do I need the ho cummins

[R.Taylor]

With the HO option you're paying $2695 more for not that much more HP or torque. You get the Aisin trans with the HO but I've read that it can have a mind of it's own when it comes to shifting. I believe the HO is for people who tow heavy often if not daily. They do drink a little more fuel but we're not really buying these rigs for fuel economy. When I ordered my 2019 I pondered the HO option but since I'm only towing 20% of the time and generally unloaded I opted for the standard output. I also WAS concerned about the CP4.2 pump but now it's not even a worry, I run Optilube XPD with every fill-up to replace the lubricity that's missing from ULSD and I never let the gauge go below a 1/4 tank. If my CP4.2 fails I'm not worried..... I'll let MaxCare and or my insurance company figure it out.... I have every single fuel receipt since day one dated with the mileage written down. If your looking at the 2020 trucks.... They now offer a optional 50 gallon fuel tank for a measly $295 more on the build sheet.... Sheesh man, I just spent $1295 on a aftermarket Titan 50 gallon tank.

Like Elephantrider said... You can always get a CP3 kit for it from Industrial Injection for $100 more of the cost of upgrading to the HO if the pump bothers you..... $2795.

https://www.industrialinjection.com/product/6-7l-cummins-cp4-to-cp3-conversion-kit/


When my 2019 3500 LO SRW was delivered I started the "CP4.2 Owners Club" thread here on TDR.... Well, I just checked and it's on page 17 of the forum threads now with the last comment made on 12/4/19. There's people here with the CP4.2 pump that have close near 20k on them with no issues and I can't find a mention of a failure of one on a Ram.

I would not loose sleep over the pump...

 

[gsbrockman]

You are giving general information.... not saying it's not true, just like you to point us to ALL the failures CP4s are having on Rams, including destruction of the fuel system is all I'm asking. I don't have one, but would in a heartbeat if my 2017 Ram 5500 got totaled or stolen.

I'm just like everyone else, I want to see actual failures.

Cheers, Ron

“Noise from the bleachers” comes to mind......

 

[Cummins12V98]

"Maybe look for a clean 2016-2018. I say 2016 as they gain front park sense and ability to move cameras around on displays. AND YOU would still have a CP-3 injection pump!"

You took most of the words out of my mouth.

Personally would not let the CP-4 sway me as there is a 100k warranty to cover it and with well over a year on the market with no reported failures.

I would go for a 18 and would have part of the warranty left. 3500, SRW, LB, AISIN, 4x4, LongHorn and factory rear air!!! I would say that would be the golden egg!

 

[Tuesdak]

The automotive industry refuses to learn from the competitors expensive mistakes and is more than happy to experience them first hand with your wallet. The CP4 is clearly coming from behind with a PROVEN failure record on other OEM diesels. GM, the undisputed king of unreliable diesels, dropped the CP4. The class action lawsuits on other OEM's CP4's should open your eyes. One should figure out what a CP4 is before owning one. It has a track record of making you aware of what it is and how much it costs in downtime, repair bills, and some had a nasty warranty fight over fuel quality. Warranty with "fuel quality is your problem" is questionable at best. Then you can make a better informed decision knowing they didn't change anything to make it reliable on the Cummins over the other OEM disasters. Noise from the bleachers also hasn't posted any improvements made to the cheap CP4 design for Cummins: not one. Sadly, Cummins has their head buried in the sand on this one. Hopefully it doesn't turn into the excuse FCA needs to drop in an "in house" diesel because no one appears to give a damn about reliability from automotive class diesel. Just look at the new throwaway garbage diesel engine designs GM is putting out yet again.

Regardless I voted with my money over the CP4 and got a new 2018 vs. a new 2019. So far the Etch a Sketch 12" screen problems others have make me glad I did. I only regret not having a front camera option for parking.

I suggest you drive both transmissions and decide if there is a difference. Moving from a NV5600 manual I felt the Aisin was in the proper gear and was able to "get out of it's own way" with the HO setup better than the 2019 or 2108 standard engines and 68RFE. I seriously was unimpressed to the point of not wanting a new truck over the damned lag when you slap the go pedal down. The HO Aisin I could live with: IMO less lag. It's still not let the clutch out and we are moving NOW by any means.

The Aisin does have some roughness figuring out where 1st gear is and can slam the lower gears now and then. Shifting from 2nd to 1st on a grade can rev up and chirp the tires unless you drive around it and feather the throttle until it grabs 1st. It's not a show stopper, but, could use some refinement that FCA hasn't yet figured out with the Aisin.

 

[Wiredawg]

Still no references to CP4 failures in Cummins equipped Rams. Since no one can provide OP these specific issues, OP may just have rely on posted, verified experiences of actual 2019/ 2020 Ram owners.

Cheers, Ron

 

[AH64ID]

Time will tell on the CP4, but initial reports are better than I expected.

