Filter Changes with Bio-Diesel

[Tony T.]

If or when you decide to go to bio-diesel do you need to increase the change out time on your fuel filter. I know at first when you switch over to bio theres a possibly of changing out the filter 2 or 3 three times due to the cleaning affect of bio. I've never tried bio-diesel and have always changed my fuel filter at 10K intervals since truck was new with no problems at all between intervals with regular #2 diesel, now here recently B20 bio-diesel has become available very close to me and I'm debating on trying it out. What about alternating fill-ups say you run bio 3 or 4 tanks and go to regular #2 diesel a couple tanks then back to bio. Just some questions I'm pondering over.



Also the mileage is it the same, better, or worse using the bio-diesel. Some of the testimonials I read on the Bio-Willie site are claiming 2 miles to the gallon gain. Some people I've talked to say bio-diesel reduces your mileage. What's the scoop from the one's that use bio on this site.



Tony

 

[Headshot zod]

I've heard a mixed bag on the mileage. Your truck doesn't seem too too old. I went through a few filters in the beginning. 1st tank B50 and and next few months on B100.

 

[DFerverda]

Tony you probably wont have any issue with B20. Give it a try, It will not clean out the tank as fast as b100 will. If you change your filter every 10k you should be fine.

If you opt to go to B100 I would recommend a FP gauge to let you know when it starts to fill up your filter with goop from your tank.

I run B40 this time of year without problems unless the temp drops to the single digits or below 0, like today, i was down to 1/4 tank i just filled to 3/4 with PD and when it warms up to 15 or 20 i will top off with BD.

After my initial startup with bd I had to change my filter after about 1k, but it got cold (10 deg f) and i was using b70 and it was plugging my filter, (got down to 4 lbs before i got to town to dump in a couple gallons of K1 and top off with PD) This cut the crud in my ff but changed it when i got the truck home, back to 15lbs on fp gauge.

My milage hase gone up some and the truck runs a lot quieter and smells real good(like a texas barbecue)!

Dirk

 

[SHobbs]

Tony,



Thought I would chime in here. I started with B20 before going to B100. I usually change my filter every 6k along with the oil and filter. I changed the filter @3k then again @3k. First filter change resulted in a dirty filter and some kind of white goo in the canister, the second time was much better and there was no goo this time. After the two changes I went to B100 and back to my usuall 6k interval. So far I have been runnning B100 for nearly a year with no problems as far as the filter or the way the truck runs.



My truck actually runs better on this stuff and is quieter, less pinging. Seems smoother and feels like it has more pep which is due to the higher cetane rating of bio. As far as mileage goes form running a few tanks and driving the same everytime as best I could I gained about 1mpg out of it. You do loose some power from running bio due to the fact is has 118,000 btu/gal compared to #2 @ 131,000 btu/gal, you gain lubricity which is nearly twice that of #2 as well as a higher cetane rating.



If you decide to run the b20 just keep running it, your cummins will love for it. No reason to go back and forth. I see you are in N. Texas and you should not have problems as far as the cold weather. I have had B100 in the tank with temps as low as 14* with no problems at all. Check out DFWbiodiesel.com they offer B20 and B100 at the pumps, there are a few of us here getting bio from them.

 

[Tony T.]

Guys thanks for the reply's on the bio, as I said here recently bio-diesel has become available pretty close to me at a Love's Truck Stop (Anna TX). It is the same price as the regular #2 diesel so this next fill up I may just have to try it out.



SHobbs last Friday I was in your neck of the woods. I bought a set of factory alloy wheels and tires off Ebay and the guy lived in Burleson where I picked them up. Also seen the new Cabela's that was recently built, but didn't have time to stop in and check it out looks nice from the outside though .



Hopefully this bio-diesel will take off around here and become more available at other locations if it is good as you all say it is.



Tony

 

[SHobbs]

Tony,



I know for Bobby at DFWbiodiesel he has some trouble keeping up with the demand and has run out at times. He says that the business has just exploded and has grown to be more than he expected. He is selling B100 for around $2. 35/gal the last time I filled up the B20 was running around $2. 49 the same as #2.

 

[Nate]

So Bio is not normally cheaper than regular diesel? Why run it?

