Different twist on weapons inspections

[RonaldLarson]

Have you neglected YOUR'E therapy session this week? You fuzzy headed liberals need to find a new book to quote from! PS: Bill Clinton isn't president anymore, and Tom "puff" Daschle is history.

Love it or leave it!!!!!

Ron

 

[sdalton]

Illflem, I am not anti-American. Quite the opposite. You need to read my posts more carefully. I just get tired of the same old pinko liberal "I hate America and everything we and our government stands for crowd. What I do agree upon is that we have the right to free speach, and that is what CF and myself are doing. I just dont think that this is the proper time to be putting our leaders and actions down, and for trying to cast doubt on what seems to be inevitable in Iraq. I dont want our young fighting men to go over there thinking they will be dying for an unjust cause, or that they are just pawns, or even that what they might do may not even be morally right.

I guess during Vietnam we had Hanoi Jane, now on the TDR we have our own version of her. She in her innocence underminded our nation, and what our men were fighting for, and today we have many pinkos trying to take her place.



SD

 

[Lhotka]

What this country needs is more "yes men" like Ol' Ron who blindly follow the lead of their nation's leader without question.



"Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not turn from it" Proverbs 22:6



"Stay away from Ol' Ron, for you will not find knowledge on his lips" Proverbs 14:7



Seriously... ... ... . This isn't a liberal verses conservative issue. Many conservatives are also leery about rushing into war with Iraq. The escalating tensions we are having with North Korea (the bigger threat) are a result of the U. S policy towards Iraq. Interesting how Bush is taking a diplomatic approach with North Korea. "War when we can, diplomacy when we have to" seems to be the approach of the Bush administration.

 

[sdalton]

It is also strange how today Yemen is concidered our Allie . This war on the terrorist nations is touchy and very complicated. It seems to me that the world is a large chess game with two players. One player is the U. S. and those who stand behind just and moral acts, and the other player is those who are against democracy, christianity, and anything the U. S. stands for.

Look at the world now and see which countries hate the U. S. , Democracy, and Christianity, and they will more than likely be at war with us, in some fashion or another in the next 50 years.

How much longer will China try to stay neutral?

 

[Champane Flight]

Deserve better.

I came from a military family, my Father spent 35 years in the Navy. Fought in WW-2, Korea, and several other small conflicts. My brother spend twenty years in the Army. My little hitch isn't even a drop compared to their service. I enlisted in 67, gung ho and full of BS. I followed my country blindly, with one motto "My country right or wrong, I will fight for it!" , I can still hear my father saying those words. I still believe that, to a point.



I saw children begging in the streets while we supported the rich. I saw young women turned into ****** because it put rice on the table. I saw hundreds of brave men put into the meatgrinder, just to satisfy one officers quest for glory. I saw a inteligence community that by NO means was inteligent. I saw most of what I was taught about America erode and fall into lies.



I also saw Bravery beyond all belief, young men and women sacrifice everything for another and a large lump in my heart grow everytime I watched our flag being raised.



I came home to a nation in turmoil, mainly because the truth was being told by many vets. Not their faults, it had to be said. It didn't make me feel anything, I couldn't feel anymore. I was just glad to be home. If a soldier lets someone or something as petty as some college kid protesting get under his skin, he is not much of a soldier. Anyway, when I got back I joined them. It was a good way to meet women and get stoned. They didn't understand either.



I was greeted well when I got back. I was only attacked once and retaliated to the effect of a broken nose for some misguided soul in the SF airport. The MPs escorted me to my plane home and gave me a thumbs up. I came home and of course my family and friends were all glad to see me.



Then came the real battle, some of my buddys were trying to get help from the VA and I joined in to help. This is where I saw the true nature of the beast. Hospitals in poor shape, under staffed, people in the system that did not belong, and benefits being denied because of paper snafus or some idiot not wanting to work or help .



Then came the alcoholism, drug addiction, and broken marrages. The shakes everytime I heard a loud noise, the dreams, and the guilt of coming home in one peice.



I have seen the flag being waved and young men and women go to war, come home to a grateful nation and then forgot. A warrior is only important in a war I guess. What peaves me is that the same people that wave and profess loyality and so called backing of the troops are the same that forget them afterwards!



I am not "Putting down America" or her leaders. I am questioning the present foreign policy that has brought us to this point and is just about to put us over the edge. I do back our service men and women to the utmost, not by saying "You go", but by saying " Hurry home, use your head, and keep your head down". That and trying to change a system that forgets and ignores its vets at every turn. I cannot change America or her policys, but I can voice my opinions and will fight for her. I feel that I am still fighting for my country by speaking out! We need to tell our leaders we are watching them and they are not the ones in charge! This is the time to speak out, not after we are mired in war!

