looking several decades sometimes into the future and future trends. With the deput of new makes the market share gets smaller and smaller for the others and if less then a certain percentace will be sold they can it or just plain won't retool for it.

 

[WStoops]

WOW!!! someone actually is citing the true cause of the issue? Is the engineer a DC employee or independent? Numerous shops I have worked at in the past have corrected the pinion hop and shake issue quite easily, its trying to get the dealers to do it that is the problem.



I have corrected trucks with the pinion hop issue in numerous applications of lifted trucks as well as stock height. A few Dodges required little more than degree shims to correct the issue. The majority of dealers will list the degree shims as aftermarket parts and not allow them or list them on the service order that the truck has been modified from stock and therefore has lost coverage to the effected system. This is a really bad position to be in as a truck owner if you have warranty left on it to cover it, yet know the shims have corrected the problem. If you have given up on warranty coverage and can not enact a lemon law to your truck, I would then elect to shim the drive axle down a little. Hope this helps, typically a 1. 5 to 2 degree shim will do it.

State employee assigned to the Lemon Law program. Intelligent, thoughtful, knowledgeable, capable guy. In fact, everyone I met at the lemon law hearing was a state employee and very professional and capable. Nice to see my tax dollars working so effectively.

 

[ERohloff]

IMHO suspect you will see a LB and DRW in the MegaCab next year or the following. It's a big deal to launch a new bodystyle and since the existing MegaCab style is based on an existing frame setup (QC LB) it was the quickest to market. A LB MCab will require a new length frame - Much more difficult to do but suspect it's coming

... ... . And if you look at some other the other big three new syle changes you see the same "tiptoe into the water" approach for marketing and logistic reasons.

bob r...

 

[jsimpson]

that's all I want. American owned, American produced, Amercian bought, American used, and American accountability!!

-That's why I bought a Tundra, made in USA, with engine made in Alabama. When Toyota makes an American built 1 ton, I'll trade my 03 RAM in on it. Until then, I'll keep my 03.

 

[vagabond1]

To Mikempv,
Keep watching the TV commercials, Honda has a 1/2 ton coming soon.
If the Japanese learn from the Isuzu Duramax, You can expect a 1 ton not to far in the future. But all that will do is change the marketshare of the Big 3, not their attitude. They will simply compensate with cheaper products.

 

[wild4stangs]

45k and not one warranty repair... Very happy with my 03...

 

[WStoops]

To Mikempv,

Keep watching the TV commercials, Honda has a 1/2 ton coming soon.

If the Japanese learn from the Isuzu Duramax, You can expect a 1 ton not to far in the future. But all that will do is change the marketshare of the Big 3, not their attitude. They will simply compensate with cheaper products.

I just saw the new Honda 1/2 ton. It's called the Ridgeline. I was at the Honda dealer looking at an Accord for the little woman and they had just gotten in the first one that day. It was in the service bay and the sales guy took me out there to see it. Really Japanese looking on the inside. The seat was uncomfortable compared to my Laramie. The back seat folds up and has storage under it. No load floor though. (wonder where they got that idea) The tailgate is quite nice though. It opens like ours do but also like a door, and it has a trunk under the pickup floor. It's deep and wide, waterproof too. What a great idea. The bed is part of the cab and not a separate piece. It's short too, looking to be around 5 ft. It sweeps up as it nears the back window. Good ground clearance, V6 of around 250 hp as I recall. EPA mileage was 21 HWY if I recall correctly. It had everything on it and had a sticker of $41,000+. I do not see this as a threat to any of the big 3, 1/2 tons. They have a lot to learn before they make even a dent in that market.

 

[mikepvg]

I hope they learn quickly... . I'm sitting here w/ my thumb up my arse (2nd day) waiting for the dealer to replace one or more injectors. Meanwhile, clients keep calling me & some are not too happy that I can not provide the service that has set my business apart from all others, because my brand new CTD is down for repairs w/ less than 8K on the clock.