 

[SHobbs]

Nate,



There have been some times that bio is higher but for the most part it has been the same. The last time I filled up Bobby finally had a seperate price for B100 it was . 14 cents cheaper per gallon than B20 which was the same as #2. I told him the B100 should be cheaper being there is no #2 in it. B100 was $2. 35/gal and B20 was $2. 49/gal.



For me I don't mind paying the extra from time to time due to the fact that it supports the farmers here at home and not the rich Arabs. Also the benefits from running this stuff is worth it to me. Higher cetane, more lubricity, better for the environment and it's renewable. IMHO I think it helps to keep the engine running longer and cleaner. The extra lubrication definitely won't hurt any pump and will hopefully keep them from premature failure. I have heard that the new ULSD will have a dramatic impact on the price and availablity and that some stations will need to have their inground tanks drained and cleaned before receiving the ULSD in order to sell it. They say that the new ULSD will meet all the specs of the previous #2 but who knows what that stuff will do to your pumps and whatnot.



For me I will B100 as long as I can get it and keep enjoying the benefits it gives me.

 

[Headshot zod]

Bio is cheaper when you make it yourself. If you buy it you can get up to . 99 cents back a gallon. So 3. 00 a gallon bio costs 2. 01 after you fill out the paperwork. Some places will price B20 at the same price as #2. But then you will only get . 20 cents back a gallon.



If you have never been an "early adopter", you are one when you buy biodiesel. So it will be expensive. However, if you prefer to buy foreign oil by all means go ahead its cheaper.

 

[Cattletrkr]

A measly B2 will clean out your tank in a tankful or two. I'd start with 5gals of B20 in a tankful of #2 and up that number. You will have to change your filter at least once. Run a couple tanks of a lower B mix and see what happens. Run a hundred gals of Bx and then change the filter. B20 on a fresh filter with a clean system should be trouble free. If you don't have a FP gauge, get one. Bio isn't bad, but ya don't wanna end up stranded with a plugged filter and end up hating bio because of it.



All of above simplified:

1. Run a couple tanks of lower %

2. Change fuel filter

3. Run B20

4. Thumb your nose at middle east oil

 

[Nate]

What places have Biodiesel at the pumps now? Is there a list maybe?



Nevermind... found a map



http://www.biodiesel.org/buyingbiodiesel/retailfuelingsites/default.shtm

 

[Headshot zod]

Thats a decent map. But you may want to try your state and biodiesel in a search. My biodiesel guy isn't on that list.

 

[Tony T.]

Nate,



There have been some times that bio is higher but for the most part it has been the same. The last time I filled up Bobby finally had a seperate price for B100 it was . 14 cents cheaper per gallon than B20 which was the same as #2. I told him the B100 should be cheaper being there is no #2 in it. B100 was $2. 35/gal and B20 was $2. 49/gal.



For me I don't mind paying the extra from time to time due to the fact that it supports the farmers here at home and not the rich Arabs. Also the benefits from running this stuff is worth it to me. Higher cetane, more lubricity, better for the environment and it's renewable. IMHO I think it helps to keep the engine running longer and cleaner. The extra lubrication definitely won't hurt any pump and will hopefully keep them from premature failure. I have heard that the new ULSD will have a dramatic impact on the price and availablity and that some stations will need to have their inground tanks drained and cleaned before receiving the ULSD in order to sell it. They say that the new ULSD will meet all the specs of the previous #2 but who knows what that stuff will do to your pumps and whatnot.



For me I will B100 as long as I can get it and keep enjoying the benefits it gives me.

The ULSD that SHobbs speaks of is suspose to be available summer 2006 for the public from my understanding. We have been using it at my work place since Sept 2004 and it has affected some of our older fleet of Ford pick-ups mostly the latter 90's and early 2000 models. The problem was leaking lift pumps (internal leaks with only alternative was to replace the lift pump). Our shop mechanics changed out serveral lift pumps on different trucks for awhile but I received no reports of injection pumps needing replaced. The cure for the problem was adding diesel fuel additive to our storage tanks and the problem leaking pumps ceased to exist there afterwards. So this ULSD is a dry fuel, the newer fleet of trucks was not affected by the ULSD fuel. Soon afterwards I started getting in the habit of adding a fuel additive at fill-up in preparation for the soon to be here ULSD to my personal truck. Mostly for a little added insurance even though my 03 is suspose to be compatible with the ULSD fuel. So the added lube of the bio-diesel can be nothing but a bonus to me and the fact it does help out our farmers. It is the same price as #2 diesel where I plan on trying it B20 that is.