I am also in the club of buying an ‘18’s to avoid the ‘19 and still happy with that decision. The 12” screen is avoidable in the Laramie trim, but I have none of the Aisin programming issues the ‘19+ trucks have.. or the more common auto-level issues. Or the much higher DEF use rate, which based on the compression ratio should be higher on the SO.

Personally I wouldn’t buy a 68. I know they work for most of the people that buy them, but then again so do Fords. I want the Aisin for 2 reasons, a true MD trans and the power. Coming off a very powerful 5.9 I couldn’t justify the cost of a new truck to lose power. At the weights I run, 18-24K GCW, my stock ‘18 just barely keeps up with the ‘05 on long grades. 95-98% load vs 93-95%.. same grade, speed and weight. I don’t think I could do that with a lower rated 68 truck, and I’d be pissed or spending more money or both. The hp difference isn’t huge, but that’s at rated rpm. The torque difference is much bigger and in the normally used rpm range.

But for the OP it might not be an easy decision. The AISIN doesn’t operate the same when shifting and the 3.73’s will have a different rpm for grades, something else I wouldn’t like at highway speeds but it might work well for your speeds. Low speeds and acceleration would be better thou, and I tow in all of the mentioned scenarios. I’m still happier with 3.42’s than I would be with 3.73’s. I’d also prefer 4.10’s over 3.73’s.

Just my 0.02, YMMV.

 

[Elsbury]

I'm a lurker but this thread really interested me as I'm currently contemplating a 2019 Mega cab to replace my 06 quad cab with 140,000 miles. The truck I'm looking at has the aisin with the H.O cummins and 410 gears. Do you guys think this a good combo? Its also a dually. My 06 pulls my current fifth wheel just fine but I'm starting to worry about the TIPM isues and the general overall condition of my truck. I also saw a youtube vid that said Ram was smart enough to put a lift pump on the new trucks so maybe thats why no problems yet?

 

[AKDoug]

I'm extremely happy with my HO and Aisin. Towed 22K today (at the very limit of SRW 3500) with zero issues. 15K with this thing is crazy easy.

 

[Hoefler]

That’s correct. To get one, you get the other.

In correct. The standard out put Cummins is available with the 68RFE or the Aisin. It is correct the HO will automatically get the HD Aisin.

 

[Hoefler]

I tow an 18K fifth wheel with my HO Max Tow Ram, the milage diffence from my 2014 is only .3 mpg less over the same routes I have been in the past. The flip side is, it will hold gears better and the and the performance is unreal!

 

[dieselshadow]

In correct. The standard out put Cummins is available with the 68RFE or the Aisin. It is correct the HO will automatically get the HD Aisin.

Incorrect sir, unless you are referencing 45/5500 trucks. But that’s not what the OP is after. Only the C&C trucks have a lower output Cummins with the Aisin.

 

[Hoefler]

You might ought to check your information, you can build and order an Aisin with the standard output Cummins. Dealers don't like to order them that way because of the difference in price and the uninformed public shops price rather than looking at what they are getting for their money.

 

[dieselshadow]

You can’t “build one” on Ram’s website like that. I seriously doubt you can order one with a SO/Aisin combo. Never seen one listed, can’t build one, nor has anyone ever reported owning this combo. It’s an odd duck. I don’t see that as a real possibility. If so, can you show us please?

 

[Hoefler]

Just built one

 

[skorski]

my 2014 had the aisin with the standard cummins we orded it that way

 

[dieselshadow]

Just built one

Can you show us? I can’t seem to pull that off. It keeps changing it to a mutual package as stated before.

 

[dieselshadow]

my 2014 had the aisin with the standard cummins we orded it that way

But the question is can you do that now?

 

[TFucili]

Just tried to build a 3500. When you select the Std Cummins, you get a popup that tells you there was a change, which is the 68RFE. Then, if you select the Aisin you get another popup saying the engine has changed.

Then, started over, and went right from the base 6.4/ZF to selecting the Aisin, and it forces the HO.

 

[Newsa]

With the HO option you're paying $2695 more for not that much more HP or torque. .

When I bought my 2013 new off the lot in Sept 2013, the Cummins was a $7000+ option. Now the Cummins is a $9000+ option. The Aisin transmission was always a $2000+ option. Maybe the Aisin went from a $2295 option to a $2695 option? Or maybe the price of that HO option remained constant? It is a slightly more beefed transmission to handle the higher torque HO option that is now over 1000 ft lbs. (I hear). It sounds like price inflation did not affect the price of the Aisin option as much as it affected the rest of the truck?

Anyone remember what the Aisin option cost in 2013-2014?

Maybe they kept the price of the Aisin/HO option down because they hope to sell more?

 

[gsbrockman]

Just built one

Lots of idiosyncrasies on the RAM build site.....some that take quite a while to ever get corrected.

The short story is.......RAM does not build an SO Cummins with the AS69RC in the 3500 pickup series.