 

[sdalton]

CF, well spoken. You have been through some troubled times. It is a shame that the VA hospitals are not run better. My mother worked in one briefly, in the 70's. She hated the way they were run. She too said most people working there were lazy, and just there to collect a check. I too would like to question why the U. S. does some of the things it does, and sometimes they sound iffy. I dont think that this is one of those times. It seems that most of the world is behind the actions that are unfolding against Iraq, and my guess is that a lot more is going on behind the scenes than we are told. This president is one that does not let the media know our military strategy every time we are about to act. This is a good thing. The same thing happened during WWII.

Loose Lips Sink Ships, and all that stuff. I trust the President, and the world seems to be doing the same.

 

[Champane Flight]

Let it be..

Let it be on the worlds shoulders if Iraq is invaded. Have you ever had a gut feeling? I have this gut feeling that this president is not being honest with the American people. Show us pictures of these weapons of mass destruction, we don't need to know where or when they plan to take them out. He says he has evidence, show us! Give me ONE good reason to believe what he is saying. Even during the Cuban missle crisis the goverment showed the missle sites in Cuba.



He says one of the hijakers met with a high ranking official from Iraq, still not quite a smoking gun. Yet eight of the hijackers were from Saudi, we are not policing them. Saudis still have schools teaching their children it is OK to kill Americans and that Al queda is a noble cause! When asked why their goverment does not act against these teachers, they reply "We don't want to anger our religious leaders!"..... They also have many weapons of mass destruction (we sold them). Are we threatening them? Our goverment has NO clue of what, who, or how to fight our present enemy! This administration has not earned my trust and gets farther from it everyday. If you are going to put my grandsons and daughters in harms way you better come up with better evidence than this.

 

[BFC]

Beleive me I'm no fan of the Saudis, BTW 15 out of 19 highjackers were Saudis but when was the last time the Saudis invaded somebody? Use wepons of mass destruction on their own people? Executed hundreds of their citizen without trials? Try to assinate a US president? Asnwer to all of those is, not in recent history. We can't control what they teach in Saudis schools anymore that we would accept ANYDODY telling us what to teach in ours. It's our jobs to keep them out the US tho, which we're still not doing.



You keep saying show me proof of weapons of mass destruction? Saddam says he has none, so I guess Bush must be lying then We should have wacked him in 91 but we didn't and the region is still paying for it. To think that he has not pursued WMD in the last 11 years, while inspectors were finding stuff every day until he trew em' out 5 years ago, then went unchecked for 5 years is naive at best.



Cuban missile crisis was different times, everybody was shocked that we had satellite pics, nobody does this stuff in the open anymore. So I guess we burn(and kill) the intelligence assets that are feeding us the info so we can "SHOW" the proof to the American public? Every high ranking Iraqi that defected, including a lot of scientist, are saying the do have WMD programs.



Past history tells us that he has them, used them and tried to improved them or get better ones. I say the burden of proof is on him not us. UN visited 5 sites yesterday, they said "We did not find any signs of recent activity at ONE of them... ... ... ..... no comments on the other 4... ... ... ... ..... "



I think we're on the right track.



Glenn

 

[QRTRHRS]

CF, very good summation on Vietnam. I am glad I lucked out, when my unit finished up artillery school, we went to Korea and Germany. I had three close friends who came home only to not be able to face up to their demons and kill themselves. I know of other cases but none I knew closely.



Other than the men who volunteered, most who fought that war were "hicks, spics and ******s" serving under more than one officer who was in the field to make rank and did not know his butt from a hole in the ground. Thank god their were some who did know. That said, and by the way, I did not use that phrase to be derogatory, that is just the way it was, look at our military today. All volunteer true, but largely made up of men and women who opted for service due to a lack of opportunity otherwise.



I wonder then, if this comes to pass, will they be able to hopefully come home and be truly rewarded for their courage? Will the people who make the materials to wage this war offer them gainful employment?



One more point: This is not the same as the Cuban Missle Crisis. Adelade Stevensen cannot stand at the UN and whip out those pictures of missle silo's. This is more of a high stakes poker game. George Bush needs to keep a straight face and not show his hand (and I believe and hope he does have a good hand) until all the cards have been laid out.

 

[RonaldLarson]

Champagne

How can you have a "gut feeling", when you have no guts?

You are so out of touch with reality, that nothing you read from makes any sense. You are a product of socialist propoganda, and frankly, your rants are becoming quite humorous. Please leave the serious discussions of world events to those of us whom are qualified.