When I dropped my CTD off Mon morn, I inquired about loaners. You only get a loaner reimbursement up to $35/day IF you buy the extended warr plan. How much is that? Only $1850. 00 for 7yr-70K or $2,250 for a 5yr-100K ... . Then they said to get a like replacement vehicle (p/u) I would still have to pay at least $15-$20 per day on top of that. I wonder how far they think I'm gonna bend over?



C'mon Toyota & Honda, why the heck are you afraid to take on the big 3 in the light duty mkt? Seems like easy pickings to me.....

 

[DPKetchum]

I posted this a while back but any way. This injector thing is like deja vu. I went through almost all thats being posted about injectors back in 1975 through 1980 with Datsun/Nissan when EFI first came into the scene. Even the Bosch injectors. (they also dropped Bosch)Took the FUEL makers and injectors about 5 years for them to catch up. The symptons,carbon on the tips,fuel filter discussions etc. Almost at times word for word. Even the waiting game to have them shipped after jumping through hoops to get approvals etc. Maybe this will happen sooner as back then no destroyed engines,just poor running,no power,backfiring through the intakes etc.

 

[mikepvg]

Thats very interesting... . same problems as before... . history repeating itself...



From all the discussions here, the new injectors are NOT compatible w/ the current fuel available everywhere. It will take years for the fuel to be cleaned up and or changed from the refiners. It seems the best immediate answer is to implement a sub 2 micron fuel filtering system on our CTD. I have not read any threads regarding an easy economical fix to that yet. If DC doesn't come up w/ an answer, it'll just keep replacing very expensive injectors on my CTD for the next 7 years... .

 

[DPKetchum]

Back then we would get approval one or two and finally replace the entire set and withen 8 thousand miles or less be in the same deal on the same auto's again. Then the new cleaning machines appeared. They worked but then again it was not a long time cure. Finally in 80 or 81 as well as the Bosch injectors not being used(had ones designed and made by the auto manufacture)all the problems stopped. The manufacture blamed poor fuel quality from the get go.

 

[ceaman]

Here is a response from cummins I recieved about the fuel quality issue



Summary: Toughest Standards Comments



Solution:



Thanks for your Email message.



You are on track when you asked the question "Are there fuel additive packages,

filtration, or other methods that could help reduce wear and increase the

durability of these systems? "



Keeping fuel systems clean with good filtration is key to long life. Also buying

good fuel is key to long life to the fuel system.



Cummins specifies a quality #2 diesel fuel, which does not require additives;

there are exceptions to #2 diesel:



1) Blended winter fuels, which may contain up to 60% #1 diesel and which may be

necessary if you are not equipped with fuel heaters in the filter head and/or

fuel tank; lubricity additives must be used with large percentages of #1 diesel.



2) Use of biocides if the engine/fuel is stored for more than a few weeks, more

than a month

or two, with ambient temperatures greater than 50 deg. F or so.



3) Cetane improvers for low-cetane fuels.



4) Lubricity additives for out of spec fuel that is the only fuel available or

for emergency

use.



5) Pour point or cloud point depressants, if the fuel is not treated with these

additives in winter climates.



Cummins warranty is to cover defects in material and workmanship by the

manufacturer. The actual wording is that "Cummins neither approves or

disapproves the use of any fuel additive, fuel extender, fuel system

modification or the use of any device not manufactured or sold by Cummins, Inc.

or its subsidiaries". This would be after market uprate kits.



"Engine damage, service issues or performance problems that occur due to the use

of these products are NOT considered a defect in workmanship and/or material as

supplied by Cummins and are NOT compensated under the Cummins warranty".



Cummins engines are designed, developed, rated and built to operate on

commercially available No. 2-D diesel fuel; therefore, it is Cummins policy NOT

to recommend fuel additives. In extreme situations, when available fuels are of

poor quality or problems exist which are peculiar to certain operations,

additives can be used; however, Cummins recommends consultation with the fuel

supplier.



