Engine lope 2006 Dodge ram 5.9 only in park or neutral.

[Sheepdog263]

I recently purchased a 2006 Dodge Ram 2500 with the 5.9 Cummins engine. It has 186,000 miles and an Edge tuner with Juice(the cables to update the unit appeared to have never been used so I updated it last night too). The engine runs smooth(well for a diesel) while idling in drive and haven't really noticed any issues going down the road. However, when it's in park or neutral it lopes pretty bad. It don't appear to be as bad cold but gets worse as it warms up. I read some other posts and saw comments that the tuner can cause it so I unplugged it from under the dash and didn't see any difference. Other things I have noticed, the tachometer is only reading around 500 at an idle in park and according to the temperature gauge it takes forever to warm the engine up. It's about 30deg here and last night it had idled for about a half an hour and the gauge barely moved. I eventually put it in drive to idle to get the engine temperature to normal. Any tips or ideas? Could the Throttle Position sensor do this? No check engine lights either.

 

[p-Bar]

At 186k your injectors could be on there way out. A good shop will have the equipment to check the injectors while running. Also check rail pressures

 

[Tuesdak]

Lope... smooth for a diesel is an excuse. It ain't running right, period. Go drive another Cummins to know how they should run.

You have to "flash" the ECM back to stock: unplugging the tuner won't do that. It still has the tune in the ECM.

Lope: does the RPM vary or is it "missing"?

RPM varies would be a bad FCA on the CP3 or high pressure leak say via worn injectors returning too much fuel.

Missing can be a bad injector not fireing. Wire loose etc.

Any smoke in the exhaust? Color and when?

Do fix it, NOW rather than drive it and "hope". Engine damage may result depending on what is going on.

 

[p-Bar]

Agree with Tuesday. Also since this truck is new to you it would be a good idea where you stand with it. The injection system is the most important and costly part of the truck. It needs a check up.

 

[cerberusiam]

Unload any tunes that were loaded and set it back to stock first.

A lope is somewhat normal when cold but it should never do it warm. Could be several things in the fuel system, most likely the FCA, so some testing is needed. What you might do is an injector cleaning then does the tank heavy with an additive like Power Service and some 2SO thne drive the tank out, preferably toting something relative heavy.

The engine won't warm just sitting there idling, it needs a load to warm faster. You can use the idle up feature to help warm up but driving is still the fastest way to load the engine.

The 06's are notorious for breaking solder joints in the cluster and you get things like 500 rpm idle or 3200 rpms going down the road at normal speed. It could actually be 500 rpms and then it would lope, or it could be false reporting. You would need to validate rpm's with tach to make sure.

 

[p-Bar]

The lope when idling could be the grid heater coming on as it will drag the engine down momentarily. Turn on your dome lights and see if it dims when it lopes.

 

[Regcabguy]

Mine was loping so the shop I use told me to use a qt of synthetic 2-stroke.
My FCA was sticking and the 2-stroke cured it in less than a half hour.

 

[Sheepdog263]

Thanks for all the replies. I added half a bottle of Hot Shot secret to the tank and now the idle in park is better but not cured. There doesn't appear to be any smoke while its idling either before I added the hot shot or after.I also drove it to Kentucky yesterday for a family function and to try and clean it out and noticed a new symptom. Going uphill or downhill theres a surge. Especially downhill when you let up on the pedal. I ordered a new FCA and will update if that was the cure. As for the high idle the manual and videos I've watched said to set the park brake and turn on the cruise etc but that don't work. I did however see it do it on it's own? Only one time though. The tachometer appears to be accurate too as it dont run too high or jump around. About 2200 at 70mph.

 

[Ozymandias]

If it is cold enough it will high idle by itself, you can also switch on the exhaust brake for warm up if you have one.

High idle usually needed to be enabled by a dealer. That feature wasn't active from factory. To my knowledge.

Did you reset the ECM to stock now with the Edge Tuner?

 

[p-Bar]

Smarty engages high idle via cruise control.

 

[GrantP]

My 06 will idle up to 1k rpm when it's cold enough all on it's own, no tuner, no buttons to push. Leave it in park and it will idle up by itself.

As mentioned, the tachometer on the 06's are pretty notorious for having problems with the circuit board and giving errant readings. Mine will sometimes do it at idle but not often. When it is flaking out it will read 500 rpms at idle, but once driving it's accurate so don't put too much faith in the tach. Search youtube for a bunch of repair videos.

None of that fixes your lope/surge problem. Testing the injectors, FCA, and using some additive in the fuel are all good suggestions. Adding a rail pressure gauge may also help you diagnose the problem.