Remember 9-11-01?

Ron

 

[Champane Flight]

You can do better...

Geez Ol Ronny, I thought you could do better than that. Maybe you forgot your metemucil this morning. Feeling a little pent up? I am hoping (for the worlds sake) that people like yourself are not in the majority. If they are we are in for one loud pop when you pull your heads out from the brown orfice!



Nobody gets it? I am not saying we shouldn't protect ourselves or wage war against terror. I am saying we are fighting the wrong people! It does not take a rocket scientist to figure this one out. The ONLY resons for going into Iraq is to take our minds (the American people) off of the slowdown in the war, clean up Daddys mess, and get a little free oil. No smoking gun and no WMDs, just a broken down old dictator with a bunch of palaces and blown up weapons plants. Maybe Bush has bigger plans for Iraq, maybe he wants to make it into a Middle eastern Disneyland? Or make it one giant military base to whup on the middle east?



We have spy planes flying over Iraq 24/7 , what have we found? This has nothing to do with cards, it is a third, fourth rate nation, if that, why would we have to play cards with them? We could anialate the whole country with air power if we wanted. If Bush had anything, why didn't he show it to the world? Something is fishy here. Give us the real reason, were big kids now Bush.

 

[sdalton]

CF, I do agree, somewhat with Ol Ron. Go figure. I do agree with you a very very little. I do agree the Saudi government is our enemy. They just are not as big an enemy as others. There are bigger fish to fry. I do like your idea to turn Iraq into a military base. Maybe you should forward your idea to the BUsh administration. I dont think it should just be american, but a U. N. military base. Use the takeover and occupation as a lesson to all evil countries and leaders to behave, or they will have their country taken away from them. Kind of like children with toys.

 

[Jumbo Jet]

I guess our best policy would be to just let Saddam and all other "Jew" hating people develop serious WMD and use it in Israel, maybe NY, and he!! if they have time, try it out on the "High Plains of Colorado" just for effect!



I don't think our government tells us everything. I also don't think Bush has played all his cards. I do believe that as President of the US we need to give him that opportunity that we would have even given BC. Too many people wanting Instant Results along with their Instant Pudding, Instant Coffee, and Instant Sex.



He seems a little anxious to me to get the bombs flying. Is that just rhetoric or speech to be taken serious.



The media is being used as an instrument in this "war" too, just as in Desert Storm.



Are terrorsits a threat? Yes! Are there terrorists in Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Egypt, Syria, Israel, US, Yemen, Qatar, Afghanistan, Russia, Pakistan, Turkmenistan... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... . YES! YES! YES!



Where are the most dangerous terrorists today? I hope someone knows and it doesn't have to be me.



As far as I am concerned, the only good terrorist is a dead terrorist.



The US made terrible mistakes in the past. Not prepared for WWII. Did not consider the Japanese to be a threat to the US. My Dad spent 42 months as a "guest" of the Japanese because our government did not consider them a threat and was not prepared to protect the US soldiers in Bataan and Corregidor! He died at an early age because of medical problems related to 42 months of beatings, disease, and starvation.



Our enemies should be declared and put on notice. I think Bush is doing just that.



Otherwise, we need to close the doors and lock out the rest of the world and let them have at it! I don't think we can do that.



God Bless America, our soldiers, our citizens, our freedoms (that remain), our elected officials - Amen!

 

[Lhotka]

The U.S. Senate; Love it or leave it

Originally posted by ol ron

Bill Clinton isn't president anymore, and Tom "puff" Daschle is history.

Love it or leave it!!!!!

Ron

And Lott too!!!!

 

[illflem]

If we had stepped in and did weapons inspections in Germany after WW I could WW II have been avoided?

 

[QRTRHRS]

Originally posted by illflem

If we had stepped in and did weapons inspections in Germany after WW I could WW II have been avoided?

Not sure but I believe the was some monitoring going on. Hitler did as much as he could in secret but eventually became much more blatent. Still, he did not have enough time or resourses to complete what his "advisors" wanted. They did not want to start the war when he did, feeling they were not ready. The lack of equipment was the reason for the "blitzkrieg".



When I see TV documentaries or read about WWII, I have to wonder the outcome if they had an unlimited arsenal.

 

[baby.driver]

I Believe in Bush

I believe Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone



" " Timothy Mc Veigh " "



" " The Warren Report



" " the Branch Dividians had machine guns



" " the EPA has the peoples best interests in mind



" " strip searching pregnant women in airports makes everyone safer



I believe in the tooth fairy



" " Santa Claus



" " the USA stands for truth, justice, and liberty