The subject "Fuels for Cummins Engines" bulletin is now 3379001, which is

published by Cummins and is available through our Literature Control Service.



Gannett Direct Marketing Services, Inc. in Louisville, Kentucky

(http://www.gdms.com/) handles all Cummins literature. If a payment arrangement

is worked out, by credit card, they can arrange shipment of Cummins literature.

All available literature is listed in Cummins Publications and Training Aids

Catalog (bulletin no. 3379034).



Gannett operators deal in bulletin numbers, so before you call you need to have

all the bulletin numbers ready for the literature you need. If you wish

assistance in determining which bulletin numbers you need, you can obtain help

at your Cummins distributor or by calling 1-800-DIESELS (343-7357), Option 4.



You can reach Gannett's Cummins Literature Order Service by calling

1-800-646-5609 (1-502-454-6660 outside North/Central America), or call

1-800-DIESELS (343-7357) and select the literature option, or E-mail to

"inquiry@gdms.com", or FAX to 1-502-456-6179, or by writing Gannett at:



Gannett Direct Marketing Services, Inc.

3400 ROBARDS CT (LOUISVILLE KY 40218-4544, e. g. , for package delivery)

PO BOX 34470

LOUISVILLE KY 40232-4470

1-800-646-5609 (1-502-454-6660)



We thank you for your interest in Cummins products. Please let us know if you

need assistance in locating the nearest Cummins-authorized Dealer or Distributor

Service Provider. For assistance in locating a Service Provider, feel free to

use Cummins North America Dealer Locator, which can be found on Cummins website:

http://www.cummins.com/service_locator/index.cfm



Please let us know if you have other questions and if away from your computer or

have a time-critical request that needs more urgent attention, feel free to call

us toll-free (from North America) at 1-800-DIESELS (343-7357).



Email direct: -- email address removed --



Regards,

--

Powermaster

Customer Assistance Center

Cummins, Inc.

Columbus, Indiana, USA





Free QuickServe Online for Consumers http://quickserve.cummins.com

 

[jjdiesel]

So much of this starts at the Dealership. I bought my '95 brand new and every time I stepped on the brake the thing would pull me into the ditch. Eight visits to the shop, that's right, 8 visits, and this is my work truck. Never even improved a little. Went to another dealer in town, fixed it in less than 2 hours and since then I have bought two more CTD from them. The service manager is the best... he will go to bat for me with DC. I think the most important thing a guy could do is to develop a relationship with your service manager. Heck, I'm on a first-name basis with a hand-full of mechanics that work on my truck now. Of course, not all of them are easy to get to know, but a little diplomacy can go a long way to help you out. Just my . 02. Because of my service manager, I like DC... . if not for him, I probably would'nt.

 

[mikepvg]

Man... thats interesting info!



Apparently Bosch has been in this boat before & has NOT learned from its mistakes. For everyone that hated history in school (me included) this is one one the reasons to study it. Otherwise, were destined to repeat our mistakes. I'm not impressed w/ Bosch at all... .

 

[AMink]

DC. higher ups said that the market surveys were poor at that time for a four door.

I was told that it had something to do with the gov't bailout of Chrysler that sunk a full sized four door. Apparently, their surveys must have showed that no one wants a full sized SUV, either. Had to buy a Expedition since DC doesn't offer one.



Saw pictures of the Ridgeline. It has some neat features, but MAN, is that thing ugly! It looks like Subaru Brat on steroids!

 

[DPKetchum]

How about asking them about just the injector issues?

 

[vagabond1]

Here is a response from cummins I recieved about the fuel quality issue

Summary: Toughest Standards Comments

Solution:

Thanks for your Email message.