 

[cerberusiam]

Idle up feature should be enables on an auto truck from the dealer. To test place in park, turn cruise on, tap the set button. Engine should idle up to 1100 rpms, accel\decel buttons will raise lower roms between 1100 and 1500 rpms.

This is not to be confused with high idle feature which is always there in programming and only idles up to 1000 rpms. The idle up feature is driven off the PTO controls in the ECM and does require a neutral safety switch or clutch switch to work.

 

[CVR222NV]

Idle up feature should be enables on an auto truck from the dealer. To test place in park, turn cruise on, tap the set button. Engine should idle up to 1100 rpms, accel\decel buttons will raise lower roms between 1100 and 1500 rpms.

This is not to be confused with high idle feature which is always there in programming and only idles up to 1000 rpms. The idle up feature is driven off the PTO controls in the ECM and does require a neutral safety switch or clutch switch to work.

Does the idle up feature work on a manual truck?

 

[seafish]

Does the idle up feature work on a manual truck?

IIRC, the high idea feature using cruise control buttons CAN in fact be enabled on a manual truck by using a jumper wire in the ECM harness and enabling the feature with a programmer.

 

[cerberusiam]

Yes it will. The idle up feature needs to be activated and turned on in the ECM and you have to ground pin 22 on the ECM B connector, IIRC. (It is the PTO sense wire on the b connector pin out.) Idle up on the manuals was NOT activated by dealer unless a clutch switch was installed, that cost to much so they just did not do many of them.

 

[cerberusiam]

Yes it will. The idle up feature needs to be activated and turned on in the ECM and you have to ground pin 22 on the ECM B connector, IIRC. (It is the PTO sense wire on the b connector pin out.) Idle up on the manuals was NOT activated by dealer unless a clutch switch was installed, that cost to much so they just did not do many of them.

 

[Sheepdog263]

I know it's been a while since I updated the post sorry.
I have been using hot shot secret with every fill up and it has smoothed out the loping some but it still has random problems and I blame it on the tuner?
The tuner doesn't work all the time upon startup(I also updated it again a couple months ago). It says it can't connect to the juice and then shuts off. I have unplugged it from the obd2 outlet and also both wires on the back of the box and plugged them back in and it still won't work. Then again sometimes it will come on and work fine or show the gauges but will be locked up(frankly I hate the thing!).
Other engine symptoms I'm having is stumbling (engine not missing but like its winding up a little at a time)while accelerating onto the interstate.
All of this stuff is random. It may drive fine for a while and then these issues. I will never buy another truck with a tuner. Costs too much to replace and half as much to get the ECM flashed back to stock. The tuner is an Edge with attitude. Anyone have any suggestions?

 

[Sheepdog263]

Also, Does the tuner when its working correctly have the rail pressure on it?

 

[Killer223]

it's likely the Edge isn't the one that flashes a tune to the ECU. it'll have it's own wires and box under the hood that piggy back onto the factory harness for the injectors.
turn the edge to 0.
you don' t have manual high idle unless it's been enabled by a dealer or smarty. it'll auto idle up for a minute or two to try and maintain coolant temps.

can you get a video of the lope? upload it to youtube or here.
could be the AC compressor kicking on and off if dash in in defrost.
could be grid heaters kicking on and off.
with the speed changing, it could be an APPS.
could be stock lift pump struggling to keep up.
lets hear it. go from there.

 

[Sheepdog263]

I will get a video as soon as I can. Its not the A/C it begins to we will call sputter. Like a miss at idle only in park or neutral. Smooth as silk in drive. There is a box connected to the ecm under the hood. I cleaned all the contacts on the plug to the juice box I assume it is and put dielectric grease on it too. I had it on the interstate earlier and ran it 90mph for a minute hoping the load and hot shot might clean the injectors some but didn't notice any difference. When accelerating and the letting off the pedal it stumbles too. Kinda feels like a jerking but its all engine not transmission related. I took a lot of training to work on diesel and most engines in vocational school but that was before all the sensors and computer controls. I could tear it down and totally rebuild the engine but am lost at the electronics now. I'm thinking about rebuilding the injectors and replacing the connector tube and see what that does. There is a lot of talk about the valve cover gasket having the injector wire harness implemented into it and it has a history of failing. I replaced the fuel control actuator and didn't change anything. I asked the guy at advance if it had a tps and he checked and said it did. One was in stock so I bought it for $200 lol and after researching it appears it doesn't have one or uses the gas pedal type. It runs smooth other than the intermittent problems I'm having.