FCA or Hole in piston?

[Cummins724]

Truck is 04. 5 CTD. Truck has been down on power for some time now, but not weak, just not right. We been getting blowby out the breather & uses 1 gallon/week travelling 400-500 miles week. We drove the truck to work last week & shut it down, got back into the truck after work & it had a very rough idle & white smoke. Had injectors tested, all 6 were weak, thought we found the problem. Put 6 new bodies in and still the same. ChugChugChug and some white smoke at idle, not alot but it is there. Could the FCA cause this or am I just wasting time changing it before I tear it apart. If I do have to tear it apart what should I do differently. I have a bad feeling in my wallet.

 

[dan.poitras]

Do a cylinder cutout test and when that cylinder stops smoking you've got your culprit.

Or as we used to do in the old days, remove your exhaust manifold (block off turbo oil supply of course) and run engine and you will see which cylinder is smoking and / or drooling oil.

One gallon of oil per 500 miles is way excessive. Probably a scored cylinder.

 

[dclassens]

Just curious,but why do all the work to diagnose those problems when the next step is the same for all results? Let me clarify, if you have a hole in the piston or if you have let say #4 cylinder scored, you still need head off and rebuild process to start. MY opinion, pull head and start rebuild. you will be time and money ahead of doing cylinder cut out and then head off.

 

[Shadrach]

Pull the oil filter and cut it open. For those who have never cut a filter open, you use a filter cutter - it's like a large version of the pipe cutting tool you use for plumbing- and cut the nut plate off. Remove the element and cut a section of the media out with a knife. With several rags to catch the oil stick it in a vise and "squeeze " it out. Then spread it out and look for shinny things. :-laf Different materials, aluminum, copper etc come from different parts of the engine helping to determine what failed. See if any of the material is magnetic. Shadrach

 

[Cummins724]

I want to figure out the cause for the rough idle, chugging white smoke thing before just tearing into the internals. The truck idled perfect & drove great, shut the truck off, got back in it & have a very rough idle & white smoke.

 

[BLNRAY]

before you start tearing down, maybe do a compression test

 

[HBarlow]

If you're using one gallon of lube oil in 400-500 miles of driving I'm afraid a teardown is in your future.

I'm no mechanic so could be completely wrong.

 

[Cummins724]

We plan on a rebuild this winter, but for now I want to find the issue with the truck chugging & blowing white smoke before installing a new engine.

 

[champspa]

the vacuum pump sucking air can cause excessive blow by, it's discharge is in the crankcase.

 

[Cummins724]

the vacuum pump sucking air can cause excessive blow by, it's discharge is in the crankcase.

No vacuum pump on 3rd gen trucks.

 

[Cummins724]

Tonight, we changed the FCA to rule that out. Nothing changed. Then we removed the turbo/exhaust manifold & fired it up. No. 6 cylinder rolls the white smoke out constantly as the rest of the cylinders puff smoke. We are going to swap the #6 injector with a different cylinder to rule that out, then its off with the head.

 

[HBarlow]

I've never holed or scored one but I've always read here on TDR that the #6 runs hotter and is more likely to score under extreme conditions.

 

[Cummins724]

I've never holed or scored one but I've always read here on TDR that the #6 runs hotter and is more likely to score under extreme conditions.

I'm hoping to pull the head today after work & post pics of the damage.

 

[Cummins724]

We switched the injectors & problem is still there... #6 cylinder smokes like a train. We are unbolting the head now... not looking good.

 

[HBarlow]

I'm sorry for your bad news but will be interested in seeing photos of the damage.

 

[Cummins724]

The cylinders all look good, but #6 has minor scratches from where a piece of the headgasket broke off scratching the wall. Can't even grab the scratch with your fingernail. The head is at the machine shop getting fluxed, flattened & freshened. Here are pics.



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[rscurtis]

I would say from looking at your pictures, you have some broken or stuck rings.

 

[dclassens]

Sorry about your luck. :{ I had a feeling that this was the outcome by the way I read your earlier posts. My job deals with lots(80-100) older model tractors. JD 1020, 2020, 2240, 2440, 2550, and many more. When there is an issue, all that diagnose time just runs labor rate up. I can have head off, pistons and liners out in an hour. As long is crank is okay, mains go in while rods are at machine shop. Long story short, sometimes when the problem is inside, only one way in. There would be a huge difference if you have an engine with individual heads. Hope all turns out good.

dave

 

[Cummins724]

I would say from looking at your pictures, you have some broken or stuck rings.

I don't know if you can see it, but the fire ring on the headgasket had a piece missing & that is what scratched the cylinder. It is hard to see in the photo.



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[Cummins724]

When I learned to build engines, I was taught that a scratch in a cylinder wall was fine as long as you can't grab it with your fingernail. I'm not sure if that was correct or not because I always would have bored or sleeved if any mark was in the cylinder. Anyone care to explain?