You are on track when you asked the question "Are there fuel additive packages,
filtration, or other methods that could help reduce wear and increase the
durability of these systems? "

Keeping fuel systems clean with good filtration is key to long life. Also buying
good fuel is key to long life to the fuel system.

Cummins specifies a quality #2 diesel fuel, which does not require additives;
there are exceptions to #2 diesel:

1) Blended winter fuels, which may contain up to 60% #1 diesel and which may be
necessary if you are not equipped with fuel heaters in the filter head and/or
fuel tank; lubricity additives must be used with large percentages of #1 diesel.

2) Use of biocides if the engine/fuel is stored for more than a few weeks, more
than a month
or two, with ambient temperatures greater than 50 deg. F or so.

3) Cetane improvers for low-cetane fuels.

4) Lubricity additives for out of spec fuel that is the only fuel available or
for emergency
use.

5) Pour point or cloud point depressants, if the fuel is not treated with these
additives in winter climates.

Cummins warranty is to cover defects in material and workmanship by the
manufacturer. The actual wording is that "Cummins neither approves or
disapproves the use of any fuel additive, fuel extender, fuel system
modification or the use of any device not manufactured or sold by Cummins, Inc.
or its subsidiaries". This would be after market uprate kits.

"Engine damage, service issues or performance problems that occur due to the use
of these products are NOT considered a defect in workmanship and/or material as
supplied by Cummins and are NOT compensated under the Cummins warranty".

Cummins engines are designed, developed, rated and built to operate on
commercially available No. 2-D diesel fuel; therefore, it is Cummins policy NOT
to recommend fuel additives. In extreme situations, when available fuels are of
poor quality or problems exist which are peculiar to certain operations,
additives can be used; however, Cummins recommends consultation with the fuel
supplier.

The subject "Fuels for Cummins Engines" bulletin is now 3379001, which is
published by Cummins and is available through our Literature Control Service.

Gannett Direct Marketing Services, Inc. in Louisville, Kentucky
(http://www.gdms.com/) handles all Cummins literature. If a payment arrangement
is worked out, by credit card, they can arrange shipment of Cummins literature.
All available literature is listed in Cummins Publications and Training Aids
Catalog (bulletin no. 3379034).

Gannett operators deal in bulletin numbers, so before you call you need to have
all the bulletin numbers ready for the literature you need. If you wish
assistance in determining which bulletin numbers you need, you can obtain help
at your Cummins distributor or by calling 1-800-DIESELS (343-7357), Option 4.

You can reach Gannett's Cummins Literature Order Service by calling
1-800-646-5609 (1-502-454-6660 outside North/Central America), or call
1-800-DIESELS (343-7357) and select the literature option, or E-mail to
"inquiry@gdms.com", or FAX to 1-502-456-6179, or by writing Gannett at:

Gannett Direct Marketing Services, Inc.
3400 ROBARDS CT (LOUISVILLE KY 40218-4544, e. g. , for package delivery)
PO BOX 34470
LOUISVILLE KY 40232-4470
1-800-646-5609 (1-502-454-6660)

We thank you for your interest in Cummins products. Please let us know if you
need assistance in locating the nearest Cummins-authorized Dealer or Distributor
Service Provider. For assistance in locating a Service Provider, feel free to
use Cummins North America Dealer Locator, which can be found on Cummins website:
http://www.cummins.com/service_locator/index. cfm

Please let us know if you have other questions and if away from your computer or
have a time-critical request that needs more urgent attention, feel free to call
us toll-free (from North America) at 1-800-DIESELS (343-7357).

Email direct: powermaster@cummins.com

Regards,
--
Powermaster
Customer Assistance Center
Cummins, Inc.
Columbus, Indiana, USA


Free QuickServe Online for Consumers http://quickserve. cummins.com[/QUOTE]
If you check with Cummins, the 04 and up engines are not covered by a Cummins Warranty. This was told to me at a Cummins Power Systems Truck Center. Daimler Chrysler does the warranty.