Tony

 

[tgrfan2]

I've been running B20 in both my 12Vs since mid October. I had just changed FFs before that and carry a spare but have not needed one yet in 20K of driving. Both my trucks are averaging the same mileage (19-20) unloaded they do on summer #2. They are averaging 1-2mpg better on B20 than they did last year on winter #2(17-18). I haven't detected any significant difference in power but I am seeing a big reduction in smoke at WOT.

I just did a transmission upgrade and they recommended a 3K GSK and setting timing at 15. 5. I am wondering if I might be able to push the timing up a little more with B20. Unfortunately the supplier is down now. It seems a few Dmax customers were experiencing stumbling in our recent cold snap. The supplier put an additive in 7000 gal. of B20 and caused a problem for the rest of us!

 

[Nate]

Thanks for the tip. I found a place in Boise.

Thats a decent map. But you may want to try your state and biodiesel in a search. My biodiesel guy isn't on that list.

 

[Tony T.]

Yet another question, when using the regular #2 diesel I've been using a diesel additive "Power Service Diesel Kleen" (gray bottle). The first fill-up with the B20 bio-diesel I put in 17 gallons and did not add any additive, just yesterday I was in the area and topped off the tank with 13 gallons of the B20 with no additive added. My question is the fuel additives compatiable with the bio-diesel, another words I mostly used it for added lubriticy for the regular #2 diesel. If the bio has twice the lubritity of regular #2 and gives you a cleaner fuel system, I really see no need in using a additive with bio-diesel. Water separator should take care of any water present. I've never found any water present even before I started using a additive. Any thoughts.



Tony

 

[SHobbs]

Tony,



I stopped using an additive when I started running B100. IMHO why use an additve with the benefits you get. Now with that said it certainly won't hurt and if you don't mind paying to keep using an additive. As far as the water, they say that bio retains more water than #2, but I have not seen it yet. I think it all depends all the refinery and how well they make the bio. Even though bio is supposed tomeet all the specs of #2 each refiner has their own way of making it.



The bio I use seems to come from a good source being that I have no issues with water and I have had it down to 14* w/out any additives with no gelling issues. Some have had the bio they use turn almost to Crisco at around 25*, go figure. Thats why I say that even though it meets all the specs it still depends on how well its made and the producers attention to detail.



There was some discussion here about the CP3 and how it will handle bio and would it go belly up. Well I talked to a guy the other day running B100 in an 05 with 35k on the clock that has never seen #2 except for what was in the tank when he bought it. He told me he has had no problems with the engine at all and not in the shop once. Guess the CP3 likes it.

 

[PZech]

I jumped right in with B99 and had to change the filter after the first couple of tanks. I've noticed about a 2MPG drop in mileage and a significant drop in noise level. The price here in Tucson (enjoying the 80 degree winter weather) is about the same as regular #2. I'm willing to pay the little extra in mileage loss knowing I'm helping the environment and putting my money into the coffers of of the good old US of A!

 

[Tony T.]

So far I'm on the third tank of B20 and have not noticed any loss in mileage, pretty much the same as the regular #2 diesel as far as mileage goes on mine.



Tony

 

[Tony T.]

We took a trip yesterday down to South Texas to see my daughter, I fueled up first with the B20, this being the fourth tank. I made the round trip of 514. 9 miles running 65 to 70 mph on the interstate with some passing burst of 75mph or better, then about 70 miles of two-lane highway driving and a little bit of town driving. The conditions going down was pretty windy, a steady 20mph headwind with 30 mph gusting headwind. I fueled up this morning again with the B20 from the same pump and hand-calculated the mileage, I got 19. 3 mpg for the trip. The overhead showed 18. 2, so with the conditions I'm pretty happy with the B20. I have not yet changed out the fuel filter and so far have not had any indication of it needing replaced yet. It will be changed out in about 2500 miles unless it needs it before then.



Tony